Your opinions on Vladimir Putin?

[Bromley boy]

Would you say the same about Alexander Litvinenko? Or any of the other Russians who have suffered mysterious and dubious "suicides"

Yes, Litvinenko fully deserved what he got. Frankly, he deserved to die hard.

Good on the russins for doing the necessary, to dispose of a disgusting traitor.

As for Corbyn (and apologies for the topic drift here, I'll try to keep it brief) to accuse him of cowardice over Syria is to completely misrepresent the situation in that country: namely that unfortunately the deaths of many thousands of civilians in Syria was sadly inevitable. The only difference being whether they died from chemical weapons deployed by Assad/Daesh/the ragtag of rebel groups, or whether they died as "collateral damage" from friendly British or American bombs. As someone posted earlier, we haven't developed technology that allows munitions to distinguish between the "goodies" and the "baddies" yet.

The above doesn’t hang together, or even
make grammatical sense, as a coherent argument.

Maybe you should revise it?

 

[61653 HTAFC]

@DarloRich with regard to post #137 (not quoting the post as I'm on a mobile and it was long):

At the end of the Cold War, there's an argument to be made that NATO was obsolete. With the way Russia has gone, disbanding NATO would have been a mistake, but had the organisation not expanded eastwards (which was largely at the behest of BAe Systems and Lockheed Martin, incidentally) just maybe Russia wouldn't be the aggressor it now appears to be.

You (and others) keep saying that Corbyn hates Western values, and thinks all of the world's problems are down to Western imperialism, which is patently untrue. If he hates Western values how come he's an advocate for LGBT+ rights? Something that wouldn't make him popular in either Russia or Saudi Arabia for example...

Colonialism is a sticky issue, but I would imagine most people view it as having had a fairly even mixture of positives (Indian railways, global trade routes, what is now modern diplomacy) and negatives (the slave-trade, apartheid, the first (of several since) genocide in what was Belgian Congo). The misrepresentation of Corbyn's position on many things is a favoured tactic of the Murdoch press, you really shouldn't lower yourself to that level.

 

[61653 HTAFC]

Yes, Litvinenko fully deserved what he got. Frankly, he deserved to die hard.

Good on the russins for doing the necessary, to dispose of a disgusting traitor.



The above doesn’t hang together, or even
make grammatical sense, as a coherent argument.

Maybe you should revise it?

Quite right, I've added some context. Can't promise it's helped as I'm extremely sleep-deprived as well as autistic!

Funnily enough, your tone in your private message earlier (which was appreciated in the context of a heated debate, by the way) was distinctly different from your recent public posts on this thread. Perhaps YOU have those the wrong way round!

 

[Bromley boy]

You (and others) keep saying that Corbyn hates Western values, and thinks all of the world's problems are down to Western imperialism, which is patently untrue. If he hates Western values how come he's an advocate for LGBT+ rights? Something that wouldn't make him popular in either Russia or Saudi Arabia for example...

Why does he ignore the existence of rampant anti semitism in his own party?

Oh well. When they get elected, it won’t be my job that goes when John McDonnell destroys the economy. Bring it on.

 

[61653 HTAFC]

Why does he ignore the existence of rampant anti semitism in his own party?

Oh well. When they get elected, it won’t be my job that goes when John McDonnell destroys the economy. Bring it on.

On the anti-Semitism thing you'd have to ask him. I agree that it's an issue the party needs to address properly rather than paying lip-service to. I do in fact plan to bring that up at my next local Labour party meeting. For the record I don't believe anti-Semitism is quite as rife in the party as it is sometimes made out to be, but elements of it do exist and need to be dealt with.

On your other point, as a railway worker you'll be well looked after I'm sure. As someone currently unable to work, I will be too:- unlike under the present government who would rather tar and feather me.

Anyway, if I don't sleep soon I probably WILL start believing in lizard-people!

 

[Bromley boy]

Quite right, I've added some context. Can't promise it's helped as I'm extremely sleep-deprived as well as autistic!

Funnily enough, your tone in your private message earlier (which was appreciated in the context of a heated debate, by the way) was distinctly different from your recent public posts on this thread. Perhaps YOU have those the wrong way round!

Well I know far better than most people not to bother arguing with someone who is autistic (my brother is, he’s a bloody nightmare).

Since you brought my private message up in public. I wrote :

“We don’t always see eye to eye but, I must say, your postings stand out as always being well thought out and eloquently written.

It’s always a pleasure doing battle with you (although I see we are in agreement on the Putin thread).

Keep up the good work”


That was meant well. I wish I hadn’t flaming well bothered writing it now!

Autism aside, it’s a shame you couldn’t just have been a big enough person to take it as the compliment intended. I’m also pretty sure you’ve breached forum rules by referencing it on here.

 

[Shaw S Hunter]

@DarloRich with regard to post #137 (not quoting the post as I'm on a mobile and it was long):

At the end of the Cold War, there's an argument to be made that NATO was obsolete. With the way Russia has gone, disbanding NATO would have been a mistake, but had the organisation not expanded eastwards (which was largely at the behest of BAe Systems and Lockheed Martin, incidentally) just maybe Russia wouldn't be the aggressor it now appears to be.

You should perhaps become more familiar with the recentish history of the Baltic States before dismissing eastward expansion of NATO as some conspiracy on the part of the arms industry. It was one of Stalin's most obvious policies to Russify said countries thereby providing a handy pretext for dealing with any perceived anti-Russian feeling there (ironic since Stalin was himself not Russian but Georgian!). You may be sure that such a pretext remains a part of Russian military strategy and the Baltic States are more than happy to have NATO defence against such a possibility. And across the wider region of eastern Europe very few people have any wish to ever again find themselves subject to Russian "influence". As such they naturally look to the west for support.

 

[61653 HTAFC]

Well I know far better than most people not to bother arguing with someone who is autistic (my brother is, he’s a bloody nightmare).

Since you brought my private message up in public. I wrote :

“We don’t always see eye to eye but, I must say, your postings stand out as always being well thought out and eloquently written.

It’s always a pleasure doing battle with you (although I see we are in agreement on the Putin thread).

Keep up the good work”


That was meant well. I wish I hadn’t flaming well bothered writing it now!

It’s a shame you couldn’t just have been a big enough person to take it as the compliment intended.

Well, as I said- the message was appreciated, and I did not mean to seem ungrateful, I'm very sorry for that. I'm tired and quite willing to admit that I'm somewhat out of my depth in this discussion now. However I'm not going to amend the offending post: I said it so I have to stand by it, even if I'm embarrassed by it. Sometimes I can manage to compose a decent and well-worded post (as you said in the private message) and other times I end up tying myself in knots!

Again, apologies. I sometimes type quicker than my brain can go, which causes me to make these faux-pas from time to time. As you mention your brother is on the spectrum, I hope that you appreciate that I did not intend to offend.

 

[Bromley boy]

Delete

 

[Bromley boy]

Delete

 

[WelshBluebird]

It was his last point. It should have been his first. Make that statement and all the trouble is reduced. The fact he doesn't means the focus is on the worn part of the speech. He raised sensible points but they are lost and/or made to look more important than the attack. I note he couldn't bring himself to criticise Russia. Why?

Do I think he could and should have made the point first, without going about other things? Yes of course I do.
And I also share some of your concerns about him regarding Russia etc.
However you claimed he did not condemn the attack. The fact is, as I proved, he did condemn it. So if you are going to try to argue against Corbyn, at least keep to the realm of fact yeah? Don't make up stuff that isn't true like the tabloids love to do. It discredits the rest of what you have to say.

 

[Kite159]

Does Corbyn really think that if a sample of the nerve agent used is sent to Russia to be checked by their team of scientists will produce anything other than a "it wasn't us" response?

 

[Bromley boy]

As you mention your brother is on the spectrum, I hope that you appreciate that I did not intend to offend.

No worries and absolutely no offence taken.

 

[Cowley]

Interesting developments today in the whole Salisbury nerve agent saga.
Over one hundred diplomats expelled from a growing list of countries around the world, perhaps most surprisingly given Trumps congratulatory phone call to Putin on winning his fixed election last week, at least 60 just from the USA...
I wonder what Putins next move will be?
I’m quite surprised to see the level of worldwide action being taken today.
It’s probably done a fair bit for Mrs May popularity too.
Interesting times.