Goodbye Toys R Us & Maplin (both in administration)

[TT-ONR-NRN]

Well I’ve never needed to go to ToysRUs UK as I’m not a parent nor a toddler, but I think back to those awful adverts they show every flipping year on normal channels like BBC and ITV - I’m pretty relieved to see the back of those.

Actually I do seeing that there was one in the Dufferin Mall in Toronto I think. Don’t know if there still is. Is it going bust abroad too?

 

[underbank]

We used TRU quite a bit when our son was born and in his first few years, so 10-15 years ago. Must say it wasn't a pleasant experience. Before he was born, we went for a pram, cot, etc and needed some advice, but none of their sales assistants had a clue - we asked a few questions and it was clear they knew less than we did about the products - eg they couldn't show us how the pram folded, etc. He was a brio wooden train fan and loved to "test" the layouts set up in other toy shops such as ELC, so was looking forward to testing the layout in TRU and spending some money on more trains. The TRU layout was pathetic - engine with no wheels and a single truck - very disappointed child - worse still, their range of wooden brio trains to buy was basically none existent - dozens of an engine he already had, but basically nothing else but empty shelves. A couple of years later, went to buy a bike (clueless sales assistant again so didn't bother), then later still, went for a go-cart (another clueless sales assistant so didn't bother). We could have spent hundreds of pounds at TRU had they had some stock we wanted or sales assistants who had even the vaguest idea of what they were selling. This is a case study of why employing the cheapest most useless staff is false economy! If you know what you want, then you buy online. Bricks N Mortar stores can only compete these days on customer services - if they don't provide a "service" i.e. advice then just what is the point of them?

 

[BestWestern]

Actually I do seeing that there was one in the Dufferin Mall in Toronto I think. Don’t know if there still is. Is it going bust abroad too?

It's already gone bust abroad! A couple of months ago maybe.

 

[Darandio]

but I think back to those awful adverts they show every flipping year on normal channels like BBC and ITV - I’m pretty relieved to see the back of those.

Slightly off topic point but you won't see those awful adverts on the BBC due to the unique way in which it is funded.

 

[Hadders]

It's an 'interesting' time at present for the UK retail industry. A perfect storm of minimum wage increase, uncertainty due to the general economy impacting consumer spending and Brexit issues affecting buying/exchange rate terms. Then add in the online impact for a bit more uncertainty.

Online is interesting - hugely convenient for customers but generally less profitable for retailers when compared to selling through their bricks and mortar stores when you add in the cost of picking and delivering orders. The main issue though is the returns - in general merchandise and clothing the returns rate is as high as 30%. The cost of processing these returns is untenable in the long term.

 

[PaxVobiscum]

... Whilst Maplin provided lots of things at, relatively speaking really high prices compared to what we would expect to pay from our trade suppliers, and noticeably higher than the general public can buy online they had the advantage to us of being there. It will maybe surprise some, and not surprise others when i point out that there have been full scale Arena shows in the UK that would have been cancelled if there wasn't a Maplin down the road open at 1930.

I’m in the “not surprised” category, having had to use Maplins to fix it more than once when a visiting band/celebrity who declined advance offers of help with their sound/AV system (“we’ve got our own people for that”) sprang a wee extra request or suffered an ‘it was working fine last night’ moment at the rehearsal/soundcheck.
Expensive shop but a gig saver - I’ll miss them if they close all their stores.

 

[krus_aragon]

Well I’ve never needed to go to ToysRUs UK as I’m not a parent nor a toddler, but I think back to those awful adverts they show every flipping year on normal channels like BBC and ITV - I’m pretty relieved to see the back of those.

Actually I do seeing that there was one in the Dufferin Mall in Toronto I think. Don’t know if there still is. Is it going bust abroad too?

I too remember those Christmas-time adverts, and they were gloriously irrelevant to someone growing up in rural North-West Wales: I never saw a shop "in the flesh" until I was out of high school, and moved to Cardiff. (Similarly, a Dominos Pizza voucher in a ~1997 VHS tape of Men in Black listed all their locations: the only one in Wales back then was Cardiff!)

I think Toys R Us USA has already gone bust a few months back, and probably the Canadian wing too. Business people have been watching and waiting to see if the overseas arms would fall too.

Likewise, Maplin's collapse has been long anticipated, with tech news website The Register posting several articles charting their downfall as their credit insurers slowly turned their backs on them.

Incidentally, I've been racking my brains as to whether I'd have been to the Dufferin Mall branch of Toys R Us as a youngster, as we visited family living near Islington, and took the TTC in to Toronto regularly. Wikipedia, however, tells me that the site in question was still an Eatons at the time.

 

[Bletchleyite]

Online is interesting - hugely convenient for customers but generally less profitable for retailers when compared to selling through their bricks and mortar stores when you add in the cost of picking and delivering orders. The main issue though is the returns - in general merchandise and clothing the returns rate is as high as 30%. The cost of processing these returns is untenable in the long term.

The catalogue retailers, Kays and the likes, have done free returns for years but their prices were a little higher than bricks and mortar stores. Could we see that happening where online ceases to be cheaper? But people may still choose it for the convenience of trying on clothes at home just as my Mum always chose the Kays catalogue for the same convenience despite the high prices?

 

[WelshBluebird]

The cost of processing these returns is untenable in the long term.

If that is true, and I am not really that knowledgeable in the area so it may well be, how long is "long term" here?
E-commerce has been around a fair while now. Amazon UK itself is 20 years old this year, ASOS is 18 years old, Boohoo.com is 12 years old, various high street retailers have had online presences for ages too (e.g. Next's online presence is now 19 years old). If it wasn't tenable in the long term, surely we would have already seen that?

 

[Hadders]

If that is true, and I am not really that knowledgeable in the area so it may well be, how long is "long term" here?
E-commerce has been around a fair while now. Amazon UK itself is 20 years old this year, ASOS is 18 years old, Boohoo.com is 12 years old, various high street retailers have had online presences for ages too (e.g. Next's online presence is now 19 years old). If it wasn't tenable in the long term, surely we would have already seen that?

Take clothing as an example. We have the situation where customers will purchase 3 or 4 sizes of the same item, keep the one that fits and return the others. This is getting worse as more sales move online and sales through traditional stores fall. The returns rate in clothing is 30% and increasing.

The logistical cost of returning these items, processing them at the returns centre, inspecting for damage, returning to pick is significant. Customers cannot be charged for returning items. The cost of dealing with this is significant and will increase costs for all customers.

 

[muz379]

Toys R us could have been called a while ago , last visit to two of their stores about 9 months ago made it apparently obvious that they had not spent any money on store fittings and fixtures or epos systems for some considerable time . It felt like a very dated shopping experience

Maplins is a bit more of a suprise , their stores always felt fairly well fitted and well stocked . I have noticed for a number of years the actual knowledge and advice offered by their staff in store has been falling . I only really used maplins for stuff I could have sourced online for cheaper but did not or could not wait for them . Usually fairly low value purchases as well

 

[Lucan]

Take clothing as an example. We have the situation where customers will purchase 3 or 4 sizes of the same item, keep the one that fits and return the others.

This has been discussed on a camera forum I frequent. Camera shops are vanishing, and although I don't mind mail-ordering less critical stuff, I went some distance recently to buy a new DSLR camera over the counter rather than mail order (and even they needed to order it in). That is partly because I don't trust the postman not to leave my parcels on the gatepost (they really do that sometimes, even in rain), and partly because I don't want a "secondhand" item. On the camera forum many of the guys cheerfully admit using a new camera for a week or two and then sending it back for a different model. Imagine if several people have done that before you get it - and these photographers are enthusiasts who might take 1000 shots in a week.

On top of that, I like to see a thing like a camera in pristine packaging, partly to enjoy the "newness" and partly because I keep packaging etc to increase its second-hand value (counts for a lot among eg camera collectors). Moreover, a camera, like many "system" things, comes with many little accessories like plastic plugs to cover the flash sockets - are they all going to be there after someone else has been using it?

 

[Hadders]

It is a huge issue and getting bigger all the time. High end tech and clothing being particular problems.

Most mobile phones that are returned have absolutely nothing wrong with them, it’s just that the users can’t set them up properly. Once they are returned they can’t be resold as new as the packaging’s been opened. Most retailers will get the phones checked and repaired (if necessary) and then sell them as refurbished phones either online or through the secondary market.

All of this costs money of course and the margin on high end tech isn’t that great.

 

[Tom B]

One of the problems with Maplin, aside from the prices (I only went there in an emergency) was the staff. If I go into an electronics shop, I want the staff to know what a multimeter is.

I think they served as a general electronics highstreet place for an average home user who needed, say, a resistor or something, and an emergency go to for the professional who urgently needs a part and can't wait for CPC or RD to deliver. However, Screwfix (and Toolstop, which is essentially a clone) now stock a much wider range than they used to, and are open long hours, with cheaper prices. RS even have 3 physical shops now.

Halfords are another of similar ilk I think. They are overpriced, and don't hold any specialist parts (not know what they are!), but if you need something on a Sunday, they're open where many decent specialist shops are shut. Likewise, as a well known highstreet brand, they will attract trade from average home users who think it's the only place to get an oil filter or battery from,

- which was a sports shop but it wasn't the cheapest sports shop (Sports Direct), it didn't have the largest range (Decathalon), it didn't provide specialist help (e.g. Up And Running), it didn't aim for the premium shopper (e.g. Blacks) and it didn't really cater to the trendier end of the market (JD). It was just a middle of the road shop - and so wasn't going to be anyone's first choice

What about Sugg Sport...?!

 

[Lucan]

One of the problems with Maplin ... was the staff. If I go into an electronics shop, I want the staff to know what a multimeter is....I think they served as a general electronics highstreet place for an average home user who needed, say, a resistor

If you know how to use a multimeter, why do the staff need to know what one is? You look in their catalogue for what you want, go to the store, and just pick it off the shelf. If it is out-of reach, just point to it.

Average home users don't buy resistors BTW.

 

[Bletchleyite]

If you know how to use a multimeter, why do the staff need to know what one is? You look in their catalogue for what you want, go to the store, and just pick it off the shelf. If it is out-of reach, just point to it.

Or a couple of clicks on Amazon and it shows up.

FWIW I found their staff to be often electronics enthusiasts who did know their stuff, if a bit lacking in actual customer service. It was one of the sort of charms of the place.

 

[theageofthetra]

In the pre internet days Maplin did have very very good knowledgeable and often 'enthusiast' staff who could help with projects. Sadly it got more and more dumbed down and anything I need now I research or order on line.

 

[Puffing Devil]

In the pre internet days Maplin did have very very good knowledgeable and often 'enthusiast' staff who could help with projects. Sadly it got more and more dumbed down and anything I need now I research or order on line.

That's about the size of it.

 

[jon0844]

The problem is that good staff always leave and find other jobs before the bad ones. So if the writing is on the wall (and Maplin seems to have been on borrowed time for years) then most will have got out before ship sank.

Of course it's great to have somewhere to go when it's an emergency, but the market is too small. Far too much of what Maplin sold in recent years was quite ropey no-name Chinese stuff, of variable quality. What's more, the cheap Chinese stuff is usually dirt cheap on eBay or Amazon, but seemed to have pretty high suggested retail prices in store.

Currys PC World has at least adapted quite well, now offering more competitive pricing against Amazon and having the ability to click and collect almost immediately if something is in stock. Sure, Amazon may have same day delivery for many things (if you order in the morning) and even two-hour delivery slots on limited stock, but Currys/PC World can still be good.

I've used click and collect and liked it because you don't get to hang around waiting for a member of staff to assist if you want help, or harassed when you don't. No attempts (so far!) to upsell, sell extended warranties and buy on rip-off finance.

Now that they have Carphone Warehouse too, that also brings people into stores and for things like TVs and computers, it seems there are still plenty of people who want to see before they buy, and for a computer there are still those who need advice and are easily sold the extra software/care packages. That must make them a profit.

 

[richw]

The problem is that good staff always leave and find other jobs before the bad ones. So if the writing is on the wall (and Maplin seems to have been on borrowed time for years) then most will have got out before ship sank.

Of course it's great to have somewhere to go when it's an emergency, but the market is too small. Far too much of what Maplin sold in recent years was quite ropey no-name Chinese stuff, of variable quality. What's more, the cheap Chinese stuff is usually dirt cheap on eBay or Amazon, but seemed to have pretty high suggested retail prices in store.

Currys PC World has at least adapted quite well, now offering more competitive pricing against Amazon and having the ability to click and collect almost immediately if something is in stock. Sure, Amazon may have same day delivery for many things (if you order in the morning) and even two-hour delivery slots on limited stock, but Currys/PC World can still be good.

I've used click and collect and liked it because you don't get to hang around waiting for a member of staff to assist if you want help, or harassed when you don't. No attempts (so far!) to upsell, sell extended warranties and buy on rip-off finance.

Now that they have Carphone Warehouse too, that also brings people into stores and for things like TVs and computers, it seems there are still plenty of people who want to see before they buy, and for a computer there are still those who need advice and are easily sold the extra software/care packages. That must make them a profit.

Curry’s PcWorld also have adapted here, where they had a store for each in the same city, they’ve merged both into the larger unit, saving the costs of the smaller unit. Their prices are also competitive, unlike Maplin which I found expensive. Majority of curry’s pcworld staff seem very knowledgable as well, so give good advice. They’ve sold me the most suitable product when I’ve told them what I need each time I’ve been in for an appliance,

 

[WelshBluebird]

In terms of Maplin specifically, at least for me they were only useful when I needed something that day. If I could wait a day or more, Amazon was always a better choice (greater range of products, better "advice" in the form of user reviews etc, cheaper).

Take clothing as an example. We have the situation where customers will purchase 3 or 4 sizes of the same item, keep the one that fits and return the others. This is getting worse as more sales move online and sales through traditional stores fall. The returns rate in clothing is 30% and increasing.

The logistical cost of returning these items, processing them at the returns centre, inspecting for damage, returning to pick is significant. Customers cannot be charged for returning items. The cost of dealing with this is significant and will increase costs for all customers.

Oh I don't disagree that it is a problem.

My reply was more about your claim that it isn't sustainable long term, and I just wondered what you mean by long term when you consider many such retailers have been around long enough to have been considered long term already.

Or are you suggestion that the increase in popularity in e-commerce has led to a larger proportion of people abusing returns than what used to be the case in the early days?

 

[Bletchleyite]

In terms of Maplin specifically, at least for me they were only useful when I needed something that day. If I could wait a day or more, Amazon was always a better choice (greater range of products, better "advice" in the form of user reviews etc, cheaper).

I used to order stuff online (or by phone, years earlier) from Maplin, but more recently they have had huge issues with stock control that Amazon doesn't, and Amazon has the big benefit of being able to order for delivery directly to my local post office (or an Amazon locker further away) instead of having to get a failed delivery then pay 70p to have something sent there some time later.

Some other retailers offer click and collect via the Collect+ network, but it's been slow coming and only prompted by Amazon. And the post office is nearer.

 

[Lucan]

Take clothing as an example. We have the situation where customers will purchase 3 or 4 sizes of the same item, keep the one that fits and return the others. .... The returns rate in clothing is 30% and increasing. The cost of processing these returns is untenable in the long term.

.....My reply was more about your claim that it isn't sustainable long term, and I just wondered what you mean by long term when you consider many such retailers have been around long enough to have been considered long term already. Or are you suggestion that the increase in popularity in e-commerce has led to a larger proportion of people abusing returns than what used to be the case in the early days?

I believe on-line retail is sustainable in the long term, but because of the overhead of returns it will not eventually be any cheaper for the buyer than it was via bricks and mortar. To some extent it is cheaper (for now) partly because it really is cheaper (for now) for the retailers and partly on top of that the retailers want to encourage it for that reason. But the early adopters of on-line shopping tended to be techies (computer parts were early in the game) who usually knew exactly what they wanted; however the more that non-techie Jill and Joe Public become involved the higher the return rate will become, and the higher the cost will be to the buyer - to pay for all the wastage, postage and multiple handling.

As I said earlier, on another forum that I use some guys regard sending stuff back for refunds to be a proper and natural part of on-line shopping - the equivalent of getting a sales assistant to show you something. In many cases (these may be more in the USA) they have no intention of buying and just want to try something out of curiosity.

 

[jon0844]

Plus once the competition is wiped out, Amazon can let prices creep up.

 

[61653 HTAFC]

Plus once the competition is wiped out, Amazon can let prices creep up.

Indeed. The power of Amazon is alarming if you're into dystopian near-future scenarios!

 

[cactustwirly]

Plus once the competition is wiped out, Amazon can let prices creep up.

Hmm, Amazon still has competition from eBay, who I prefer to shop with (cheaper prices, most things have free delivery & nectar points).

 

[Busaholic]

Plus once the competition is wiped out, Amazon can let prices creep up.

As a bookseller (retired) I can tell anyone who cares to listen (which is practically nobody) that well over 90% of books stocked by Amazon, or available to order, are sold at full recommended retail price i.e the same price as you'd get it from a local bookstore. The problem for the local bookstore is that the less than 10% are the ones that they might have a chance to sell a few of, so all that gets creamed off and, lo and behold, the local bookshop disappears. Meanwhile the very low taxpaying Amazon gets huge grants from 'devolved' governments and 'regional development' funds to set up their soulless warehouses and all the roads infrastructure necessary for their running. Nice work if you can get it! Some European countries, notably France and Germany, aren't prepared to play ball and help Amazon achieve global dominance, but our supine government(s) do(es) nothing.

 

[krus_aragon]

If you know how to use a multimeter, why do the staff need to know what one is? You look in their catalogue for what you want, go to the store, and just pick it off the shelf. If it is out-of reach, just point to it.

Ah, but they no longer have a catalogue! For a few years (at my local branch) they kept one dog-eared copy on the components desk for reference, but that's gone now.

Now when I ask a member of staff if they have X, the staff walk up to the public computer in the middle of the shop, and do a search of their website. I could do that myself just as easily (if I didn't dislike their clunky web interface)...

 

[Dai Corner]

If you know how to use a multimeter, why do the staff need to know what one is? You look in their catalogue for what you want, go to the store, and just pick it off the shelf. If it is out-of reach, just point to it.

Average home users don't buy resistors BTW.

Ah, but they no longer have a catalogue! For a few years (at my local branch) they kept one dog-eared copy on the components desk for reference, but that's gone now.

Now when I ask a member of staff if they have X, the staff walk up to the public computer in the middle of the shop, and do a search of their website. I could do that myself just as easily (if I didn't dislike their clunky web interface)...

https://www.maplin.co.uk/customer-services/price-match

Online-only retailers simply don’t offer the same great service we do. Through our stores, contact centres and technical support we can offer help, assistance and advice to all our customers. This level of service can’t be equalled by many online-only retailers, which is why we don’t match their prices.

 

[krus_aragon]

https://www.maplin.co.uk/customer-services/price-match

Online-only retailers simply don’t offer the same great service we do.

Sorry, was that great, or grate?