Tyne and Wear Metro: Possible Future Extensions?

[Jorge Da Silva]

Could the Tyne and Wear Metro be extended further and possibly reopening some old railway lines?
What lines could reopen? Where would you extend it to?

 

[Clip]

Along Scotswood road has always been spoken about but nothing has ever happened. It could really do with some Regeneration down that end and the Metro could provide the faster links into town to assist with that

 

[Megafuss]

Doable at a cost:

Sunderland to South Shields

Ashington/Blyth connecting up at Northumberland Park

Seaham/Ryhope/Grangetown to Sunderland

Re Scotswood Road. Unless a lot of tunnel realignment work takes place in the Central Station area I cannot see how it can be connected with the existing Tyne and Wear Metro - unless you don't and run a different light rail system in to the Mainline station and use the Forth Bank line as the portal to the rest of the West End. Personally I don't see the point in extending it to West Newcastle. That ship sailed long ago when the Business Park ripped up the old North Tyne allignment IMO

I think the next lot of extensions (if they ever come) should look at Wearside and Washington.

 

[markindurham]

Extending from South Hylton to Penshaw, then across the Victoria Bridge and up to Pelaw is one possibility.

The old Tyne Dock to Tilesheds line, allowing reinstatement of direct South Shields-Sunderland services? Possibly, given the prospective catchment area of Whiteleas, but on the other hand you would have to compete with the regular Economic buses between 'Sheels' and Sunderland.

There's also talk of going all the way to Ferryhill along the Leamside - Ferryhill is touted as being an up and coming 'dormitory town' for the North East, so anything is possible.

 

[TBY-Paul]

Extending from South Hylton to Penshaw.

Extending to Penshaw should be considered "if" Leamside is reopened

There's also talk of going all the way to Ferryhill along the Leamside - Ferryhill is touted as being an up and coming 'dormitory town' for the North East, so anything is possible.

Please, I hope they don't reopen Leamside just for a Metro extension. Leamside needs reopening as part of a larger scale rail network in the North east.
During the 1990's I was a regular visitor to places like Ferryhill, Bowburn, Coxhoe, Sedgefield, Spennymoor etc, and they were basically area's of decline, places that had seen better day's( I'll stop there, otherwise I'll use even worse derogatory language.
About 4 years ago my daughter and her partner were looking into buying a house, He works in Durham, She works in Darlington, when she told me they had bought a new build house in Bowburn, I thought WHY? But having once again started to travel to the area, the changes are unbelievable, the sign's of growth & improvement are plain to see. All this growth comes at a cost, the road networks are getting clogged up on a regular basis. There will come a point when the need to upgrade the Stillington Line (with one or two Stations, & Reopen Leamside again with well placed stations)to provide alternative means of travel with be just that "a need" not just "a nice thing to have", and that point is fast arriving.

 

[markindurham]

Extending to Penshaw should be considered "if" Leamside is reopened




Please, I hope they don't reopen Leamside just for a Metro extension. Leamside needs reopening as part of a larger scale rail network in the North east.
During the 1990's I was a regular visitor to places like Ferryhill, Bowburn, Coxhoe, Sedgefield, Spennymoor etc, and they were basically area's of decline, places that had seen better day's( I'll stop there, otherwise I'll use even worse derogatory language.
About 4 years ago my daughter and her partner were looking into buying a house, He works in Durham, She works in Darlington, when she told me they had bought a new build house in Bowburn, I thought WHY? But having once again started to travel to the area, the changes are unbelievable, the sign's of growth & improvement are plain to see. All this growth comes at a cost, the road networks are getting clogged up on a regular basis. There will come a point when the need to upgrade the Stillington Line (with one or two Stations, & Reopen Leamside again with well placed stations)to provide alternative means of travel with be just that "a need" not just "a nice thing to have", and that point is fast arriving.

I hear you - and I have lived in Bowburn for 20 years now, having moved there from South Shields - the whole area has changed dramatically in that time. I agree - the Stillington line is also ripe for passenger services, but these days there's no reason why Metro and 'heavy rail' can't co-exist, as they now do between Pelaw and Sunderland. You might already know that there were plans to reopen the Leamside back in 2001, with Middlesbrough-Newcastle services alternating between the Durham Coast and via Stillington/Leamside, with stations at Sedgefield, Belmont and somewhere to suit Washington. However, Hatfield then happened, and it all was forgotten...

Metro do seem enthusiastic about extending, initially the loop as I mentioned before. Regarding the rest of the Leamside, south of Penshaw, then stations at Belmont, Shincliffe, Bowburn and Ferryhill would be my own suggestion, then one at Sedgefield if services to Middlesbrough are also on the cards. Heavy rail or Metro - it doesn't matter as long as somebody does it.

Ultimately, though, it's all down to money and politics - the latter is problematlc, particularly in County Durham. Look at the row over where the new County Hall should go...

 

[Meerkat]

I wonder whether the Leamside line should be opened for freight.
A fairly direct line to Tyne Dock off the ECML, and maybe a big logistics park at the top of the motorway, with a link into Toyota.
With Brexit related problems it might be a way to help convince Toyota to stay without breaking state aid rules - direct trains through the Chunnel and maybe even shuttles to the dock.

 

[Glenmutchkin]

A fairly direct line to Tyne Dock off the ECML, and maybe a big logistics park at the top of the motorway, with a link into Toyota.

Would the Tyne & Wear Metro be welcome in Derbyshire?

 

[gazthomas]

Would the Tyne & Wear Metro be welcome in Derbyshire?

I think they mean Nissan!

 

[Meerkat]

Oops. I did indeed mean Nissan....though the principle applies to Toyota too.

 

[Swanny200]

Could you not run an extension from South Hylton to penshaw which links Sunderland to the Leamside line and a Southern loop to the Metro, Sunderland to South Shields should be very easy, there is existing alignment there albeit for freight paths but plenty of space to double track or single + freight like between Hebburn and Jarrow. Metro have always wanted to extend to the MetroCentre, but how they would be able to do that I don't know, I know extending West probably would be a non starter, but there is plenty of scope on the southern side of the Metro.

 

[Japan0913]

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[markindurham]

Rebuilding to Durham from the Leamside via Belmont Viaduct and Newton Hall would be attractive, but might be a squeeze to get into Durham. There is just enough space to get a single line from Newton Hall to Durham, but the Up Goods Loop would have to go, and a new platform would have to be built, including a bridge across Framwellgate Peth because the Up platform has just been extended across the existing bridge. Not insurmountable, but they would come at a price. Then there is the issue of the Metro wires being in close proximity to the 25kV on the main line.

 

[edwin_m]

Rebuilding to Durham from the Leamside via Belmont Viaduct and Newton Hall would be attractive, but might be a squeeze to get into Durham. There is just enough space to get a single line from Newton Hall to Durham, but the Up Goods Loop would have to go, and a new platform would have to be built, including a bridge across Framwellgate Peth because the Up platform has just been extended across the existing bridge. Not insurmountable, but they would come at a price. Then there is the issue of the Metro wires being in close proximity to the 25kV on the main line.

On the final point, the new Metro stock is liekly to have 25kV capability and that voltage would probably be used if this was built. I agree it would be useful but I think it's highly unlikely in the current financial climate. What condition is the old viaduct at Newton Hall in?

 

[markindurham]

On the final point, the new Metro stock is liekly to have 25kV capability and that voltage would probably be used if this was built. I agree it would be useful but I think it's highly unlikely in the current financial climate. What condition is the old viaduct at Newton Hall in?

The 25kV facility is news to me, I have to say. We would see much beefier Metro cars then, if true.

As far as I know, Belmont viaduct is in reasonable condition. It was proposed that it be modified in the same was as Newton Cap at Bishop Auckland was, to be used as part of a Durham Northern bypass, but a combination of outraged residents of Newton Hall and egotistic DCC Councillors and planners wanting something new appear to have put those plans into the euphemistic 'round file' - but that's another story...

 

[SeanG]

I think initially that bi-modes could be ordered and run off the Durham coast line services and through the metro central section to the airport to provide a through service.

Personally I would love to see an extension to Houghton le Spring & Hetton le Hole

 

[cuccir]

Personally, I'd head to Washington rather than Durham for a westward extension in the south, ideally with an interchange with newly operating National Rail services on the Leamside Line. Terminate at a big park and ride somewhere near junction 64.

The most obvious space for westward extension further north must be along the north bank of the Tyne, roughly parallel to Scotswood Road. Again, there could be space to stick a park and ride somewhere out near the A1.

 

[Swanny200]

Personally, I'd head to Washington rather than Durham for a westward extension in the south, ideally with an interchange with newly operating National Rail services on the Leamside Line. Terminate at a big park and ride somewhere near junction 64.

The most obvious space for westward extension further north must be along the north bank of the Tyne, roughly parallel to Scotswood Road. Again, there could be space to stick a park and ride somewhere out near the A1.

the only major issue after that would be people wanting the metro either tunnelled or bridged across the water seeing as the MetroCentre is just across the water from those potential sites, I know that the MetroCentre was planned well before it was built and the land was all acquired in the 70's but the Metro was built before it. I don't even know if tunnelling to an underground terminus would be feaseable in that area I know it would probably be expensive.

 

[markindurham]

the only major issue after that would be people wanting the metro either tunnelled or bridged across the water seeing as the MetroCentre is just across the water from those potential sites, I know that the MetroCentre was planned well before it was built and the land was all acquired in the 70's but the Metro was built before it. I don't even know if tunnelling to an underground terminus would be feaseable in that area I know it would probably be expensive.

The only way you're going to see Metro trains running to Metrocentre would be if they were able to use the existing NR station, with wires & signalling done in a similar way to the Pelaw - Sunderland line. The costs otherwise just wouldn't stand up. So, how would you access the Carlisle line from the Metro, in order to run direct from Newcastle? There's the next expensive problem.

 

[Swanny200]

The only way you're going to see Metro trains running to Metrocentre would be if they were able to use the existing NR station, with wires & signalling done in a similar way to the Pelaw - Sunderland line. The costs otherwise just wouldn't stand up. So, how would you access the Carlisle line from the Metro, in order to run direct from Newcastle? There's the next expensive problem.

Exactly, but it is always the one that a lot of people want, out of curiosity, how busy is that line from Central to MetroCentre and how much disruption would it cause to have an extra 4tph?, it would probably be fairly easy to run from the southern end to MetroCentre (South Shields or Sunderland) but agreed the run from Central would be a headache just for starters.

 

[option]

I would do the easy/cheap bits first. Stuff that could be locally funded, & wouldn't need major infrastructure works or much additional rolling stock.
You need to expand the base upon which the bigger/expensive extensions could build upon, as they would need a lot more rolling stock, new depot, electrical works etc.

Percy Main - Northumberland Park > easy bit of infill & could be used as a diversionary route
Brockley Whins - Tyne Dock > Sunderland-South Shields service

Then get the extension to Washington finished - though where's the centre? & do you reverse at Penshaw?
Then extend back to Pelaw

Further extensions;
Depends whether you strike outwards to further away places, eg Durham, or do high density infill, eg Riverside Branch along the Tyne.
MetroCentre is going to involve tunnelling somewhere. (Forth St to back of Arena?, then along the old formation next to Scotswood Rd, across the river, along the main line to MetroCentre station)

 

[LLivery]

Then get the extension to Washington finished - though where's the centre? & do you reverse at Penshaw?
Then extend back to Pelaw

I wouldn't reverse at Penshaw. I'd have it as an interchange.

Re-open the line from Pelaw through Washington, Penshaw and Fence Houses, even possibly to Carrville/Sherburn. I'd then extend from South Hylton to Penshaw with a bay/Spanish solution platform. Money being no problem, I'd also re-open from Washington to Stanley.