Upgrading an Off Peak return to Anytime where SOR doesn't exist

[radamfi]

Suppose you have an Off Peak return and travel on a peak hour train where the ticket isn't valid. Penalty fares don't apply in these cases

6. An authorised collector must not charge a penalty fare to a person whose ticket is not valid only because of a published restriction, as described in condition 12 of the National Rail Conditions of Carriage.

So how is an excess charged, if there is no equivalent month validity Anytime return?

 

[yorkie]

what's the jouney?

 

[radamfi]

what's the jouney?

No particular journey in mind, but an example would be Didcot Parkway to London.

Off Peak Return exists at £22.30 but there is no month validity Anytime equivalent.

 

[yorkie]

If you upgrade a ticket type, the whole ticket is supposed to be excessed, not just one portion. So for same-day travel between Didcot and London the excess would be SDR (£46.70) - SVR (£22.30) = £24.40, however this excess costs more than the cost of an SDS at £24.00 therefore it is cheaper for you to buy a new ticket, and not use the rtn portion of the SVR. If you are travelling back a different day, that excess could not be cheaper, and given that it is higher than a new ticket, then the fact there isn't an excess doesn't really matter, as a new ticket is cheaper anyway.

Excesses are a lottery, so what would happen in reality could be quite different!

 

[radamfi]

If you upgrade a ticket type, the whole ticket is supposed to be excessed, not just one portion. So for same-day travel between Didcot and London the excess would be SDR (£46.70) - SVR (£22.30) = £24.40, however this excess costs more than the cost of an SDS at £24.00 therefore it is cheaper for you to buy a new ticket, and not use the rtn portion of the SVR. If you are travelling back a different day, that excess could not be cheaper, and given that it is higher than a new ticket, then the fact there isn't an excess doesn't really matter, as a new ticket is cheaper anyway.

Excesses are a lottery, so what would happen in reality could be quite different!

The scenario I am thinking is being caught on the train using the return portion. My guess is that you get charged the difference between 2 x SDS and the SVR.

 

[yorkie]

The scenario I am thinking is being caught on the train using the return portion. My guess is that you get charged the difference between 2 x SDS and the SVR.

No, because that is more than the cost of one SDS!

It should not be cheaper to not have a ticket than to have a ticket, and indeed the rules of excessing say that if a new ticket is cheaper than an excess then that should be issued instead. The cheapest option should be offered.

 

[radamfi]

No, because that is more than the cost of one SDS!

It should not be cheaper to not have a ticket than to have a ticket, and indeed the rules of excessing say that if a new ticket is cheaper than an excess then that should be issued instead. The cheapest option should be offered.

If that is the case, then it is always worth buying a SVR at all times as it would be cheaper than two singles if you are returning a different day.

 

[yorkie]

If that is the case, then it is always worth buying a SVR at all times as it would be cheaper than two singles if you are returning a different day.

Better value, yes, but not cheaper - at least, not cheaper for a one-off journey.

An Off Peak Day Single from Didcot to London is £19.90 and valid on the 0915 from Didcot, arriving 1009. An Anytime Day Single back is £24.00, the total is therefore £43.90.

However the Off Peak Return doesn't let you get into Paddington until the 1037 arrival (0953 from Didcot), and costs £2.40 more.

However for £2.40 more, you do get a return portion you can use another time, so it is better value to do that.