New DMU fleet FGW/TPX/Northern

[MCR247]

From Dec, the derby terminators do go to Sheffield

 

[asylumxl]

True but the MML services instead of terminating at at Derby could carry onto Sheffield to terminate there with the existing Sheffield terminators terminating maybe at Doncaster?

It's more point to point performance that's the issue, rather than stopping patterns.

The distance between stations is relatively small, and the 222s need to get up to speed relatively fast to keep time.

If the 91s were introduced I'd assume that they'd need to make alterations to the stopping patterns, and I fear the southern MML stations would lose out.

 

[WillPS]

Perhaps I'm a little biased, but I've always thought that the Southern stations should really be served by FCC or the like in to London, and that Midland Mainline/East Midlands Trains' service should be predominantly for those in the East Midlands and South Yorkshire.

 

[tbtc]

If the 91s were introduced I'd assume that they'd need to make alterations to the stopping patterns, and I fear the southern MML stations would lose out

I can see how the casual logic of 91s to the MML works (they'll be displaced from the ECML and need to go somewhere), but at the moment 222s are working both the "long" and "short" MML services. Whilst the 91s could do the "fast" services to Sheffield and Nottingham, they'd probably struggle with the slower duties. Plus getting one into Loughborough may be a squeeze!

As for WillPS - I'd agree that (if there was space) it'd suit the railway to give all stations south of Leicester to Thameslink (including the Corby branch), meaning Sheffield/ Derby/ Nottingham had non stop services to London, apart from maybe the odd one at Luton Airport.

 

[asylumxl]

You're basically saying that you (northerners) are entitled to fast services, and the southern stations are not. The majority of northern MML stations are served by multiple TOCs with several routes. Believe it or not, many of us southerners do use EMT to go North, so I think expanding our stations into the FCC franchise is an idiotic idea.

 

[MCR247]

I think It'd be a good idea to elcetrify Grantham - Nottingham, and have some express servies running via the ECML, and EMT via Leicester calling at places like bedford that they call at now

 

[Aictos]

You're basically saying that you (northerners) are entitled to fast services, and the southern stations are not. The majority of northern MML stations are served by multiple TOCs with several routes. Believe it or not, many of us southerners do use EMT to go North, so I think expanding our stations into the FCC franchise is an idiotic idea.

Fair dues, let everyone catch a EMT service at Bedford :roll: but what about St Albans City which according to FCC's marketing experts is the busiest FCC station outside London, surely they deserve a proper IC service?

How many EMT services stop there? None, that's it! Yet St Albans City is much much more busier then Bedford, Luton, Luton Airport Parkway combined!

Instead of stopping them at Luton, why not use St Albans City instead as it's more to the half way point between St Pancras and Bedford then Luton is, and passengers from Luton could easily use St Albans City or Bedford for their connections much like passengers at St Neots, Sandy, Biggleswade etc have to rely on Stevenage.

Go SAC!!!

 

[tbtc]

You're basically saying that you (northerners) are entitled to fast services, and the southern stations are not. The majority of northern MML stations are served by multiple TOCs with several routes. Believe it or not, many of us southerners do use EMT to go North, so I think expanding our stations into the FCC franchise is an idiotic idea.

It seems to work on the ECML; most long distance trains are non stop from Peterborough to London (apart from a handful that stop at Stevenage). There's plenty scope to interchange at Peterborough.

There's certainly no need for the long distance MML services to stop at more than one station south of Wellingborough, but how do you split the demand between Bedford/ Luton/ Luton Airport?

Running the "intercity" trains non stop south of Leicester would mean Wellingborough/ Kettering/ Corby/ Market Harborough would have a much more frequent service, and allow for interchange at Leicester.

Can you imagine Virgin having to stop their Birmingham/ Manchester trains at Hemel Hempsted/ Bletchley?

 

[Drsatan]

Running the "intercity" trains non stop south of Leicester would mean Wellingborough/ Kettering/ Corby/ Market Harborough would have a much more frequent service, and allow for interchange at Leicester.

Can you imagine Virgin having to stop their Birmingham/ Manchester trains at Hemel Hempsted/ Bletchley?

But, not everyone will want to change trains at Leicester, especially if you are infirm or have a lot of luggage. Also, I'm fairly sure in BR days a few Intercity services stopped at Bletchley, but that was before Milton Keynes station was opened. Now all the Manchester services call there because there's more demand at Milton Keynes and the two stations are only a few miles apart.

 

[asylumxl]

Fair dues, let everyone catch a EMT service at Bedford :roll: but what about St Albans City which according to FCC's marketing experts is the busiest FCC station outside London, surely they deserve a proper IC service?

Because it already has the Brighton service, a direct non-stop service to St Pancras.

You say it's more than Bedford, Luton, Luton Airport Parkway combined. Have you actually added up the figures for 2008?

SAC most certainly does not get 9.36 million passengers a year! It's almost 3 million short..

 

[Aictos]

Because it already has the Brighton service, a direct non-stop service to St Pancras.

You say it's more than Bedford, Luton, Luton Airport Parkway combined. Have you actually added up the figures for 2008?

SAC most certainly does not get 9.36 million passengers a year! It's almost 3 million short..

Yes but even still, it's still the most busiest of them all which is why St Albans should have EMT services instead of Luton.

Luton enjoys the Brighton service anyway passengers at Luton wanting connections at St Albans only have to wait about 15 minutes for their journey which isn't bad which is like Huntingdon passengers waiting a similar time.

Besides, there's already Luton Airport Parkway do EMT really need to stop at Luton as well?

EMT services should be staggered with every other service calling at either Bedford or St Albans after St Pancras but with every service calling at Luton Airport Parkway for the airport.

Luton in turn would still have the FCCs offering direct services to the capital taking about 30 or so minutes which seeing as it's a 24/7 service ain't that bad plus as well as the Brighton services, you have the Sutton services not to mention the FCC/SouthEastern services as well.

 

[asylumxl]

EMT service already is staggered, there are many trains which skip Luton and Bedford entirely. (e.g. first stop as Leicster or Market Harborough).

2tph from Luton and Luton Airport Parkway to London.

 

[tbtc]

But, not everyone will want to change trains at Leicester, especially if you are infirm or have a lot of luggage

True, but then the railways will never serve all markets.

Look at the current timetable - EMT stop hourly at Luton (London - Corby service) and hourly at Luton Airport (London - Nottingham "semi fast") - both of these serve Bedford.

But then you'll get someone complaining that Luton doesn't have a direct train to the East Midlands, and that Luton Airport doesn't have a direct train to Derby/ Sheffield etc etc. The only way to solve it would be to make all trains "all stoppers"...

Best way to do it is to identify the main markets (East Midlands to London and Bedfordshire to London) and concentrate on fast trains serving those markets directly, with connections available for the smaller market of people wanting to go from Market Harborough to Derby.

Alternatively, EMT should impose restrictions on Bedford/ Luton/ Luton Airport (no pick ups southbound, no set downs northbound), like Virgin have at Watford IIRC, to ensure that there are enough seats for people travelling between London and places that don't have an alternative service.

Anyhow, if you're going to stop south of Bedford, then I'd find Kentish Town more useful than Luton

 

[asylumxl]

Anyhow, if you're going to stop south of Bedford, then I'd find Kentish Town more useful than Luton

And if you're gonna stop North of it, avoid ****field . Derby is more useful.

 

[Fincra5]

So 319s are going to TPE to run which service…? Manchester Airport to Liverpool, and Manchester Airport to Glasgow? That's the only electric routes that TPE will run once electrification is complete, and 319s don't seem good enough to go all the way to Scotland from Manchester?

Plus, I hope they refurbish them when they come to TPE!!

319s would be able to go from Manchester to Scotland, i have no doubt about it.