Blackpool - Manchester Electrification

[totally]

Hi everyone, forgive me if this isn't the right place to ask but in the May 2018 timetable it listed a direct Macclesfield to Blackpool North service. When the work is finally completed on the line between Manchester and Preston, will this service still be introduced?

Whilst it could be, there must be some uncertainty as Northern have been told they cannot change the timetables in December. From what I know it is unclear if that means they cannot implement the timetable they should have brought in in May but could not due to the lack of wires or if it is just larger scale changes which are not allowed. Can anybody clarify this point?

 

[GRALISTAIR]

With 20 wire runs still to do 28th Sept would seem to me a bit optimistic.
They really seem to be getting there act together on electrification pity Mr bi mode grayling has pulled the plug on many future schemes.
K

The official GNRP about 78/98 wire runs done and thus 20 left was on September 3rd. 59CosG95 tends to give out information that is either officially confirmed or strong photographic evidence by a regular correspondent. Now me doing the mathematics says -OK . Let us say we can do one wire run per night ( and that excludes weekend possessions) then 4, 5, 6, 7 , 8, 9, 10, 11, 12 September is 9 runs. So we may well be down to only 11 wire runs left. That is my "Glass is half full " answer anyway.

 

[59CosG95]

The official GNRP about 78/98 wire runs done and thus 20 left was on September 3rd. 59CosG95 tends to give out information that is either officially confirmed or strong photographic evidence by a regular correspondent. Now me doing the mathematics says -OK . Let us say we can do one wire run per night ( and that excludes weekend possessions) then 4, 5, 6, 7 , 8, 9, 10, 11, 12 September is 9 runs. So we may well be down to only 11 wire runs left. That is my "Glass is half full " answer anyway.

That seems to be what my current estimate is too; let's go for 90/98 if any more wiring gets done this weekend.

 

[GRALISTAIR]

That seems to be what my current estimate is too; let's go for 90/98 if any more wiring gets done this weekend.

Yes sir - I concur and I bet Dave aka LDECRexile does a quick run early next week also.

 

[Elecman]

The M61 bridge issue will be temporarily overcome by physically barriering off the hard shoulders at both sides of the motorway, like they have done with the M55 bridge ( which is still barriered off and not apparently complete with work still to be done between now and Christmas), so how long the M61 Bridge will be is anyone’s guess. The M55 does at least have a solid parapet probably to the old BR non TSI standard unlike the open one on the M61, which wouldn’t comply with even the old standard ( strangely the bridge over the Westhoughton line looks like the M55 bridge as if that had been made electrification ready at some pount during eithervrepairs or rebuild).

 

[LDECRexile]

Yes sir - I concur and I bet Dave aka LDECRexile does a quick run early next week also.

I will be away Friday am to Monday pm, when I should be able to process any photos received. I then have family commitments Tues, Weds and Fri, so Thursday 20th will be my only jauntable day next week.

 

[reg]

Bolton-platform 3 run off towards Bradshawgate tunnel now wired.Platform 5 wiring has started and further work noted in the Bullfield area.Photos to follow

 

[Bertie the bus]

The M61 bridge issue will be temporarily overcome by physically barriering off the hard shoulders at both sides of the motorway, like they have done with the M55 bridge ( which is still barriered off and not apparently complete with work still to be done between now and Christmas), so how long the M61 Bridge will be is anyone’s guess.

What is the greater risk? Removing the hard shoulder on a stretch of motorway or somebody falling off a motorway bridge? Absolutely ridiculous, especially when you look at the White Rose Way in Doncaster, which opened in 2013, crosses about six electrified tracks and has a very low parapet.

 

[GRALISTAIR]

What is the greater risk? Removing the hard shoulder on a stretch of motorway or somebody falling off a motorway bridge? Absolutely ridiculous, especially when you look at the White Rose Way in Doncaster, which opened in 2013, crosses about six electrified tracks and has a very low parapet.

I must post a photo of the bridge that takes D'Urton Lane/Haighton Green Lane over the M6/M55 at Broughton Roundabout Interchange Junction 32 on M6. Note the Guild Wheel Cycle path , people walking their dogs etc- but it is road over a road/MWay - so completely utterly disgusting double standards - almost zero protection.

 

[Clip]

I must post a photo of the bridge that takes D'Urton Lane/Haighton Green Lane over the M6/M55 at Broughton Roundabout Interchange Junction 32 on M6. Note the Guild Wheel Cycle path , people walking their dogs etc- but it is road over a road/MWay - so completely utterly disgusting double standards - almost zero protection.

The difference being, of course, is that road traffic can maneuver out the way and slow down in time to swerve(for those coming up on to an incident.

Someone toppling off onto an electrified railway do not have that sort of thing to happen as not only do they have wires to kill them but a train isn't able to swerve nor slow do sufficiently to come to a stop should that happen so rather than 'disgusting double standards' it seems a perfectly sensible precaution to have in place.

 

[Bertie the bus]

How many people fall off bridges? Fall, not jump in some stupid drunken prank or a suicide bid.

 

[Ianno87]

What is the greater risk? Removing the hard shoulder on a stretch of motorway or somebody falling off a motorway bridge? Absolutely ridiculous, especially when you look at the White Rose Way in Doncaster, which opened in 2013, crosses about six electrified tracks and has a very low parapet.

Smart Motorways operate without a hard shoulder at the busiest times (with periodic laybys instead). Suggests that closing a short section is introducing little risk, based on highways precedents.

 

[edwin_m]

Someone toppling off onto an electrified railway do not have that sort of thing to happen as not only do they have wires to kill them but a train isn't able to swerve nor slow do sufficiently to come to a stop should that happen so rather than 'disgusting double standards' it seems a perfectly sensible precaution to have in place.

All that's equally true with a non-electrified railway, so the parapet height mist be to address an electrification-related hazard. I've always believed it was to do with the risk of dangling items down onto the wires.

 

[Elecman]

All that's equally true with a non-electrified railway, so the parapet height mist be to address an electrification-related hazard. I've always believed it was to do with the risk of dangling items down onto the wires.

Afaik, that# exactly what the parapet height is all about.

 

[Bertie the bus]

Smart Motorways operate without a hard shoulder at the busiest times (with periodic laybys instead). Suggests that closing a short section is introducing little risk, based on highways precedents.

The M61 isn't a smart motorway. I didn't suggest it will increase risk significantly, what I said was it will be a greater risk than somebody falling off it, or as the conversation has moved on, dangling something off it. It's a motorway about 1 mile from the nearest junction so the chances of a pedestrian being there is infinitesimally small, except for occupants of a broken down vehicle and they usually have bigger things to worry about than dangling things off bridges.

 

[LDECRexile]

Bolton-platform 3 run off towards Bradshawgate tunnel now wired.Platform 5 wiring has started and further work noted in the Bullfield area.Photos to follow

..and here they are, added to Reg's album here:

https://www.flickr.com/photos/127646831@N03/albums/72157671732263863

and added to the Combined Volume here:

https://www.flickr.com/photos/127646831@N03/albums/72157661069863633

Thank you Reg.

I'll be off to Germany first thing in the morning, back Monday pm, when I'll be pleased to process any photos people may send in the meantime, hopefully of knitting galore.

 

[snowball]

Press release

https://www.networkrail.co.uk/feeds...with-better-access-at-kirkham-wesham-station/

Kirkham & Wesham station to have step-free access to all platforms thanks to the Great North Rail Project.


Passengers in Kirkham & Wesham are to benefit from lifts and a new footbridge which links a brand new platform to the station, providing easier access to trains, thanks to the recent upgrade of the Preston to Blackpool railway.

Yesterday (13 September) the MP for Fylde, Mark Menzies, unveiled a commemorative plaque at the station as Network Rail, Northern, Lancashire County Council, local town councillors and rail user group members marked the station upgrade during a short ceremony at the station.

Kirkham & Wesham station has benefited from an improved track layout, the installation of a new platform with lifts which will provide access to all platforms, as well as electrification as part of Blackpool’s recent rail revolution.

Mark Menzies, MP for Fydle said: “When I became an MP, improving the access at Kirkham Station was a project I made a priority and I am delighted to see not one but two lifts, ensuring the station will be fully accessible to everyone.

“For too long the station was a no-go area for those with disabilities, anyone with a pram, or even heavy shopping.

“In this day and age, there should be no barrier to someone in a wheelchair or someone with a pushchair being able to access services.”

Andrew Morgan, senior sponsor for Network Rail, said: “As part of our multi-billion pound Great North Rail Project, Kirkham & Wesham station has been transformed with a new platform, footbridge and lifts.

“The work – which included rebuilding the existing platforms – has been delivered alongside our upgrade of Blackpool’s railway which has enabled the introduction of greener, quieter and more modern electric trains on the route.

“The accessibility improvements we are making will not only benefit disabled people or those with reduced mobility, but also those with children, heavy luggage or shopping.”

Craig Harrop, Interim Regional Director for Northern said: “We’re delighted that Kirkham & Wesham station will benefit from a new platform, two new lifts and a footbridge.

“The upgrade work helps to support us on our journey to making the Northern network accessible to all and furthers our commitment to inclusive rail travel.

Kirkham station provides a key route into and out of the Fylde area, and the new infrastructure will provide our customers with a modern environment and easy access for years to come.”

Liz Oades, Kirkham’s Lancashire County and Fylde Council member said: “Having spent so many years campaigning for a lift at the Station I am thrilled that we are now getting two lifts, I am also very happy to see improvements to the station and the stock and I’m hopeful we will now be given the service passengers in the north deserve.

“Work is ongoing between the Council and the Rail Authorities to provide parking facilities at the Station, this will enable the improved facilities to be enjoyed by all without inconvenience to our residents.”

Final testing of the station’s two new lifts has now been completed and they will be open to passengers from next week.

For more information visit: www.networkrail.co.uk/blackpool

There's also a tweet with video:

https://twitter.com/TheGNRP/status/1040587578209120256

 

[td97]

Bad news: electric service not expected until May 2019.

However, because of the delays to that scheme, the first electrical services will not be seen in Bolton until at least May 2019.

https://www.theboltonnews.co.uk/news/16860529.special-report-northerns-500m-new-fleet/
Whether the infrastructure can be delivered before then, and the diesel timetable being fulfilled using some electric trains, remains to be seen.
Apart from Lostock substation, there's not a great deal left to complete. The testing of the piles for the retaining wall there should be underway. But if they've failed the test (and I'm not aware of the result either way), that is definitely a reason to further delay the scheme.

 

[superkev]

Interesting video posted somewhere else on here shows 16km of swiss electrification in just 9 days. How far is Manchester Preston?
K

 

[Jonny]

Interesting video posted somewhere else on here shows 16km of swiss electrification in just 9 days. How far is Manchester Preston?
K

I suspect that the underlying geology is quite different.

 

[absolutelymilk]

Bad news: electric service not expected until May 2019.

https://www.theboltonnews.co.uk/news/16860529.special-report-northerns-500m-new-fleet/
Whether the infrastructure can be delivered before then, and the diesel timetable being fulfilled using some electric trains, remains to be seen.
Apart from Lostock substation, there's not a great deal left to complete. The testing of the piles for the retaining wall there should be underway. But if they've failed the test (and I'm not aware of the result either way), that is definitely a reason to further delay the scheme.

I presume this means services timed for electric stock given that testing is due for the start of October?

 

[snowball]

My guess is that the Bolton News is just misinterpreting the fact that the previously poposed December timetable will not happen until May.

 

[DJH1971]

My guess is that the Bolton News is just misinterpreting the fact that the previously poposed December timetable will not happen until May.

My money is also on that.

I don't think passengers can stomach bustitution for that much longer

 

[td97]

I presume this means services timed for electric stock given that testing is due for the start of October?

The optimist in me hopes so. However, Bolton News reports have so far been very accurate in terms of the progress given on the scheme. Although I am aware of aspects of the project internally, I have no idea on any overall project timescales. Regarding electrical testing, AFAIK the initial testing plan is to send electricity from Lostock to Salford first, make sure all is ok and then switch it off. A while (days? weeks?) later, electricity is sent in the direction of Preston to make sure it works that way too.

 

[snowball]

The optimist in me hopes so. However, Bolton News reports have so far been very accurate in terms of the progress given on the scheme. Although I am aware of aspects of the project internally, I have no idea on any overall project timescales. Regarding electrical testing, AFAIK the initial testing plan is to send electricity from Lostock to Salford first, make sure all is ok and then switch it off. A while (days? weeks?) later, electricity is sent in the direction of Preston to make sure it works that way too.

I don't think either of those is possible, given that Lostock is not a feeder station, i.e. does not have its own connection to the grid. What I imagine is possible is that Salford to Lostock could first be made live, fed from the feeder station near Newton-le-Willows via Ordsall Lane (assuming the feed from Heyrod is not available yet), and then Euxton to Lostock, fed from the WCML via Euxton.

 

[td97]

I don't think either of those is possible, given that Lostock is not a feeder station, i.e. does not have its own connection to the grid. What I imagine is possible is that Salford to Lostock could first be made live, fed from the feeder station near Newton-le-Willows via Ordsall Lane (assuming the feed from Heyrod is not available yet), and then Euxton to Lostock, fed from the WCML via Euxton.

My background isn't electrical engineering, but your description definitely sounds plausible!

 

[SodTheDrummer]

My guess is that the Bolton News is just misinterpreting the fact that the previously poposed December timetable will not happen until May.

My money is also on that.

I don't think passengers can stomach bustitution for that much longer

The BN tends to misinterpret most things!

 

[wrinkley]

The AT cables are going in under bridges, Dean Clough yesterday and Ladybridge today. Photos to Dave for Monday.

 

[Bertie the bus]

My guess is that the Bolton News is just misinterpreting the fact that the previously poposed December timetable will not happen until May.

It was officially announced a while back electric services won’t start until next year (no actual date given) and will then be “phased in”. I suspect the Bolton News has got it pretty correct and a full EMU service won’t operate until May.

 

[snowball]

It was officially announced a while back electric services won’t start until next year (no actual date given) and will then be “phased in”. I suspect the Bolton News has got it pretty correct and a full EMU service won’t operate until May.

But that's not what it says. It says "However, because of the delays to that scheme, the first electrical services will not be seen in Bolton until at least May 2019."