EU Referendum: The result and aftermath...

[mmh]

This is a fantastic question how do you go from N. Ireland across the border to the EU without checks and onto the EU and vice versa.

The question has nothing to do with the Ireland / Northern Ireland border, however.

 

[nidave]

I can answer that.
UK > to > any part of Ireland; nothing required more than today, as Ireland isn't in Schengen.
However anyone from the UK in Ireland cannot travel from there to the EU without further documentation.

ironically, anyone entering Ireland from the EU with just their ID card can then cross into the UK with no paperwork at all as there (probably) won't be checks on the border.

Therfore the double whammy is the EU can stop us getting in, but we won't be able to stop unwated EU's coming hare.

Yet another Wahey Brexit Bonus.

Its all going swimmingy well isnt it.

The question has nothing to do with the Ireland / Northern Ireland border, however.

You know I can cope with more than one question in my head at the same time... its not hard to think of multiple issue which may arise.

 

[Jonny]

A lot of the border/freight chaos issues relate to the use of lorries on RORO (Roll-on, Roll-off) ferries. There are plenty of places that can handle ISO containers instead in order to offset the chaos.

 

[Basher]

Who cares about paying a charge to go to the EU? Not me and millions of other people, we just do not go to the EU anyway.
Just remember that the EU Puts a charge on the UK we should just do the same to EU nationals.
All this scare mongering is done by people who will not accept democracy. We voted out, so let's just out two fingers upto them (it was the English archers that invented the two fingers up to the french). So up yours EU.

 

[Howardh]

.
Just remember that the EU Puts a charge on the UK we should just do the same to EU nationals.

Yeah, sod our economy, let's charge EU for entry and then watch them go elsewhere in the EU where they can spend their money instead without having the hassle of being charged for entry and our version of ETIAS. How many £b's do EU tourists bring every year, paying our pensions, funding our schools, police, NHS....

Yeah, let's charge them and make 'em queue for hours at Heathrow and Dover. That'll show 'em.

Oh...where are they....

 

[nidave]

A lot of the border/freight chaos issues relate to the use of lorries on RORO (Roll-on, Roll-off) ferries. There are plenty of places that can handle ISO containers instead in order to offset the chaos.

What about people and services - like electricity interconnects?

 

[DarloRich]

Who cares about paying a charge to go to the EU? Not me and millions of other people, we just do not go to the EU anyway.
Just remember that the EU Puts a charge on the UK we should just do the same to EU nationals.
All this scare mongering is done by people who will not accept democracy. We voted out, so let's just out two fingers upto them (it was the English archers that invented the two fingers up to the french). So up yours EU.

I know i will regret this but: what is your position on the Irish border issue? Would you, for instance, accept the dismantling of the GFA and a return to the troubles in exchange for brexit?

 

[nidave]

Yeah, sod our economy, let's charge EU for entry and then watch them go elsewhere in the EU where they can spend their money instead without having the hassle of being charged for entry and our version of ETIAS. How many £b's do EU tourists bring every year, paying our pensions, funding our schools, police, NHS....

Yeah, let's charge them and make 'em queue for hours at Heathrow and Dover. That'll show 'em.

Oh...where are they....

They will just go to Ireland then visit N. Ireland then across to the UK - Simple - No visa charge for EU nationals. The Enterprise will be raking it in.

 

[mmh]

Yeah, sod our economy, let's charge EU for entry and then watch them go elsewhere in the EU where they can spend their money instead without having the hassle of being charged for entry and our version of ETIAS. How many £b's do EU tourists bring every year, paying our pensions, funding our schools, police, NHS....

Yeah, let's charge them and make 'em queue for hours at Heathrow and Dover. That'll show 'em.

Oh...where are they....

Wow. Number of people who walk in a travel agent and say "I'd like to go on holiday, not sure where but it has to be in the EU": none. In the opposite direction, number of people who want to go to Britain but wouldn't if it wasn't in the EU: none.

Well, none that aren't certifiable.

 

[mmh]

They will just go to Ireland then visit N. Ireland then across to the UK - Simple - No visa charge for EU nationals. The Enterprise will be raking it in.

Do both of you not realise how silly you sound?

 

[Jonny]

Meanwhile, in other news:

https://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/breaking-westminster-bridge-blocked-pro-13733051
Tower Bridge in London BLOCKED by pro-Brexit yellow vest protesters
Brexiteer protesters, dressed similarly to those in France, earlier blocked Westminster Bridge and are chanting "Brexit now"
Yellow vest protesters, similar to those who have brought swathes of France to a standstill, have blocked Tower Bridge after blocking Westminster Bridge this morning.

A live stream, hosted on Facebook page 'Fighting for Justice', showed activists blocking Westminster Bridge before they were moved on by police.

They then stopped outside Downing Street, with pro-Brexit chants heard.
(article continues)

Just the beginning?

 

[Jonny]

What about people and services - like electricity interconnects?

Services are mostly run by private companies who can work around problems pretty easily.

 

[nidave]

Do both of you not realise how silly you sound?

What by pointing out potental problems and wanting to have a solution - <sarcasm> how silly of me, I forgot I just had to believe and it will all be ok</sarcasm>

Services are mostly run by private companies who can work around problems pretty easily.

So break the law?

 

[SWTCommuter]

What about people and services - like electricity interconnects?

The cross-channel electricity link between UK and France dates back to 1961, long before we joined the EEC/EU.

 

[nidave]

The cross-channel electricity link between UK and France dates back to 1961, long before we joined the EEC/EU.

Is that link depentant on something enacted by the GFA? Before the GFA NI generated all its own electricity - since the GFA there is not enough local capacity but it wasnt an issue as part of the GFA intorduced the Single Electricity Market (SEM) for the island of Ireland.

The Single Electricity Market means that Northern Ireland Electricity carries electricity on its network in exchange for a regulated charge to the electricity supply company. As of September 2011 domestic customers in Northern Ireland are able to buy electricity from Electric Ireland, Power NI, Airtricity, Click Energy or Budget Energy. Industrial and commercial customers are able to choose from several other electricity suppliers.

The Transmission System Operator (TSO) is System Operator Northern Ireland (SONI Ltd). SONI ensures the safe, secure and economic operation of the high voltage electricity grid in Northern Ireland. SONI's counterpart in the Republic of Ireland is EirGrid. Both of these are owned by EirGrid plc which also (through a partnership of SONI and EirGrid) acts as the Single Energy Market Operator (SEMO), i.e. runs the new all-island wholesale market for electricity.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Electricity_sector_in_Ireland

 

[mmh]

What by pointing out potental problems and wanting to have a solution - <sarcasm> how silly of me, I forgot I just had to believe and it will all be ok</sarcasm>

Suggesting that somebody would travel to Britain via Ireland and Northern Ireland rather than travel direct in order to avoid a theoretical future entry charge to the UK is, yes, colossal silliness and I make no apology for saying so.

 

[nidave]

Suggesting that somebody would travel to Britain via Ireland and Northern Ireland rather than travel direct in order to avoid a theoretical future entry charge to the UK is, yes, colossal silliness and I make no apology for saying so.

But its a potental risk - and who would not like to visit the awesome countries of Ireland and round it off with a trip to see where game of thrones are filmed in N. Ireland before visiting mainland uk.

 

[Howardh]

Wow. Number of people who walk in a travel agent
.

Travel agent? !!
How quaint!
When was the last time anyone used a travel agent?!! These days you just look on the web, find a flight, hotel and go. And for day trips not even a hotel.

 

[greyman42]

I know i will regret this but: what is your position on the Irish border issue? Would you, for instance, accept the dismantling of the GFA and a return to the troubles in exchange for brexit?

What makes you think so certain that the Irish border situation will bring a return to 'the troubles'?

 

[Esker-pades]

Who cares about paying a charge to go to the EU? Not me and millions of other people, we just do not go to the EU anyway.

How do you know that? How big is your sample size? Is it statistically rigorous?

Just remember that the EU Puts a charge on the UK we should just do the same to EU nationals.

We could do that, yes.

All this scare mongering is done by people who will not accept democracy.

Using evidence is not scaremongering. Neither is asking questions.
Further, there is some strong evidence that the Leave campaign did not respect electoral funding and financial laws (see the £70k fine on Leave.EU). Respecting democratic process is more important than winning. The breaking of electoral law does not respect democracy.

We voted out, so let's just out two fingers upto them (it was the English archers that invented the two fingers up to the french). So up yours EU.

I can see you have a strong future as a diplomat.

 

[Howardh]

But its a potental risk - and who would not like to visit the awesome countries of Ireland and round it off with a trip to see where game of thrones are filmed in N. Ireland before visiting mainland uk.

It's an absolute risk. If i couldn't get in to the UK vis "normal" methods and I wanted to do anything from seek under-the-radar work to a terrorist atrocity, the Irish/UK border is the absolute way to do it - and getting to the UK mainland would be a sinch as the ferries won't be asking for your visa status, unless we make them unpaid immigration officials.

So people who have every right to be in the UK will be in the queues and checked thoroughly at Dover/Heathrow/anywhere on the mainland yet the great unwanted will fly into Ireland, breeze through their immigration proceedures and get the 300 into the UK unchallenged.

You couldn't make it up, you really couldn't.

 

[bramling]

It's an absolute risk. If i couldn't get in to the UK vis "normal" methods and I wanted to do anything from seek under-the-radar work to a terrorist atrocity, the Irish/UK border is the absolute way to do it - and getting to the UK mainland would be a sinch as the ferries won't be asking for your visa status, unless we make them unpaid immigration officials.

So people who have every right to be in the UK will be in the queues and checked thoroughly at Dover/Heathrow/anywhere on the mainland yet the great unwanted will fly into Ireland, breeze through their immigration proceedures and get the 300 into the UK unchallenged.

You couldn't make it up, you really couldn't.

Make it up or otherwise, in the last couple of days I've detected a very pronounced hardening of opinion. Even the DUP now seem to be directing ire more towards the EU. Every time we see Juncker's face on TV or hear someone saying "no" or "not possible" in a European accent, I suspect this will continue to harden. "Managed no deal" has now entered the vocabulary. I'd suggest it's quite clear where things are heading as things stand at the moment, though naturally this could change.

 

[birchesgreen]

Meanwhile, in other news:


Just the beginning?

Ironic they copy continentals

 

[Howardh]

Make it up or otherwise, in the last couple of days I've detected a very pronounced hardening of opinion. Even the DUP now seem to be directing ire more towards the EU. Every time we see Juncker's face on TV or hear someone saying "no" or "not possible" in a European accent, I suspect this will continue to harden. "Managed no deal" has now entered the vocabulary. I'd suggest it's quite clear where things are heading as things stand at the moment, though naturally this could change.

I wish I could sit on the side and watch this pan out without it having any effect on me!
This log-jam can either end up with the no-deal (and it does appear that the public is being buttered up to accept it, with this "managed" nonsense) or somehow we extend A50 and have that referendum in the (government/parliament's) hope we reject Brexit.
The deal in front of us offers...what exactly?
It's what comes next, the trade agreements etc and I would be astounded if anyone on either side had confidence in this government to even turn up.

 

[nidave]

What makes you think so certain that the Irish border situation will bring a return to 'the troubles'?

It's a stoong possibility as if there is friction on the border that will encourage the Ira to try and force a referendum on a united Ireland by causing as much trouble for everyone which means the uvf, uda etc will retaliate.

Make it up or otherwise, in the last couple of days I've detected a very pronounced hardening of opinion. Even the DUP now seem to be directing ire more towards the EU. Every time we see Juncker's face on TV or hear someone saying "no" or "not possible" in a European accent, I suspect this will continue to harden. "Managed no deal" has now entered the vocabulary. I'd suggest it's quite clear where things are heading as things stand at the moment, though naturally this could change.

The dup are terrified about this whole thing causing a referendum on a united Ireland.

 

[Howardh]

It's a stoong possibility as if there is friction on the border that will encourage the Ira to try and force a referendum on a united Ireland by causing as much trouble for everyone which means the uvf, uda etc will retaliate.

The dup are terrified about this whole thing causing a referendum on a united Ireland.

I can't work out why the DUP supported Brexit as a united Ireland is certainly a possible route now.

If there was reunification, it's occured to me to rent a flat in the North and on "Independence Day" swap my UK passport for an Irish one - I'm one of the only seven people in the world that's not currently entitled to one; and then I have my shiny EU passport back with all it entails - yet I can still carry on living in Great Britain with that Irish passport under the CTA, and presumably keep my GB pension etc....??

It's that bizarre.

 

[greyman42]

The dup are terrified about this whole thing causing a referendum on a united Ireland.

Would the result of that referendum be valid or would people be told to have another one?

 

[thejuggler]

Meanwhile, in other news:


Just the beginning?

It was about 20 of Yaxley-Lennon wannabes who started at Westminster, but didn't know the House didn't sit on a Friday so there was no one at College Green. They blocked Westminster Bridge, preventing an ambulance on blue lights getting across.

They had to fill their time so headed east to Tower Bridge.

It also amuses me they were wearing yellow vests, they probably don't realise the irony of that small matter.

Bunch of numpties.

 

[DarloRich]

What makes you think so certain that the Irish border situation will bring a return to 'the troubles'?

I am not certain about anything in relation to brexit. None of us can be. However the issue with the Irish border, The Belfast Agreement, The DUP, the former paramilitaries and all the others involved is currently insoluble.

If, as the poster I quoted suggested, we simply leave the EU on the day of brexit what is the plan for the Irish border? If the plan then suggested is a hard border are we prepared to accept the potential consequences? I believe it is a fair question. It isn't one i know the answer to but if people suggest a "hard" brexit this question must be answered. I hope it is more than a shrug.

 

[AlterEgo]

Meanwhile, in other news:


Just the beginning?

Idiots.