why dont wsmr stop at birmingham international.

[robert2000]

wikipedia states they are allowed to stop there. can anyone comment further please.

im sure there must be high demand from shrews/powys to international.

or is it because atw only have the rights to go from shrews to international.

 

[hick]

wikipedia states they are allowed to stop there. can anyone comment further please.

im sure there must be high demand from shrews/powys to international.

or is it because atw only have the rights to go from shrews to international.

There aren't enough paths for all the trains to go via Coventry and its useful to be able to go either way in times of disruption.

 

[robert2000]

what do you mean? all wsmr trains go through international and coventry.

but atw takes a different route, going through new street, where as wsmr use tame bridge parkway

 

[RPM]

what do you mean? all wsmr trains go through international and coventry.

but atw takes a different route, going through new street, where as wsmr use tame bridge parkway

No, some WSMR trains go via Solihull, missing out International & Coventry.

 

[robert2000]

solihull.

well were does that bring them out, they must miss out tame bridge then.

 

[hick]

Nope, wrong again. They use the junction at Bordersley (St Andrew's junction?) and go via New Street as do the Cross country trains that go that way.

 

[merlodlliw]

wikipedia states they are allowed to stop there. can anyone comment further please.

im sure there must be high demand from shrews/powys to international.

or is it because atw only have the rights to go from shrews to international.

Due to"a non Competition" clause held by Virgin, VT is the only TOC
allowed to pick up passengers at, Wolves,New St & International for London,this clause runs to 2012.

W/S had this clause thrown at them at the last minute, the unbelievable point
was neither the ORR or NR was aware of this clause, when the W/S bid was
lodged with the ORR two years ago. VT only brought it out when they realised W/S was about to get approval to run trains.
The ORR wrote to W/S saying due to this clause permission would be refused, that's why they run via Tame Bridge. I was one of the local team which forced WAG to get the bays at Wrexham sorted for the start up of W/S.



VT & ATW did everything to kill off W/S at birth, thats why we have spoiler
services,VT Wrexham to Euston (used as a local to Chester) & the Aber
proposal by ATW). (the is of course my opinion, but I am not alone)

 

[mumrar]

This clause doesn't give Virgin absolute exclusivity on New St and International to London customers. London Midland and previously Silverlink have done this for a long time. I think it offers them protection from any other competitors who join later on, such as WSMR

 

[merlodlliw]

This clause doesn't give Virgin absolute exclusivity on New St and International to London customers. London Midland and previously Silverlink have done this for a long time. I think it offers them protection from any other competitors who join later on, such as WSMR

Agree, the then Thames trains,later Silver Link now London Midland are stoppers
not effected by the non compi, The clause only applies to fast services to any London terminus from the three Brum Stations mentioned.
W/S have registered, this non compi be removed from 2012 with the ORR, sighting it as a restrictive practice, which of course it is.

 

[thefab444]

Agree, the then Thames trains,later Silver Link now London Midland are stoppers

Ah yes, that famous Thames Trains service from Birmingham New St to London.

 

[TDK]

wikipedia states they are allowed to stop there. can anyone comment further please.

im sure there must be high demand from shrews/powys to international.

or is it because atw only have the rights to go from shrews to international.

WSMR can stop there drop off on the up and pick upon the down however, no ticket extraction available and ATW go from Wrexham to International anyway, I imagine WSMR would sooner give their passengers a faster journey time from Shropshire and Wales to London, for WSMR to stopat Tame Bridhe and go via New Street they turn off at Perry Bar onto the down Soho

 

[robert2000]

why stop at both wellington and telford. that is silly, plus dont stop at cosford, they could save a few minutes.

plus they should stop at ASTON for football services, like they do at wembley.

 

[TDK]

why stop at both wellington and telford. that is silly, plus dont stop at cosford, they could save a few minutes.

plus they should stop at ASTON for football services, like they do at wembley.

No all the services stop at Wellington, the people of Wellington wanted them to stop there, so they did. Cosford isn't that busy but there is a free car park there and also the RAF station & to be honest it does not really put any time into the Journey because of the slot at Wolves. Aston? I really can't see the point as most of the supporters get off at Witton. I do not think there are any trains that would pass Aston or Witton at the correct times and to be honest where will these folks get on? There is aguament for WSMR to stop at many station but the company was fouded as a direct service from Wrexham and Shropshire to London hence the company name.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

Nope, wrong again. They use the junction at Bordersley (St Andrew's junction?) and go via New Street as do the Cross country trains that go that way.

2 different Junctions, there is St.Andrews and Bordesley

 

[CosherB]

There is also a first rate aviation museum at Cosford. Worth stopping there for visitors to that!

 

[robert2000]

cant ATW give up a few paths so wsmr can go to chester,
or will they have the same problem with virgin who take passengers from chester to euston

 

[TDK]

cant ATW give up a few paths so wsmr can go to chester,
or will they have the same problem with virgin who take passengers from chester to euston

Robert,

To be honest you may need to read some threads on here before posting rediculous ones like this, ATW issued a 17 page rejection document to try to stop WSMR from starting in the first place and they also gave a path to VT to go Wrexham to London on top of that they are also trying to start a service to Marylebone from Aberystwyth. All these things are really an effort to damage WSMR so it is very unlikely that ATW will even move one of their services by 1 minute let alone give up a path. When VT were going to run their service from Shrewsbury to London ATW offered them paths from Chester to Shrewsbury, this was also done to oppose WSMR. Some of your ideas are really not practicable. I am not calling you rediculous just your post

 

[robert2000]

well i must be the only person who thinks arriva is the worse toc in the country.
have u actually seen the state of their trains.

id like to see who will operate between chester and crewe after that line has been upgraded. like i said b4 in another thread, LM and VT

 

[Techniquest]

well i must be the only person who thinks arriva is the worse toc in the country.
have u actually seen the state of their trains.

No, you're not. There are a LOT of us who don't like ATW and AXC.

I have seen the state of their trains. I use them every time I travel north or south from Hereford, and not through choice!

 

[Squaddie]

why stop at both wellington and telford. that is silly, plus dont stop at cosford, they could save a few minutes.

As has already been said, the path beyond Wolverhampton is such that stops at Wellington and Telford make little, if any, difference to the overall schedule of the trains.

Additionally, WSMR seems to attract a lot of local passengers at stations between Wrexham and Wolverhampton (the 1718 from Wrexham last Saturday was quite busy with Christmas shoppers returning home from Wrexham and Shrewsbury, and with people going to Wolverhampton for a night out), and I presume that under the standard revenue-sharing terms they will receive a proportion of the fares collected by ATW for those journeys in addition to those from passengers travelling to and from London or Banbury. Every little helps.

 

[the sniper]

well i must be the only person who thinks arriva is the worse toc in the country.

Why would you be the only one?

 

[TDK]

well i must be the only person who thinks arriva is the worse toc in the country.
have u actually seen the state of their trains.

id like to see who will operate between chester and crewe after that line has been upgraded. like i said b4 in another thread, LM and VT

I used to work for them and ATW trains are abysmal, was an embarrasment to take them into service.I am not defending them however they did take on the franchise on a tight budget and there was some clause of using existing stock however when you compare the refurbs of the 455 on Southern to the 158's for ATW there isn't a comparison. I saw a brown one the other day between Birm interntional and Chester that was the dirtiest I have ever seen. Imagine that on a triptoLondon amoungst the shiney 168's, 165's and WSMR stock. ATW will continue to run services between chester and crewe, why shouldn't they? As for LM & VT both those companies need to get their act together also so I recon a nice open access company should run them

 

[dk1]

It was the same when Virgin Trains had Cross-Country & no doubt with Arriva XC now. Part of the franchise inc the train replacement plan gave them exclusive use of services between Birmingham & Bristol/Reading. Central trains did attempt to extend certain services to Oxford but this was blocked.

 

[The Planner]

That would have been the planned Nottingham Oxford services, they never got off the drawing board as there were no paths for them anyway. Virgin also got shirty when Leamington - Tyseley was shut for the re-signalling, Chiltern wanted to run via Coventry but got told where to go.