Sadly, I'm not talking about the cooling system, but the loco fleet. As of Monday DBS will be placing all Class 60s in to storage, this coincides with the end of the leaf fall RHTT period. All this week up to 4 Class 60s that were working were doing so despite already being in the storage pool. With the recession still biting, and the Class 66s and 67s proving very reliable, and desirable in a business sense, this has been coming for some time. I don't know if some will be warm and others cold storage. Lets just hope that DB will put a few better examples up for tender soon, rather than letting them rot first. As an aside, if the locos do become available for purchase, could this mean and end for the Colas 47s and the locos they hire? Class 66s are already infiltrating there. The only other buyer besides preservation could be Heavy Haul, but 60s aren't as reliable by some measure.
-
Our new ticketing site is now live! Using either this or the original site (both powered by TrainSplit) helps support the running of the forum with every ticket purchase! Find out more and ask any questions/give us feedback in this thread!
Bad news for 60 fans
- Thread starter mumrar
- Start date
- Status
Sponsor Post - registered members do not see these adverts; click here to register, or click here to log in
R
RailUK Forums
GNERman
Established Member
I wouldn't expect FLHH to take any, Colas could well take some or maybe Hanson Traction for hire. There could also be GBRf who seem to be taking every spare class 66 at the moment...
As for workings, what will take over the Jarrow - Lindsey oil working on the ECML, single or double class 66's?
As for workings, what will take over the Jarrow - Lindsey oil working on the ECML, single or double class 66's?
Donny Dave
Established Member
Freightliner won't be buying any of the 60s, as they are storing 66s themselves.
As for the 60s being tendered, the first ones to be put up for sale will be the likes of 006 and 081. IE, the ones that are never likely to run again anyway. Just don't expect them to be placed on a tender list for another five to 10 years.
As for the 60s being tendered, the first ones to be put up for sale will be the likes of 006 and 081. IE, the ones that are never likely to run again anyway. Just don't expect them to be placed on a tender list for another five to 10 years.
Was usually a single 66 as there isn't much space once at Jarrow for two
66s. Not good news.
37402
Member
- Joined
- 15 May 2007
- Messages
- 532
Nobody in their right mind would take a 60 in their present state (except for a certain preservationist). They are sh*gged. If anyone is after a heavy haul loco at the moment then all eyes will be on the Class 70.
GNERman
Established Member
yeah the class 70 will be prefered, or the new Potenta loco which is being offered by CSRE which re currently used in Asia, they just seem to be bigger, more powerful, lighter and uglier than the class 66, and finally the Voith Maxima...
MCR247
Established Member
- Joined
- 7 Nov 2008
- Messages
- 10,292
The Potenta loco comes with an in-cab fridge....Im sold!
I can picture you know, sat in the goods loop at Langham Junction, listening to the World Cup on radio, and drinking from a six pack of unfortunately soft drinks. Wonder if it could keep a tub of Ben and Jerrys cold enough for an hour too?
Great shame about the 60s. Potentially an excellent locomotive, it suffered from the British problem of being too sophisticated when other, less sophisticated alternatives were available. IMHO, not given a fair crack of the whip before it was written off as "unreliable". And much better looking than the 66s.
Old Timer
Established Member
Only a few weeks back DBS made an announcement after they ran a 36 wagon tank train from Lindsey to Kingsbury saying longer trains were the way to go etc......
In good condition a 60 can well outmatch a 66 and it is a big shame that on previous form it looks as if DBS will leave them until they are too costly to return to service and then presumably scrap them.
Thus variety in the Industry becomes much less. :cry::cry::cry:
In good condition a 60 can well outmatch a 66 and it is a big shame that on previous form it looks as if DBS will leave them until they are too costly to return to service and then presumably scrap them.
Thus variety in the Industry becomes much less. :cry::cry::cry:
Swift-Deere
Member
Is this how bad UK railways have become we have to import chinese tat
Why can't we build our own stuff or carry on getting imports from country that can actually build stuff and arnt communist like USA, Japan or Germany!!!
90019
Established Member
Can you show me a Chinese train currently working in the UK?
Where did the 70s come from? And the 66s? and the 67s?
What about the Turbostars and Electrostars? The Voyagers, Meridians, etc.?
Swift-Deere
Member
I said we import stuff from the US (70'S, Bombarder products) and Germany (Turbostars and electrostars)
Swift-Deere
Member
66 are built in Candida but EMD are a US company
*Stars are built in UK design/built whatever but bombardier is a Canadian owned company thus the *stars don't count as British Product
generalvegitable
Member
well those were bombardier which interestingly were once BREL so they would be a British company
37401
Established Member
after alot of buying and selling, under BREL they made good locos under Bombardier they make planes and trains for all different countries.
Its like EE EE became GEC and then a company called telent, just because one company becomes another doesnt mean its the same thing different name, IIRC Bombardier is a Candadian company not british, and has nothing to do with BREL
starrymarkb
Established Member
The Chinese have been coming for ages, as yet the only people interested in any is Grand Central (and then because they seem to be linked to the importer from what I can see). And for the short production runs (compared to consumer goods) shipping and import taxes for Non-EU goods (hence why Hitachi are planning a European plant) mean there isn't that greater saving over buying EU sourced trains (Bombardier UK/Siemens DE/CAF ES/Breda IT)
Also with the European trains components may still be made in the UK, eg the shoe gear for the Hamburg and Berlin S-Bahns is made in Somerset by Brecknell Wills
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---
Actually the *stars are British, as they are derived from BR designs with development starting under BREL (the plant has since been Swiss ABB, German DaimlerBenz/Adtranz and finally Bombarder though various mergers).
Bombardier are a true Multinational now, Transport is HQed in Germany and has plants in Derby, France, Kassel, Villeneuve (CH), Brugge (where the Voyagers were built based on SNCB designs) and many other locations...
Bombardier Derby have been involved in the development of the new units for Paris, so expertise is shared throughout Europe.
They also have a plant in Belfast (Shorts) who make a lot of components for their Aircraft (assembled in Canada)
Old Timer
Established Member
China has a number of very poor manufacturing cases to live down.
In the case of the railways, Chinese steel was purchased by a number of Countries but was usbequently found to be too soft and not compliant with standards.
That within the Infrastructure business has all but closed down China as a supplier to the Railway Industry. They will have to work incredibly hard to get back to where they were.
I was looking at rail 18 months old that the client was having to take out of the track as it was beyond further use. Trust me, that the Railway administration involved was pretty hacked off and even a passing mention of the Chinese is enough to have you struck off their supplier database long term.
In the case of the railways, Chinese steel was purchased by a number of Countries but was usbequently found to be too soft and not compliant with standards.
That within the Infrastructure business has all but closed down China as a supplier to the Railway Industry. They will have to work incredibly hard to get back to where they were.
I was looking at rail 18 months old that the client was having to take out of the track as it was beyond further use. Trust me, that the Railway administration involved was pretty hacked off and even a passing mention of the Chinese is enough to have you struck off their supplier database long term.
wensley
Established Member
I think it is a real shame that the 60s are all about to be stored. They are some of the most powerful locos in the DBS fleet and are nowhere near then end of their useful lives if only EWS had invested in them and not allowed them to get into their current state.
In my opinion they won't work again especially due to the economic downturn - due to the attitude of DBS towards these machines I feel the majority will be placed in cold storage and, when conditions improve, be in a state not fit for re-activation. A few may be held back in warm store but there may be no need for them to work again if class 66 and 67 reilability stays so high and traffic levels low. DBS may even consider buying a handful of class 70s to replace the class 60s on heavier turns such as the JOT if FLHH's trials are successful - who knows.
As for preserving a class 60 I can't see them being sold for some time yet and when they go onto the tender list it will be all the knackered ones first. A preservation group may gamble on buying a knackered one for spares in the hope a repairable one becomes availble later but that's a big, expensive gamble to take. A lot of the 60s will take a lot of work to get back to operating condition for a preserved line and many lines and diesel groups will not have the spares or knowledge of these machines to carry out the work. And spares will be very hard to source
All that without mentioning the fact that these locos are very heavy for operation on preserved track, are quite fuel thirsty due to their high power output and are unable to provide ETS or ETH.
Obviously this is purely my opinion and I could be proven wrong but with all factors considered the future doen't look good for the 'tugs' - get the photos while you can, today's JOT working could be one of the last brining a class 60 up the ECML......
In my opinion they won't work again especially due to the economic downturn - due to the attitude of DBS towards these machines I feel the majority will be placed in cold storage and, when conditions improve, be in a state not fit for re-activation. A few may be held back in warm store but there may be no need for them to work again if class 66 and 67 reilability stays so high and traffic levels low. DBS may even consider buying a handful of class 70s to replace the class 60s on heavier turns such as the JOT if FLHH's trials are successful - who knows.
As for preserving a class 60 I can't see them being sold for some time yet and when they go onto the tender list it will be all the knackered ones first. A preservation group may gamble on buying a knackered one for spares in the hope a repairable one becomes availble later but that's a big, expensive gamble to take. A lot of the 60s will take a lot of work to get back to operating condition for a preserved line and many lines and diesel groups will not have the spares or knowledge of these machines to carry out the work. And spares will be very hard to source
All that without mentioning the fact that these locos are very heavy for operation on preserved track, are quite fuel thirsty due to their high power output and are unable to provide ETS or ETH. Obviously this is purely my opinion and I could be proven wrong but with all factors considered the future doen't look good for the 'tugs' - get the photos while you can, today's JOT working could be one of the last brining a class 60 up the ECML......
37401
Established Member
my tour on sat may well be the last one to feature a class 60, its a shame this class is on its way out
for those intrested in snapping up thier last few (if not their very last) tugs then the railtour is called the Pye Bridge Pie man, I have a full set of times, if anyone wants them let me know
for those intrested in snapping up thier last few (if not their very last) tugs then the railtour is called the Pye Bridge Pie man, I have a full set of times, if anyone wants them let me know
Last edited:
GNERman
Established Member
This is the best image I could find, or if I got my way GC would use these...
http://alternativerailways.fotopic.net/p60178684.html
Failed Unit
Established Member
I would be surprised if they sold off the 60's, they could probably be made into nice loco's again and then could be used to compete against them. The 58's are still hanging around (not in the UK). Afterall companies are using old 47's and 56's to compete again DBS!
SussexSpotter
Member
What? This is good news for class 60 fans, not bad.
DB Schenker are termporarily putting them all into storage for refurbishment and repaint, not to be scrapped or sold off.
Apparently DB Schenker are putting quite a few class 66's into long term storage and replacing them with class 60's. 66's have recently proved quite unreliable on long distance workings whereas the 60's havn't. 20 of their 66's have already have been put into storage.
Rumour has it all but the poor conditioned class 60's will be back in mainline use. That would mean at least 75% of the 60 fleet back in mainline use.
They will all gradually be put back into mainline use once each one has been refurbished/repainted.
Oh.....and Freightliner will be putting 30 of their older fleet of class 66's (66/5) into long term storage and replacing them with the new powerhaul 70's by the end of 2010.
DB Schenker are termporarily putting them all into storage for refurbishment and repaint, not to be scrapped or sold off.
Apparently DB Schenker are putting quite a few class 66's into long term storage and replacing them with class 60's. 66's have recently proved quite unreliable on long distance workings whereas the 60's havn't. 20 of their 66's have already have been put into storage.
Rumour has it all but the poor conditioned class 60's will be back in mainline use. That would mean at least 75% of the 60 fleet back in mainline use.
They will all gradually be put back into mainline use once each one has been refurbished/repainted.
Oh.....and Freightliner will be putting 30 of their older fleet of class 66's (66/5) into long term storage and replacing them with the new powerhaul 70's by the end of 2010.
- Status