91119: Returns to service and in Swallow livery too!

[43096]

I was fully joking sadly, but it's still not as ridiculous as some of the 442 threads
I'm genuinely interested in what would be technically feasible with 67s though.

Using 67s would not be easily technically do-able:
- if you ran with one, the stock is not set up for AAR control of the 67 in push mode and would be underpowered;
- if you ran with two, the stock is not through wired for AAR control (how many sets would you convert?);
- I'm not certain that they can actually do 125mph in daily service - it has only been done in test conditions when new.

Given the short life expectancy of the sets on East Coast, and the lack of available HSTs, then the hire of another Class 90 from DB Cargo (with some more crew training to increase flexibility) is probably the most sensible option, assuming that 91119 is a write-off.

 

[ainsworth74]

- I'm not certain that they can actually do 125mph in daily service - it has only been done in test conditions when new.

Plus they've always seemed quite sluggish when hauling sets on diversion. I wonder how long it would actually take them to get to 125 hauling a full Mk4 rake.

 

[twpsaesneg]

Using 67s would not be easily technically do-able:
- if you ran with one, the stock is not set up for AAR control of the 67 in push mode and would be underpowered;
- if you ran with two, the stock is not through wired for AAR control (how many sets would you convert?);
- I'm not certain that they can actually do 125mph in daily service - it has only been done in test conditions when new.

Given the short life expectancy of the sets on East Coast, and the lack of available HSTs, then the hire of another Class 90 from DB Cargo (with some more crew training to increase flexibility) is probably the most sensible option, assuming that 91119 is a write-off.

Thanks - that's what I was after.

And as you say, assuming that 119 is indeed dead...

I guess Virgin will just have to suck up the delay minutes for a while.

 

[Mikey C]

On a train to Peterborough last Saturday (the 10:03 Kings Cross to Leeds service) I was surprised to get an HST. Would this fire have been a reason for this

 

[D365]

On a train to Peterborough last Saturday (the 10:03 Kings Cross to Leeds service) I was surprised to get an HST. Would this fire have been a reason for this

There are a number of regular Leeds services which are booked HST.

 

[BestWestern]

Is there any report of the fire anywhere? Was it in service at the time?

 

[a_c_skinner]

still not as ridiculous as some of the 442 threads

Hey, it all came good for the 442s!

I didn't realise the 43s were coming available as slowly. Always interesting to understand the challenges the railway faces.

 

[43096]

There are a number of regular Leeds services which are booked HST.

The Saturdays 1003 KX-Leeds is not one of them, though! General shortage of electric traction/Mark 4 sets means there are frequent substitutions currently - 91119's absence being just one.

 

[whhistle]

Shame they couldn't hire in a couple of Eurostar sets...
GUess it's been too long since they last operated.

 

[D365]

Shame they couldn't hire in a couple of Eurostar sets...
GUess it's been too long since they last operated.

That’s the least of their issues.

 

[DarloRich]

Is there any report of the fire anywhere? Was it in service at the time?

i have gone some digging but drawn a blank. Others will have more knowledge/skill than me in digging this info out!

 

[brel york]

I will ask in the department that looks after the 91s at Doncaster

 

[Andrew Nelson]

If only the flying badger was still operational!

Seconded.

Are 90's cleared for Skipton and Bradford?- The 91's weren't cleared immediately after electrification.

Yes.

.

Shame they couldn't hire in a couple of Eurostar sets...
GUess it's been too long since they last operated.

They were limited to 110 too.

 

[MG11]

From where?

EMT isn't just a HST tree for VTEC!
The latest loans have led to a number of 5 vice 8 short formations.

I wonder if they could borrow one of the extra Adelantes that GC have received, I think EC crews still sign them, as EC were technically leasing them directly at one point (sub-leased to Northern).

 

[43096]

I wonder if they could borrow one of the extra Adelantes that GC have received, I think EC crews still sign them, as EC were technically leasing them directly at one point (sub-leased to Northern).

East Coast crews do not sign 180s and AFAIAA never have done.

 

[westcoaster]

Would the DRS class 88 be compatible, not sure on top speed or multiple workings.

 

[HSTEd]

They were limited to 110 too.

They were cleared for 125 south of Grantham just before they were withdrawn IIRC.

 

[43096]

Would the DRS class 88 be compatible, not sure on top speed or multiple workings.

No and no.

As already stated, the only realistic short term option is the hire of another Class 90 from DB Cargo.

 

[Andrew Nelson]

They were cleared for 125 south of Grantham just before they were withdrawn IIRC.

I thought it was due to the two Pantographs?

 

[D365]

I thought it was due to the two Pantographs?

Way more problems than just that.

 

[DarloRich]

I wonder if they could borrow one of the extra Adelantes that GC have received, I think EC crews still sign them, as EC were technically leasing them directly at one point (sub-leased to Northern).

how do you get that idea? They never ran under EC. I doubt anyone form EC was cleared on the 180's

 

[MG11]

Way more problems than just that.

Did the units later join the Eurostar fleet?

 

[HSTEd]

I thought it was due to the two Pantographs?

Primarily it was due to the power supply melting if anyone attempted to take full power on them.
Nevermind they could easily keep pace with a Class 91 hauled set with only one pan up.

 

[MG11]

how do you get that idea? They never ran under EC. I doubt anyone form EC was cleared on the 180's

Apparently they were officially leased by East Coast when they were subleased to Northern, someone who works for VTEC said on this forum.

 

[ainsworth74]

Apparently they were officially leased by East Coast when they were subleased to Northern, someone who works for VTEC said on this forum.

This is correct but they never even approached turning a wheel in anger with East Coast.

 

[43096]

Apparently they were officially leased by East Coast when they were subleased to Northern, someone who works for VTEC said on this forum.

There were also 4 LHCS Mark 3 rakes leased by NXEC, but they never entered service, either. Just because stock is leased by an operator does not necessarily mean it has worked for them.

 

[NSEFAN]

Did the units later join the Eurostar fleet?

I thought they went to SNCF to work alongside TGVs. I managed to ride one from Calais to Paris on SNCF in 2009 or so.

 

[twpsaesneg]

I wonder if they could borrow one of the extra Adelantes that GC have received, I think EC crews still sign them, as EC were technically leasing them directly at one point (sub-leased to Northern).

I would love to be a fly on the wall when the managing director of GC got that call from EC...

 

[59CosG95]

I thought they went to SNCF to work alongside TGVs. I managed to ride one from Calais to Paris on SNCF in 2009 or so.

Not exactly; the units SNCF took on for domestic services were ones from the "Three Capitals" order that they themselves owned already.
The 30xx sets were/are Eurostar-owned, the 31xx sets (all now preserved/stored/scrapped) were SNCB-owned, and the 32xx sets were/are SNCF-owned.
SNCF took 3 32xx sets into domestic use, namely 3203/4 (the original), 3225/6, and 3227/8.
3203/4 was scrapped in Vaires Yard, France in September 2014; 3225/6 was scrapped at Culoz at some point in the past; 3227/8 was scrapped at the Romilly Technicentre in May 2017.

SNCF did apparently hire out the NoL (33xx) sets, but never turned a wheel with them in passenger service.
3301/2, 3303/4, 3305/6, 3307, and 3311/2 are all stored somewhere in France...I don't quite know where.
3309/10 and 3313/4 were cut up in December 2014 at Ambérieu, a day apart.

Anyway, that's enough of the classic RailUK Forums "Diversion from the Booked Topic".
Back to the 91's fate.

 

[43096]

I would love to be a fly on the wall when the managing director of GC got that call from EC...

You'll be in for a long wait, then!