GWR's recent declining performance?

[PHILIPE]

I was on a rammed 3 coach 150 doing the Portsmouth to Cardiff yesterday (Saturday) afternoon. I thought all these old 150’s would have gone by now and certainly not being used on such a service.

Regular occurrence on this route, so if there were no 158s available would you prefer the train to be cancelled ? After the exodus of the 150/1s apart from 125 and 126 which should go at the end of the year, there are no more going anywhere soon.

 

[Envoy]

Regular occurrence on this route, so if there were no 158s available would you prefer the train to be cancelled ? After the exodus of the 150/1s apart from 125 and 126 which should go at the end of the year, there are no more going anywhere soon.

Thank you for your reply PHILIPE. It was most unpleasant being stuck on this train. I also saw a pretty full 3 coach 158 going the other way when we arrived in Bath. Looks like I will have to use my car for journeys between south Wales and Southampton until things improve - if ever. (The planned introduction of 165/6’s is not exactly what one would expect on such a journey). At least my car will have a working air-con system and I can set my own desired temperature and I am guaranteed a seat.

 

[PHILIPE]

Thank you for your reply PHILIPE. It was most unpleasant being stuck on this train. I also saw a pretty full 3 coach 158 going the other way when we arrived in Bath. Looks like I will have to use my car for journeys between south Wales and Southampton until things improve - if ever. (The planned introduction of 165/6’s is not exactly what one would expect on such a journey). At least my car will have a working air-con system and I can set my own desired temperature and I am guaranteed a seat.

Great. I like the bit about your car and it's working Air-Con system. Unfortunately things may not improve when the Turbos with their unwelcoming interiors (2 + 3 seating) take over.

 

[Parallel]

Thank you for your reply PHILIPE. It was most unpleasant being stuck on this train. I also saw a pretty full 3 coach 158 going the other way when we arrived in Bath. Looks like I will have to use my car for journeys between south Wales and Southampton until things improve - if ever. (The planned introduction of 165/6’s is not exactly what one would expect on such a journey). At least my car will have a working air-con system and I can set my own desired temperature and I am guaranteed a seat.

Believe it or not you were lucky it was 3-car. I saw a 2-car 150/1 operating on the route the other day, that looked absolutely packed.

 

[Envoy]

Believe it or not you were lucky it was 3-car. I saw a 2-car 150/1 operating on the route the other day, that looked absolutely packed.

One wonders how many people would use these services if they had decent trains with enough capacity and comfortable internal temperature? Clearly, they are popular services but possibly these people do not have the choice of using a car. I suppose that nothing new will be ordered until it is decided who will run the GWR going forward?

 

[RichT54]

I was on the 1518 Reading to Gatwick service yesterday (Sunday), pleased to have managed leaving Reading before the mass exodus from the Reading Festival. The train was full, with a lot having to stand. However just outside Wokingham we came to a stop and were held for about 45 minutes before the train was driven back to Winnersh station. The guard had announced there was a broken down SWR train blocking the line at Wokingham and they were waiting for a specialist engineer to fix the problem.

The train crew arranged to have two Reading bound trains stop at Winnersh and were trying to encourage everyone to go back to Reading. A number of passengers did so, but a lot (including myself) stayed with the train, not wishing to get caught up with the festival crowds. Some passengers arranged their own taxis, but when I tried I couldn't find any available, plus being a Sunday, the last bus to Bracknell had left. The guard managed to get some taxis to come from Maidenhead but was prioritising passengers for Gatwick. A short while after these taxis arrived, the train driver was notified that the line had been cleared and myself and the remaining passengers trooped back on the train.

I arrived back in Blackwater about 1900, 3.5 hours later than scheduled. Clearly not GWR's fault and I think the train crew were trying their best to help, although they were hampered by lack of information. I overheard someone say that the specialist had gone to Woking instead of Wokingham which, if true, would not have helped. Most passengers stayed calm, but a few younger ones were having a go at the train crew for apparently not doing enough to help.

National Rail Enquiries listed it as an "Operational Incident" - does anyone know what actually happened?

 

[father_jack]

I was on the 1518 Reading to Gatwick service yesterday (Sunday), pleased to have managed leaving Reading before the mass exodus from the Reading Festival. The train was full, with a lot having to stand. However just outside Wokingham we came to a stop and were held for about 45 minutes before the train was driven back to Winnersh station. The guard had announced there was a broken down SWR train blocking the line at Wokingham and they were waiting for a specialist engineer to fix the problem.

The train crew arranged to have two Reading bound trains stop at Winnersh and were trying to encourage everyone to go back to Reading. A number of passengers did so, but a lot (including myself) stayed with the train, not wishing to get caught up with the festival crowds. Some passengers arranged their own taxis, but when I tried I couldn't find any available, plus being a Sunday, the last bus to Bracknell had left. The guard managed to get some taxis to come from Maidenhead but was prioritising passengers for Gatwick. A short while after these taxis arrived, the train driver was notified that the line had been cleared and myself and the remaining passengers trooped back on the train.

I arrived back in Blackwater about 1900, 3.5 hours later than scheduled. Clearly not GWR's fault and I think the train crew were trying their best to help, although they were hampered by lack of information. I overheard someone say that the specialist had gone to Woking instead of Wokingham which, if true, would not have helped. Most passengers stayed calm, but a few younger ones were having a go at the train crew for apparently not doing enough to help.

National Rail Enquiries listed it as an "Operational Incident" - does anyone know what actually happened?

Electric train misrouted by signaller and driver took the route and went into non third rail country.

 

[RichT54]

Electric train misrouted by signaller and driver took the route and went into non third rail country.

Thank you.

 

[Geoff DC]

Thread on Great Western Passengers' Forum goes into considerable detail on this event

 

[peter166]

At approx. 1pm today GWR has 76 Train Formation Updates, 19 Other Train Service Updates & 1 Cancellation listed on its JourneyCheck page.
Many of the trains formerly operated by HST's and now operated by Class 800/802's seem to be reduced from 10 or 9 coaches to only 5 coaches.
Is this currently the norm on a daily basis?

 

[PHILIPE]

At approx. 1pm today GWR has 76 Train Formation Updates, 19 Other Train Service Updates & 1 Cancellation listed on its JourneyCheck page.
Many of the trains formerly operated by HST's and now operated by Class 800/802's seem to be reduced from 10 or 9 coaches to only 5 coaches.
Is this currently the norm on a daily basis?

Unfortunately it is and has been for a very long time. You can read some current discussion about the IETs here:-

www.railforums.co.uk/threads/class-800.100841/page-283

 

[Parallel]

At approx. 1pm today GWR has 76 Train Formation Updates, 19 Other Train Service Updates & 1 Cancellation listed on its JourneyCheck page.
Many of the trains formerly operated by HST's and now operated by Class 800/802's seem to be reduced from 10 or 9 coaches to only 5 coaches.
Is this currently the norm on a daily basis?

There were 105 when I checked early this morning - I’m glad I’m doing a trip around Scotland/other parts of the UK at the moment. It’s been a nice break - I have had far fewer issues all trip than when I commute for one day with GWR.

 

[FGW_DID]

This was my post around half twelve today reference the IET shortforms:

When I last looked there were 36 units available for 43 working diagrams.

There are 5x 5 vice 10 formations out today, one of which is because a 5 car IET is covering an HST diagram.

Conversely there are two HST vice IET, one of which is due to Driver traction knowledge.

Those 5 short formations affected 27 services. Quite a lot of the numerous shortforms listed were things like 2 vice 3. Dont forget, all it takes is for a 2 car to substitute for a 3 car on a diagram that shuttles backwards and forwards loads of times, every trip is shown as a shortform.

 

[PHILIPE]

This was my post around half twelve today reference the IET shortforms:



Those 5 short formations affected 27 services. Quite a lot of the numerous shortforms listed were things like 2 vice 3. Dont forget, all it takes is for a 2 car to substitute for a 3 car on a diagram that shuttles backwards and forwards loads of times, every trip is shown as a shortform.

Most of Journey Check yesterday was filled up with every train all day quoted as short formed on the St. Ives Branch

 

[Pete_uk]

Quite a few London - Cheltenham services cancelled Sunday. Local news paper had the problems on its front page

 

[Mag_seven]

Quite a few London - Cheltenham services cancelled Sunday. Local news paper had the problems on its front page

Unfortunately due to the ongoing (being going on for weeks and weeks now) problem with staff shortages on Sundays, the through Padd-Cheltenham services always seem to be hit badly. If I was a local MP I would be making representations to GWR about it.

 

[PHILIPE]

Quite a few London - Cheltenham services cancelled Sunday. Local news paper had the problems on its front page

Just last Sunday. Its been like this the best part of a year now on this route.

 

[D2007wsm]

Yesterday some of the issues would have been caused by a poorly Turbo, 166207 I seem to recall..
This was the 08:41 from Weston-super-Mare to Cardiff Central, due in to Temple Meads at 09:15.

This train left Worle late at about 09:15 and there was major problems. The driver was having difficulty getting enough power for the train to move off. Once he did get it moving, it proceeded towards Yatton between 14 & 20mph. On arrival at Yatton, it was decided to run non stop from there emitting Nailsea & Backwell, Parson Street and Bedminster to Temple Meads. However between Yatton and Nailsea the train lost all power and ground to a halt and had to stop. After leaving Nailsea, it was then stop start all the way to the Flax Bourton where the train had to keep stopping, shut everything down before it would move at a snail's pace. On the uphill section, the train slipped back each time as the driver could not get enough power to make the train move. Relief came when we reached the downhill section into Bristol where the train could coast all the way into Bristol until it reached a red signal at Parson Street. After stopping here, when the green light came the engines worked normally into Temple Meads arriving around 10:35 rather than 09:15. At this point apparently 5/6 trains were stacked up behind.

What springs to mind as upon leaving Weston & Worle it was apparent there was a major problem. Why wasn't the train put into the loop just before Yatton to wait for another Turbo on the preceding service to couple to to assist into Bristol? This would have only caused a small delay as it was only around 10 mins behind?

 

[PHILIPE]

Yesterday some of the issues would have been caused by a poorly Turbo, 166207 I seem to recall..
This was the 08:41 from Weston-super-Mare to Cardiff Central, due in to Temple Meads at 09:15.

This train left Worle late at about 09:15 and there was major problems. The driver was having difficulty getting enough power for the train to move off. Once he did get it moving, it proceeded towards Yatton between 14 & 20mph. On arrival at Yatton, it was decided to run non stop from there emitting Nailsea & Backwell, Parson Street and Bedminster to Temple Meads. However between Yatton and Nailsea the train lost all power and ground to a halt and had to stop. After leaving Nailsea, it was then stop start all the way to the Flax Bourton where the train had to keep stopping, shut everything down before it would move at a snail's pace. On the uphill section, the train slipped back each time as the driver could not get enough power to make the train move. Relief came when we reached the downhill section into Bristol where the train could coast all the way into Bristol until it reached a red signal at Parson Street. After stopping here, when the green light came the engines worked normally into Temple Meads arriving around 10:35 rather than 09:15. At this point apparently 5/6 trains were stacked up behind.

What springs to mind as upon leaving Weston & Worle it was apparent there was a major problem. Why wasn't the train put into the loop just before Yatton to wait for another Turbo on the preceding service to couple to to assist into Bristol? This would have only caused a small delay as it was only around 10 mins behind?

I'm not sure myself but are loaded passenger trains authorised to use the loop ? Perhaps this was a factor

 

[PHILIPE]

Unfortunately due to the ongoing (being going on for weeks and weeks now) problem with staff shortages on Sundays, the through Padd-Cheltenham services always seem to be hit badly. If I was a local MP I would be making representations to GWR about it.

As the Cheltenham services are mostly out and back it might be that this is operationally the most convenient route from which to withdraw trains without impacting on the whole network. If an MP was to kick up and priority was given to running the Cheltenham services then something else would have to go. I must say that there have been signs of improvement recently.

 

[railfan26]

Have been on a train that parked up in the loop on the other side to let a fast train overtake so presume same rules apply on the other side

 

[peter166]

Once again today many short formed trains, currently over 40 listed. Many 5 coaches instead of 9 or 10 so clearly missing Class 800's. Surely this is not acceptable. I have not seen any apology or explanation from GWR for this unaacceptably high level of short formed trains on inter-city and regional routes, which seems to continue on a daily basis, or for how long this is likely to continue.
One of the banner headlines on the GWR website states " more seats, more trains " superimposed on a picture of a class 800. .....might be worth contacting the ASA for mis-leading information.

 

[FGW_DID]

It’s half twelve, journey check currently showing 38 affected services, less than half are 5v10.

Have you read any of the threads on this forum about the 800s?
Somebody has even posted quoting replies from the GWR Twitter feed.
There are only 3 5v10 formations out today so that’s less than yesterday when you posted about the same thing.

 

[zoneking]

The 17.50 from Guildford to Redhill is always at least 6 minutes late.

 

[peter166]

It’s half twelve, journey check currently showing 38 affected services, less than half are 5v10.

Have you read any of the threads on this forum about the 800s?
Somebody has even posted quoting replies from the GWR Twitter feed.
There are only 3 5v10 formations out today so that’s less than yesterday when you posted about the same thing.

You appear to be defending GWR's appalling service.
If each 5 v 10 diagram makes 3 return trips then thats alot of passengers inconvenienced and it appears to be happening to a lesser or more often greater extent every day. How is that an acceptable level of service.

There are also cancellations and part cancellations as well.

Today I was due to travel from Filton at 13.48 to Gloucester due 14.31(service from Weymouth) for an appointment. The train was apparently cancelled from Bristol. I missed my appointment

Oh. and I've just noticed it didn't start from Weymouth either but from Yeovil ! So cancelled at both ends of the journey !!
.

 

[Darandio]

It’s half twelve, journey check currently showing 38 affected services, less than half are 5v10.

Have you read any of the threads on this forum about the 800s?
Somebody has even posted quoting replies from the GWR Twitter feed.
There are only 3 5v10 formations out today so that’s less than yesterday when you posted about the same thing.

So still an utter shambles then?

 

[irish_rail]

Doesnt help when 800s on diesel mode get prioritised over on time HSTS departing Reading for London, net result, on time HST becomes 15 late into London and delays it's next journey west in the process....

 

[cactustwirly]

Doesnt help when 800s on diesel mode get prioritised over on time HSTS departing Reading for London, net result, on time HST becomes 15 late into London and delays it's next journey west in the process....

Well a diesel mode 800 can do the Reading - London journey quicker than a HST because of its superior acceleration

 

[Parallel]

You appear to be defending GWR's appalling service.
If each 5 v 10 diagram makes 3 return trips then thats alot of passengers inconvenienced and it appears to be happening to a lesser or more often greater extent every day. How is that an acceptable level of service.

There are also cancellations and part cancellations as well.

Today I was due to travel from Filton at 13.48 to Gloucester due 14.31(service from Weymouth) for an appointment. The train was apparently cancelled from Bristol. I missed my appointment

Oh. and I've just noticed it didn't start from Weymouth either but from Yeovil ! So cancelled at both ends of the journey !!
.

That’s unfortunate. What’s particularly unusual is the part cancellation of the Weymouth to Yeovil section. This can’t have been something that would be taken lightly due to that section of line only getting 1tp2h and it’s not something you see often. JC has this down as being a train fault. Must’ve been a pretty bad train fault to warrant cancelling it at Yeovil, and then Bristol on the return!

(Assuming this was a Turbo) - Why are the Turbos so unreliable? Someone has said previously they were the pride of the fleet when they were based at Reading!

 

[FGW_DID]

You appear to be defending GWR's appalling service.
If each 5 v 10 diagram makes 3 return trips then thats alot of passengers inconvenienced and it appears to be happening to a lesser or more often greater extent every day. How is that an acceptable level of service.

There are also cancellations and part cancellations as well.

Today I was due to travel from Filton at 13.48 to Gloucester due 14.31(service from Weymouth) for an appointment. The train was apparently cancelled from Bristol. I missed my appointment

Oh. and I've just noticed it didn't start from Weymouth either but from Yeovil ! So cancelled at both ends of the journey !!
.

No, just pointing that there aren't as many shortformed formations running around as some posters like to make out (especially when it relates to the IETs). You are right though, even just three formations has an impact on a lot of passenger (12 services affected today) An IET is covering some HST work (the 5 vice 8s) which would otherwise mean a cancellation of services, however I'm sure you'll probably agree 5 coaches may be an inconvenience but no coaches would be even more inconvenient!

As you point out there are also other cancellations and part cancellations, these are the result of a number of issues which include such examples as:

• Unit fault
• Track Circuit failure
• Points Failure
• ARS fault
• Swan on the line
• Axle Counter failure
• Failed Freight Train

The reasons for the 800 shortforms are well documented on the forum and until Hitachi can deliver all the units and deliver enough units daily for GWR service, then the IET shortforms will unfortunately continue. Its not a fantastic situation for anybody!

Not that it helps you but the service you said were due to travel on was affected by a Points failure at East Somerset Jn. (Terminated at Bristol as unit was required at SPM)