Canon versus Nikon

[HOOVER29]

Looks like I'm going to have to bite the bullet and purchase a camera from either of the above as my Fuji HS50exr is starting to play up & hack me off.
Which model though?
From the Nikon corner I've looked at the 3400D vr
From the Canon corner its the 4000D.
I know lenses can be a tad expensive and both come with a 55 mm lense so how much would it cost me say if I went for a 200 mm lens too?
Always had Fuji bridge cameras so this is my first venture into the attachable lens world of photography so Im treading carefully.
Im not looking to buy an all singing and dancing set up so that Ill have to sell a kidney to pay for it, rather gradually upgrade.
Any recommendations chaps?

Carl

 

[krus_aragon]

On Canon vs Nikon, both companies make good cameras. But you may find that one suits you better than the other.

When I was shopping for a DSLR (~5 years ago) I found the difference in ergonomics was the deciding factor. High end DSLRs have two roller wheels to control both exposure time and aperture (for example), but the cheaper consumer-oriented models only have one. Nikon put theirs on the back, to be operated by the thumb, whereas Canon keep the one by the shutter, to be operated by the index finger.

Having handled both in shops, I found that lifting my finger off the shutter and then rolling it back and forth felt uncomfortable. As a result Canon was out of the running, and I only looked at Nikons. This is despite the Canon having more second-hand lenses for sale (in my experience) and also supporting a greater range of third-party firmware customizations. But I wouldn't have felt comfortable using the Canon, so that's that.

You may want to consider looking at buying a refurbished model from a reputable camera shop: they typically come with a 6 month warranty, but are significantly cheaper than the identical "new" model next to it on the shelf. You'll also get the opportunity to handle the camera in person, instead of relying on web reviews.

 

[olympus]

I was in the same boat not long ago, finding that I had reached the limitations of my Panasonic bridge camera. After doing some research online, I bought a second hand Canon 60D with a zoom lens.

The Canon has given me very little trouble. My major complaint is that the camera and lens are both quite heavy, but there's no avoiding that when build quality and features are considered. After a couple of months using the camera and lens, I found that most of the time, I was using the lens set at 35mm (that's about 55mm full frame equivalent). The widest view I ever used was 24mm and the narrowest was 85mm (on only one occasion). Based on this, I got rid of the zoom lens and replaced it with 35mm and 50mm primes, of which only the 35mm regularly leaves the house. Unfortunately, the Canon 35mm lens is a bit pricey (but worth it for the features).

Of the two cameras you mention, I would be drawn more to the Nikon based on the features. That's despite all the good things I can say about Canon kit that I've used. The Nikon has a higher burst rate (5fps vs 3fps), which is quite a difference. Nikon also claim that you'll get 1200 shots per charge, much better than the Canon's 500, so there's a bit more room before needing to carry a second battery with you.

Really, the things to do are to consider the focal lengths and features that you will use most, then look around for second hand cameras and lenses to match. You will get more for your money by looking at second hand items rather than new.

 

[Bevan Price]

Personally I would avoid second hand cameras. As moving components get older and start to wear, things like shutter speed can drift away from the nominal value, and unless you know the previous owner, you won't know how well the camera has been treated. As for Canon v. Nikon, they both make good cameras, so the choice is a matter of personal preference.

My own lens choice is a Canon with a Sigma 18-300 mm zoom lens; it won't be everyone's choice, but it avoids carrying 2 lenses, and perhaps more important, not having to change lenses lessens the chance of getting dust inside the camera and onto the sensor. And always make sure you have a spare, charged battery with you - a flat battery can be very annoying if something "special" is approaching.

 

[cactustwirly]

They're pretty much the same, but I went for a Nikon because thats what I'm more familiar with.
Anyway I would go for the Nikon D3400 personally, it's slightly better than the Canon, but at the end of the day the picture quality between the two is very similar.

I'm relatively new to DSLRs, and I'm on a tight budget as well, so I bought a cheapish D3200 off eBay for about £200, however if you go down this route then make sure to check the shutter count etc.

I would very much recommend getting taught how to use the DSLR, what all the controls & settings do, or else you won't get the most out of the camera.

 

[Basher]

I'm biased, always had Canon. I start with a film A1 and T70, both great cameras and very good lenses. My first SLR digital camera was a 30D, a fantastic camera. I now use a 7D mark 2 and all my lens are canon, I tend to shoot RAW rather than jpeg, the movie quality is fantastic. I gave my grand daughter the 30D for her school work and she loves it. The cost of a secondhand 30D is very reasonable.
The software that comes with the canon is good too.
At the end of the day it's down to budget.

 

[HOOVER29]

I had a look at a second hand canon 1300d today with 55mm lens. Immaculate condition one owner for £220.
The kid in me said buy it.
Good or bad move.

 

[cactustwirly]

I had a look at a second hand canon 1300d today with 55mm lens. Immaculate condition one owner for £220.
The kid in me said buy it.
Good or bad move.

Sounds pretty good, paid that for my Nikon D3200, which is a few years older.

 

[Basher]

The 1300d is a small step up from the 1200D, its a good camera to get started with. The lens is critical to good photographs. I'm not familiar with the 55mm lens, I would have thought a zoom lens would have been better to start with.
A 18-55 zoom. or A 18- 105 zoom

 

[cactustwirly]

The 1300d is a small step up from the 1200D, its a good camera to get started with. The lens is critical to good photographs. I'm not familiar with the 55mm lens, I would have thought a zoom lens would have been better to start with.
A 18-55 zoom. or A 18- 105 zoom

Probably, I only have the standard 18-55mm, and find that it's suitable for most shots.
A 55mm is a bit more zoomed than your eyes (about 35mm)

 

[Basher]

You can pickup second hand zooms at very reasonable prices, it's only when you go for the the high spec lenses that prices rockets up.
Good luck with your purchase.

 

[krus_aragon]

You can pickup second hand zooms at very reasonable prices, it's only when you go for the the high spec lenses that prices rockets up.
Good luck with your purchase.

And in my experience, there are more Canon-fit zooms on the second hand market than Nikon.

 

[ash39]

I'm going to go against some of the advice on here. I'm not a professional (or even an expert!), but I've had photos featured in Rail, Rail Express, Modern Railways, The Railway Magazine & Modern Locomotives Illustrated, so I'm well placed to advise from a railway photography point of view if nothing else.

I would actually say buying second hand is a good idea - you can get a lot more for your money and given the value of 'serious' photography kit, people tend to look after it. Just use your judgement and if something seems dodgy, avoid it. Talkphotography.co.uk is a good resource for advice, but also has a busy secondhand forum.

My camera history: My first D-SLR was a brand new Canon 500d around a decade ago. It was good but I soon found it pretty limiting, particularly the performance at high ISO's. After around 3 years, I upgraded to a second hand Canon 5D mk2. I think it cost me around £1000, can't remember the exact figure now, but it was still around half the price of a brand new one. I was unsure about spending almost double the price of a new camera on a used one, but the difference in performance is night and day, and despite fairly heavy use it is still going strong today. It's more of a professional quality camera than a hobby camera, and it shows.

Another piece of advice would be don't get caught up in buying loads of lenses - it can be tempting especially when new to SLR cameras, but I only have a 24-105mm and a 70-300mm, and have never found myself needing more. On a crop sensor camera, you might need something down to around 18mm though. Also if you do a lot of low-light or portrait photography, a low aperture lens would be a good idea (the Canon 50mm f/1.8 was always a popular recommendation, and costs less than £100)

I don't have any experience of using Nikon, but you can apply the same logic to their equipment and I'm sure you wouldn't go wrong either. Both are well respected and supported brands.

 

[HOOVER29]

Just a quick update on the search for a new camera. It will be from the Canon/Nikon market but I’ve noticed on the Canon cameras the shutter button compared to the Fuji & the Nikon is almost on the front. It just doesn’t sit right with me as well as the Nikon. On the other hand I’ve noticed there is a lot more lens available for the Canon. Also I’ve noticed that cameras seem a lot lighter nowadays, I suppose that’s progress.

 

[Bevan Price]

The 1300d is a small step up from the 1200D, its a good camera to get started with. The lens is critical to good photographs. I'm not familiar with the 55mm lens, I would have thought a zoom lens would have been better to start with.
A 18-55 zoom. or A 18- 105 zoom

They have probably improved the Canon 55mm lens since I used a couple on film cameras well over 10 years ago. I thought the optical quality was quite good, but the lens construction was quite flimsy. Once after a gentle bump, and once for no apparent reason, the central part of the lens became detached from the rest of it, and there was no easy (or inexpensive) way to repair it.

 

[squizzler]

Sorry to jump in late with a contrary suggestion to your decided course of action, but I think the best interchangeable lens camera in your position is actually the Fuji system. It is a mirrorless and exclusively for crop sensor, so there are good crop lenses available. Online reviews speak very highly of the system, and older bodies seem to be affordable on London Camera Exchange website. Bear in mind Canon/Nikon systems design their best lenses for the full frame 35mm sensor, these work with crop sensor of course but mean a bigger lens to do the same thing as on Fuji (or micro four thirds), although that's fine if you expect to upgrade to 35mm sensor camera.

Bear in mind that DSLR cameras are being increasingly supplanted by mirrorless and the latter is widely perceived as the future. Canon and Nikon have launched 35mm mirrorless systems which they expect to gradually take over from their DSLR systems.

 

[cactustwirly]

Sorry to jump in late with a contrary suggestion to your decided course of action, but I think the best interchangeable lens camera in your position is actually the Fuji system. It is a mirrorless and exclusively for crop sensor, so there are good crop lenses available. Online reviews speak very highly of the system, and older bodies seem to be affordable on London Camera Exchange website. Bear in mind Canon/Nikon systems design their best lenses for the full frame 35mm sensor, these work with crop sensor of course but mean a bigger lens to do the same thing as on Fuji (or micro four thirds), although that's fine if you expect to upgrade to 35mm sensor camera.

Bear in mind that DSLR cameras are being increasingly supplanted by mirrorless and the latter is widely perceived as the future. Canon and Nikon have launched 35mm mirrorless systems which they expect to gradually take over from their DSLR systems.

But atm, I'm convinced that DSLRs are better than mirrorless, because of battery life, AF speeds, and you get an optical viewfinder.

 

[squizzler]

Also I’ve noticed that cameras seem a lot lighter nowadays, I suppose that’s progress.

The entry level cameras are certainly light, the lack of heft might be a disadvantage as it suggests less robust build quality and less stability when shooting handheld. The choice of weight you are prepared to endure depends whether you are carrying your kit, and that can influence if you go for "full frame" 35mm or smaller such as the Micro Four Thirds or APSC sensors.

But atm, I'm convinced that DSLRs are better than mirrorless, because of battery life, AF speeds, and you get an optical viewfinder.

I would counter that the advantages of DSLR you suggest above are not things the OP is likely to miss, coming as he does from a "bridge camera". A modern mirrorless will be an improvement over his existing camera in all these areas (except maybe battery life). Mirrorless is widely seen as the future and is better for video, should the OP wish to explore that.

I would suggest the OP choose mirrorless if buying new kit, but DSLR if willing to buy used as the continuing advance of mirrorless might lead to a glut of secondhand DSLR bodies and lenses ...

 

[krus_aragon]

Mirrorless is the future, but may not be here yet. Nikon have just launched their first two in the past months, and it'll take several years for them to displace their DSLRs at the cheaper end of the consumer market. I believe Canon are in a similar position, but I'm not familiar with Fuji's product lineup so can't comment.

I'd just reiterate that it's well worth trying options out in person. I was upgrading from a film SLR that I'd experimented with at Uni, and considered a bridge camera, but on trying one in the flesh I learned that I didn't like the electronic viewfinder.

 

[squizzler]

Mirrorless is the future, but may not be here yet. Nikon have just launched their first two in the past months, and it'll take several years for them to displace their DSLRs at the cheaper end of the consumer market. I believe Canon are in a similar position, but I'm not familiar with Fuji's product lineup so can't comment.

Pedantically speaking, Nikon's first mirrorless system was called the "1" which flopped in the market The Fujifilm systems and the Micro Four Thirds (Olympus / Panasonic) are established over a number of years so there is good availability of stuff on the used market and third party lenses. Most SLR lenses can be used on mirrorless with adaptors so you are not limited to native lenses.

I'd just reiterate that it's well worth trying options out in person. I was upgrading from a film SLR that I'd experimented with at Uni, and considered a bridge camera, but on trying one in the flesh I learned that I didn't like the electronic viewfinder.

Agreed. Nothing beats hands-on experience. Your implication of film SLR's being current at the time you previously tried an electronic viewfinder suggested that the viewfinders you were using were a long way behind today's state-of-the-art. It must also be said that the viewfinders on entry level DSLR's are pretty bad too: the combination of poor optics and the smaller sensor made for small, dingy viewfinders compared to high end full frame gear. I'd say a good EVF beats an entry level DSLR finder.

 

[krus_aragon]

Agreed. Nothing beats hands-on experience. Your implication of film SLR's being current at the time you previously tried an electronic viewfinder suggested that the viewfinders you were using were a long way behind today's state-of-the-art.

Actually the film SLR was anything but current: this was roughly a decade ago. I'd previously decided that it was now-or-never to try my hand at 35mm stuff, and had fun developing and making my own prints in the University darkroom. Some years later, I went browsing around, like the OP, and settled on a manufacturer-refurbished D5100.

Technology does march on, however, and I might have come to a different decision today.

 

[HOOVER29]

Just purchased this:

Nikon D5300 Camera + Nikkor 35mm f/1.8 Lens + Carrier Bag + Camera Rain Cover + UV Filter + FLD Filter + CPL Filter + Filter Case + 64GB SD Card + Battery Charger + Battery + User Manual + Cables to connect camera to TV

Managed to get it for £350 from a well known internet auction site.
Delivery is in 2 days.

 

[cactustwirly]

Just purchased this:

Nikon D5300 Camera + Nikkor 35mm f/1.8 Lens + Carrier Bag + Camera Rain Cover + UV Filter + FLD Filter + CPL Filter + Filter Case + 64GB SD Card + Battery Charger + Battery + User Manual + Cables to connect camera to TV

Managed to get it for £350 from a well known internet auction site.
Delivery is in 2 days.

Wow that's a lot of kit!
Good luck with your new purchase!

 

[olympus]

Well done, that sounds like a great kit. The 35mm lens would have to be my first choice if starting out with the Nikon system.

 

[HOOVER29]

Well I took the new camera out to Nottingham & Derby. It’s a breeze to use. Auto focus is unbelievably foolproof. Spent a couple of hrs with my head in the user manual & so far so good. Only downside is the lense. I’m used to a powerful zoom lens on my Fuji HS 50EXR & with the 35 mm lens I’ve got with the Nikon D5300 I haven’t got that. Just got to adjust the way I take shots.
I’ll upload the trip out later.
Nottingham visit includes Hst’s, units a Colas 70 & two colas 56’s on the rhtt from Sandiacre plus 66785 on a Ratcliffe-Immingham working.

Carl

 

[Nighthawke]

I was told many years ago that the best zoom is your own pair of feet! Limited I know but it does make you work for the shot. Personally a Canon user but it doesn't matter- what does matter is that you are comfortable with what ypu have and can get a decent photo with which you are happy. Enjoy...!

 

[gazthomas]

Modern DSLR cameras are so good there is no such thing as a bad choice as such. A good photo comes down to judgement and and at times a sprinkling of luck

 

[james60059]

I'm biased and say Nikon, after getting my first DSLR in 2009 (a Nikon D80 secondhand), but to be honest Canon are just as good as I know several toggers who use Canon too. It's all down to personal preference really. My first brand new camera was the Nikon D3200, so the D3400 is a more up to date version so if that's what you want then go for it

 

[Jon sid]