We only have 4 car platforms at Meldreth but with the introduction of the newer through trains we regularly get 8 car trains stopping there. The budget to extend the platforms only extended to Shepreth and Foxton and then only to prevent the trains blocking the level crossings - so only the Cambridge bound side in both cases. Maybe with the money saved they'll resurface the path to Melbourn - or even provide some lighting.
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Great Northern and Thameslink May 18 service changes
- Thread starter Failed Unit
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We only have 4 car platforms at Meldreth but with the introduction of the newer through trains we regularly get 8 car trains stopping there. The budget to extend the platforms only extended to Shepreth and Foxton and then only to prevent the trains blocking the level crossings - so only the Cambridge bound side in both cases. Maybe with the money saved they'll resurface the path to Melbourn - or even provide some lighting.
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Failed Unit
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We may see the rest of the timetables loaded by next Monday. Complained to GTR it is stopping people buy APs so risks them losing the cheapest fares. The representative dealing with my complaint didn’t realise it wasn’t completed.
class387
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The Cambridge - Welwyn - Kings Cross and Up Welwyn - Moorgate services appear to have been uploaded to RTT
Downthelane
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Still missing the semi-fasts peaks from KGX to WGC and the Letchworth to KGX services.
Assuming these haven't been removed permanently as if so that is a huge drop in capacity.
In fact the ways it looks KGX to WGC in peak looks like two trains per hour from Kings Cross.
That surely can't be right or sufficient.
Assuming these haven't been removed permanently as if so that is a huge drop in capacity.
In fact the ways it looks KGX to WGC in peak looks like two trains per hour from Kings Cross.
That surely can't be right or sufficient.
Yes the KGX/WGC services are missing, but I am most interested in the 4tph to Moorgate which will run throughout the day. For one, they're not at exact 15 minute intervals, and secondly it seems every second train will have to shut down at WGC and shunt empty to platform 1 to start from there.
There are a number of logistical issues with that, like the time to turf people off, shut down, driver changing ends multiple times and so on. Not insurmountable, but if there are delays then I can see many being cancelled or having not-to-call orders put on them to make up time.
Should be interesting as keeping shut downs to a minimum would certainly be preferable.
There are a number of logistical issues with that, like the time to turf people off, shut down, driver changing ends multiple times and so on. Not insurmountable, but if there are delays then I can see many being cancelled or having not-to-call orders put on them to make up time.
Should be interesting as keeping shut downs to a minimum would certainly be preferable.
Downthelane
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Does anyone have a copy of the draft timetable to confirm where the missing KGX-WGC and vice paths fit in during the peaks?
Is there any particular reason why they should depart from Platform 1. All the Cambridge trains will call at Hatfield so anyone wanting to change can do so there.
The trains do not depart at regular intervals (xx10, xx25, xx40, xx55 for example) but instead seem to be 20 minutes here, 10 minutes there, so it will be for planning reasons (no times yet on when the inbound services will arrive) but shutting down trains and a driver changing ends (once to reverse back, again to come in to platform 1 and once more to go out) is a recipe for disaster.
If this is going to happen, I bet the drivers will have a thing or two to say. Currently WGC has this happen a few times in the morning and the evening, but not all day every day.
The night services weren't including in the consultation either were they? Does this mean they're mostly untouched or is there still any deciding to be done?
All the Moorgate services appear to be skipping stops. In the morning peak they either miss out Harringay and Hornsey or Oakleigh Park and New Southgate. Some miss Hadley Wood, others miss Welham Green. The first train in the morning and the last two late night services call at all stations, but none of the others that I've found so far.
Yes, there will be a varied stopping pattern. Another surefire way to confuse passengers, although good for most people who see slight improvements in journey times.
I think Brookmans Park and Welham green get half the service frequency, as well as Hornsey and Harringay. Not sure about the others.
By the sound of it Hadley Wood has been protected or even gets more services, presumably thanks to a very powerful rail user group there.
Failed Unit
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Should be 2 mins before a Moorgate. So expect to see them at.
0706, 0736, 0806 and 0836
Failed Unit
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Harringay and Hornsey was always planners. The others such as 0654 WGC to London must be a mistake. Unless everyone is expected to use the following kings cross service.
notverydeep
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The draft timetable had these at 0602, 0632, 0702, 0732 , 0802, 0832 and 0902 from Welwyn Garden City southbound and northbound 15 minutes later than Cambridge trains from Finsbury Park starting at 16:45 then every 30 minutes until 1915, though of course both routes are to / from Thameslink in the draft. At least the southbound times of the Cambridge slows are the same as the draft between WGC and Finsbury Park - I haven't made a detailed comparison of the Moorgates though...
Interestingly there is an option to travel via Welwyn North from WGC with the appropriate ticket, as in the morning the NB train should get to Welwyn North just ahead of the planned half hourly fast southbound train from there (though only one so far uploaded) and in the evening the fast train to Welwyn North makes the southbound Cambridge slow...
An example is King's Cross 18:24 to Welwyn North 18:41 with 6 minutes to wait for the 18:47 to WGC arriving at 18:50 comfortably beating the now slower 18:21 King's Cross to WGC arriving at 18:55 (with the extra Potters Bar stop compared to today's 18:22). Possibly worth the extra £140-ish / year?
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Downthelane
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Assuming these WGC-KGX services do materialise then Hatfield gets a significant boost in capacity to KGX.
Presently Hatfield has three trains in the main morning peak reaching KGX before 9.00.
From May that increases with fasts and semi-fasts available.
What seats will be available on the fasts remains to be seen of course.
Presently Hatfield has three trains in the main morning peak reaching KGX before 9.00.
From May that increases with fasts and semi-fasts available.
What seats will be available on the fasts remains to be seen of course.
notverydeep
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Regarding services originating at (or close to) Letchworth, one of the southbound train for the AM peak has been uploaded - 1R11, the 08:12 Baldock to King's Cross. The draft timetable had five of these from Baldock at 30 minute intervals starting at 06:12 and ending at 08:42, the service labelled 'GN5' in the consultation and providing the extra stops at Knebworth and Welwyn North (except the 08:42 from Baldock). This would give Welwyn North 4 tph in the final timetable somewhat controversially , given this location is the industry bi-word for capacity constraint! It will be interesting to see if the others will start in this timetable.
The northbound has four trains at roughly 30 minute intervals 16:54, 17:24, 17:54 and 18:24 (already uploaded) alternately to Royston and Baldock, all stopping at Welwyn North and Knebworth. The Cambridge - Brighton hourly service also provides a semi-fast like service from Letchworth.
Sorry, I should have combined this post with post 224...
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Failed Unit
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Crazy they are allowed to do this on the biggest pinchpoint on the ECML at the moment.
However it could be useful. It could keep passengers off the service that stops at WGC. Hatfield and potters bar to hopefully prevent severe overcrowding considering these are already crush loaded when the leave WGC today.
Looks like the timetables are now uploaded for Meldreth/Shepreth/Foxton and it's not great news for the commuters from the villages heading for London. Still working out the impact but in summary longer journeys, swap to 700s - or a return to the days of waiting 10 minutes at Royston for connections on which there may be no seats. Big winners are Ashwell and Morden - not quite sure why. I wonder which MP lives there.
Looking at Real Time Trains the 0702 service still hasn't been loaded into the system. If this service doesn't run then it'll mean a reduction in the number of trains running between Stevenage and London between 0700 and 0800 compared to today's timetable.
Failed Unit
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I think it is another week another missed deadline from GTR. (Remember GTR apologists the set the date last week not us).
All the Welwyn - Kings Cross semi-fasts missing.
Nothing running northbound to WGC from Moorgate.
Missing WGC - Moorgate trains.
No southbound trains on Hertford loop.
So still work in progress. GTR are very quiet about missing thier own deadline.
Great Northern's website still says that the timetable for the new services will be available on National Rail from 25th February. Anyone planning a journey will be disappointed.
There should be something saying that more services are still to be loaded into the system.
There should be something saying that more services are still to be loaded into the system.
GoatSarah
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I note the Cambridge London slows (GN) and semi fasts (TL) now depart within a few minutes of each other. Previously the GN departures were nicely spread out with one in each quarter of an hour, going fast, semi fast, fast, slow. Now they go fast (long gap), fast, semi fast and then almost immediately, slow.
ISTM this leaves very little margin for error with the Brighton services. A small delay sees them depart behind the stopper, which they will be stuck behind until Hitchin. The gap in the timetable is annoying too, but presumably temporary as the expectation is that the second Brighton service will arrive in December.
ISTM this leaves very little margin for error with the Brighton services. A small delay sees them depart behind the stopper, which they will be stuck behind until Hitchin. The gap in the timetable is annoying too, but presumably temporary as the expectation is that the second Brighton service will arrive in December.
Failed Unit
Established Member
I think in reality they will hold the stopper. Then skip stop the stopper to avoid the delay getting too large. Undesirable I can’t see the timetable working without lots of skip stopping.
most of the peak hour Baldock/Royston starters are not yet in. at Letchworth the 0615 and 0815 are there but not the 0645, 0715 and 0745.
Also, I understand that there are also Kings Cross to Cambridge semi-fasts at 1954, 2054 and 2154 that are not yet showing.
Also, I understand that there are also Kings Cross to Cambridge semi-fasts at 1954, 2054 and 2154 that are not yet showing.
TheDavibob
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It's worth noting the final timetable [i.e. Dec 2019, or whenever] will have the fast-semifast-slow cycle repeating every half an hour. Probably worth finding out how broke it is before doubling it up, though it'll be messy.
Also a note that the Cambridge slow seems to be down technically as a Thameslink service, rather than a GN one, even though it won't transfer over to the core for a year and a half.
GoatSarah
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Yes. Will improve come December, assuming it works, but in the meantime it rather screws anyone commuting Royston/Letchworth etc to Cambridge; their train home has gone from a half hourly service to effectively an hourly service.
GoatSarah
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They’re running now as long as you want to go at just after 2pm!
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