Trivia: Units with offset doors/windows

[fairysdad]

Basically... are there any? Ie, units/coaching stock where the doors (or windows) aren't opposite each other on each side of the train? Pacers are the only ones that I can think of, with only three doors per coach. Any more for any more?

 

[Bletchleyite]

DB have some DMUs with the same door layout as Pacers.

Other than that the only thing I can think of is that on units with disabled bogs there is often a window aperture or two that is blocked off, either with a non-glass window or a completely blank bodyside even if the structure would allow for a window there.

Also I think on Mk3 stock there is only a window on the bog side, not on the offside. Though again the structure is there.

 

[Clansman]

Class 185s have different window layouts on each side, as well as some custom built Mk X coaches with buffets, guards van, sleepers, etc.

 

[brel york]

Think some of the Xp64 prototype had off set doors ,

 

[AM9]

Interestingly the place that seems to make good use of offset (sliding) doors is the NYC subway. Most of the trains there have the doors offset by about 2 metres. The net result is that standees don't inconsiderately block the door area so much, as some of them wish to alight from those on the opposite side to which they boarded, so they actually move down the car towards them. There is a slight (aesthetic) disadvantage in that there are seats facing the opening doors.

 

[edwin_m]

The APT intermediate coaches had doors at diagonally opposite corners.

Mk3 coaches were built with a small "window" at each side and each end, but many operators have plated theirs over on the non-toilet side (where it was never actually a window but at one time contained a destination indicator).

Sleepers have different window layouts on the corridor and compartment sides. Some historic compartment stock designs had a door to each compartment on that side but fewer doors on the corridor side. The Mk1 Corridor Composite had a truly wacky arrangement of windows on the corridor side.

 

[brel york]

The BCk was even more random

 

[edwin_m]

The BCk was even more random

Really? An image search, admittedly mostly of models, shows a pretty conventional window layout on both sides.

 

[physics34]

700s.. where the disabled toliet is

 

[CatfordCat]

The BCk was even more random

Really? An image search, admittedly mostly of models, shows a pretty conventional window layout on both sides.

If we're talking Mark 1 loco hauled, think the BCK was fairly straightforward but the CK had doors and windows that didn't line up on each side, and there was one compartment window that could (when built at least - think they got sealed up or in some cases replaced with standard windows) be opened fully to allow patients on stretchers to be carried in / out of that compartment.

drawing and photos (bluebell railway) here

 

[AlexNL]

The NS (Dutch Railways) ICMm "Koploper" trains only have a cab door below the right hand side of the cab.

 

[Bletchleyite]

Re 185s they have a very large number of different window sizes, which must be a nightmare for the spares departments. But they are mostly the same on opposite sides of the train except (as with most trains) by the toilets, where the toilet side window is blanked (but probably still structurally the same). Possibly the one where the exhaust is is also different?

 

[6Gman]

If we're talking Mark 1 loco hauled, think the BCK was fairly straightforward but the CK had doors and windows that didn't line up on each side, and there was one compartment window that could (when built at least - think they got sealed up or in some cases replaced with standard windows) be opened fully to allow patients on stretchers to be carried in / out of that compartment.

drawing and photos (bluebell railway) here

I remember them. Terrible for letting in draughts and rain!

Only ever saw the facility used on one occasion. Norwich c.1963/64.

 

[theageofthetra]

Didn't the original Glasgow Subway stock only have doors and the lined decoration on one side only?

 

[Peter Mugridge]

Didn't the original Glasgow Subway stock only have doors and the lined decoration on one side only?

They did, yes.

 

[pdeaves]

Slightly off at a tangent:
I noticed recently that, whilst the class 800s have doors lining up with each other, the windows are not on the door centre line so there is a slight stagger when looking through. I was walking up a platform at Paddington and tried looking 'through' a train to something the other side of it when I noticed the phenomenom.

 

[CatfordCat]

A few more thoughts -

quite a lot of buffet / kitchen coaches (loco hauled and in multiple units) had different door / window arrangements as the kitchen / serving area was on one side.

the Mk 1 and Mk 3 sleepers have different window arrangements on the corridor side, and the Mk 1s had an additional door half way along the corridor side.

And the engine compartment of Southern Region diesel units (Hastings, Hampshire etc) had the engine offset towards one side, so there were radiator grilles on one side and windows on the opposite side.

 

[LiftFan]

The one that comes to mind is the Class 442 with the extra door in the very middle carriage in the train.

 

[fairysdad]

Interesting answers all. There's more than I thought there were, but thinking about it they're all quite obvious really. The Glasgow Subway units is interesting, I guess it made sense on paper but probably ended up a bit of an operational nightmare to actually run and make sure the trains couldn't reverse!

Another example that I didn't think of when I started the thread is the 456 units where the toilet used to be.

@LiftFan: Unfortunately, I've never seen a 442 in use properly (kind of a lie), but wouldn't that door be the Guard's door and thus be replicated on the opposite side of the coach (even if not usable by mere mortals)?

 

[edwin_m]

The Glasgow Subway units is interesting, I guess it made sense on paper but probably ended up a bit of an operational nightmare to actually run and make sure the trains couldn't reverse!

At the time the Subway had no points on its running lines, the two tracks where completely independent and trains were craned in and out where the line passed under the depot. So there was no risk of a train finding itself with the doors on the wrong side unless they craned it in the wrong way round.

 

[pdeaves]

Slightly off at a tangent:
I noticed recently that, whilst the class 800s have doors lining up with each other, the windows are not on the door centre line so there is a slight stagger when looking through. I was walking up a platform at Paddington and tried looking 'through' a train to something the other side of it when I noticed the phenomenom.

Scrub all of that. I had a proper look at another unit today and everything does line up as expected. Perhaps at Paddington I saw a door mid-close or something like that.

 

[theageofthetra]

At the time the Subway had no points on its running lines, the two tracks where completely independent and trains were craned in and out where the line passed under the depot. So there was no risk of a train finding itself with the doors on the wrong side unless they craned it in the wrong way round.

The seperate lines being a legacy of being originally cable hauled

 

[317666]

DB have some DMUs with the same door layout as Pacers.

VT628s, sadly getting less and less common.

Interestingly the place that seems to make good use of offset (sliding) doors is the NYC subway. Most of the trains there have the doors offset by about 2 metres.

This is an interesting one - on the A Division (numbered lines) it's only the new generation stock that has this, and on the B Division (lettered lines) it's only the remaining 1960s stock that has it!