Virgin East Coast Twitter

[ainsworth74]

Of course if they would just update their website to clarify that weekend first is only available on English Bank Holidays (though personally I think it should certainly be available for journeys within Scotland on Scottish Bank Holidays) then this whole mess could be easily resolved.

 

[sefton]

Perhaps.
But perhaps it isn't recognised by Virgin EC as a bank holiday.

If it isn't they would say so unless they were incompetent or lazy when they put their website together.

Are you suggesting that is the case?

 

[sheff1]

But perhaps it isn't recognised by Virgin EC as a bank holiday.

Which dates are Bank Holidays is defined by legislation (and proclaimed by royal proclamation). What VTEC might 'recognise' is irrelevant, but ties in with their ethos which seems to regard various legislation as optional rather The Law.

VTEC can, of course, choose to offer "Weekend" First Upgrades on whichever days they want - they could offer it on Tuesday afternoons if they wished !

If they only want to offer it on English Bank Holidays that is fine but their website does not state that, instead stating it is available on "bank holidays". A reasonable person would take that to mean bank holidays pertaining in those constituent parts of the UK served by VTEC, i.e. England and Scotland - it seems many VTEC staff do, indeed, take it to mean that.

 

[whhistle]

Are you suggesting that is the case?

I mean, that's a classic example of someone putting words in some else's mouth.
I like to try and think of all available options and give people the benifit of the doubt where possible.

 

[MG11]

Of course if they would just update their website to clarify that weekend first is only available on English Bank Holidays (though personally I think it should certainly be available for journeys within Scotland on Scottish Bank Holidays) then this whole mess could be easily resolved.

The Twitter team say that FC Discounted Upgrades ARE available on Scottish exclusive bank holidays. Please see previously in the thread.

 

[AlterEgo]

The Twitter team say that FC Discounted Upgrades ARE available on Scottish exclusive bank holidays. Please see previously in the thread.

As others, like me, have taken great pains to point out, the Twitter team are wrong.

Weekend Upgrades are not available on Scottish exclusive bank holidays. This has always been the case, and it is why Virgin (both TOCs) provide a full First Class service on those days, instead of the reduced service that comes with the reduced fares.

It’s getting really tiresome now.

Yes, the website is hugely unclear.

 

[sefton]

I mean, that's a classic example of someone putting words in some else's mouth.
I like to try and think of all available options and give people the benifit of the doubt where possible.

So what reason would you suggest for Virgin failing to give their customers correct information?

 

[whhistle]

I don't know.
Not worth my time thinking about.

 

[ainsworth74]

The Twitter team say that FC Discounted Upgrades ARE available on Scottish exclusive bank holidays. Please see previously in the thread.

Good for the Twitter team!

Meanwhile the website remains confusing and unclear which is correct. As @AlterEgo says the clear intention is that they are not available, despite what the Twitter team may say, so the website either needs correcting to make this clear or, preferably, the policy needs changing (at least with regards to journeys wholly in Scotland) to allow upgrades on Scottish Bank Holidays with a suitable update to the website.

My point is not abrogated by the Twitter teams response. If anything it emphasises the point that clarity is needed on the website!

 

[Butts]

A few Years back when I lived in Scotland and had a Railcard I attempted to buy a ticket at Edinburgh Waverley for a journey to Falkirk on January 2nd. As it was before 0930 or whatever the cut off time was they refused to sell me a discounted ticket quoting the minimum fare which is applicable on all days but weekends and Bank Holidays.

I pointed out it was a Bank Holiday in Scotland but they would not budge.

When I wrote complaining to First Scotrail (as it was then) they refunded the difference and paid me £5 compensation.

 

[sefton]

I don't know.
Not worth my time thinking about.

And there was me thinking you were interested as you contributed to this thread.

 

[whhistle]

And there was me thinking you were interested as you contributed to this thread.

And there you are, thinking wrong again.
I'm still interested in the topic, I lost interest only in your persistance of seeing whose train is bigger than whose.

I made a comment. You said I was suggesting something different than what I wrote, then asked me to answer a question that I'm not paid to do, can't really be bothered to think of all the reasons (or even just some), and aren't really interested in doing so.
Can you really not think all by yourself, of any reasons why the information isn't on the website? If you're that bothered, find out 1) a Director (find one on Companies House website) or 2) the Website Manager and ask them.

I shouldn't feed the trolls and all that...

 

[sefton]

Your post said -

Perhaps.
But perhaps it isn't recognised by Virgin EC as a bank holiday.
Yes, some departments think it was recognised, but looking at things now, the majority of what can be relied upon (IE, tangible evidence) show East Coast didn't consider it to be a bank holiday.

Now the 2nd of January was as a matter of fact a bank holiday where the customer boarded the train. This isn't something which Virgin cannot "recognise", as quite simply it is.

Also as a matter of fact is Virgin's website visible to anyone in Scotland where it was a bank holiday is a statement that the upgrades were available on board.

Your statement that some parts of Virgin believed upgrades were available and some did not clearly shows there was a lack of control over this matter by those tasked to deliver it.

I don't consider unreasonable to explore where the failure in Virgin's system occurred.

Did the web team know it was a bank holiday but positively decide not to give clear information to their customers? Did the web team not know it was a bank holiday? Did the fares team not tell the web team their website was incorrect when it was sent for approval?

 

[whhistle]

Now the 2nd of January was as a matter of fact a bank holiday where the customer boarded the train. This isn't something which Virgin cannot "recognise", as quite simply it is.

But that wasn't the [entire] post you quoted to begin with. As someone else said, it does seem that Virgin (as well as others) flout laws like they're guidance. Doesn't make it right, but if it's a fact...

Yes, there clearly is a "lack of control" in your eyes. This issue really seems to grate on you - why aren't you bothering someone who is actually able to do something about your complaint in Virgin?
You may not consider it unreasonable, but maybe Virgin do.
You seriously think companies deliberately decide to mis-lead customers - or even feel the need to ask those sorts of questions?
FYI: Websites / parts of websites are rarely "sent for approval".
*Yawn* - feel free to message me if you really want to continue, or reply if you're desperate to have the last word.

 

[sefton]

But that wasn't the [entire] post you quoted to begin with. As someone else said, it does seem that Virgin (as well as others) flout laws like they're guidance. Doesn't make it right, but if it's a fact...

Yes, there clearly is a "lack of control" in your eyes. This issue really seems to grate on you - why aren't you bothering someone who is actually able to do something about your complaint in Virgin?
You may not consider it unreasonable, but maybe Virgin do.
You seriously think companies deliberately decide to mis-lead customers - or even feel the need to ask those sorts of questions?
FYI: Websites / parts of websites are rarely "sent for approval".
*Yawn* - feel free to message me if you really want to continue, or reply if you're desperate to have the last word.

No I don't think Virgin set out to deliberately mislead customers. I think it was the usual issue of a combination of a failure to think and a 'not my job' attitude from the employees.

Public facing websites not sent for approval? I am not sure what sort of organisation you have been involved with, but anyone competent would check with the person or team who commissioned the work that it met the specification.

However this goes to the heart of the issue, which as you acknowledge is Virgin has a distain for its customers,

 

[warriorofrovac]

Okay so, I'll just let it be publicly known that I work for the Social Media team for VTEC.

Just before I get a torrent of abuse or people asking my initials so they know which one I am, I'm trying to gain information from the community about our feeds.

Is there anything that we do well? Anything that we don't do as well on or could improve?

 

[MG11]

Okay so, I'll just let it be publicly known that I work for the Social Media team for VTEC.

Just before I get a torrent of abuse or people asking my initials so they know which one I am, I'm trying to gain information from the community about our feeds.

Is there anything that we do well? Anything that we don't do as well on or could improve?

Sometimes you fail to acknowledge when the customer has a complaint, I recall one person complaining about a sandwich they were given and being told "it looks okay to me, but maybe I am easily pleased". I think the social media team do have a great charisma though and generally do a good job, I've always found them to be helpful and reliable.

 

[IanD]

Is there anything that we do well? Anything that we don't do as well on or could improve?

Have you read the first 13 pages of this thread?

 

[warriorofrovac]

Have you read the first 13 pages of this thread?

How many posts in the 13 pages are relevant or on topic to the questions I posed? I stopped reading after a while when it shifted to pages on bank holidays.

 

[Ginaro]

Okay so, I'll just let it be publicly known that I work for the Social Media team for VTEC.

Just before I get a torrent of abuse or people asking my initials so they know which one I am, I'm trying to gain information from the community about our feeds.

Is there anything that we do well? Anything that we don't do as well on or could improve?

The last six pages are all about a poor twitter response to confusion over first class upgrades bank holidays in Scotland v England onboard a train, and how your website is not clear about what happens in certain situations. Perhaps you could tell us what the exact policy is, and then get the VTEC website updated to reflect that?

 

[Marklund]

Okay so, I'll just let it be publicly known that I work for the Social Media team for VTEC.

Just before I get a torrent of abuse or people asking my initials so they know which one I am, I'm trying to gain information from the community about our feeds.

Is there anything that we do well? Anything that we don't do as well on or could improve?

Brave person, and good luck to you.
I'd say cut the smart-arsery and just provide info. The cheeky Virgin Style doesn't really amuse people when the proverbial has hit the fan, and they just want info, not GIF wars.

 

[ainsworth74]

I'd say cut the smart-arsery and just provide info. The cheeky Virgin Style doesn't really amuse people when the proverbial has hit the fan, and they just want info, not GIF wars.

That's perhaps the biggest thing for me.

When things are running okay maybe a few little delays but on the whole everything is hunky dory then yes go ahead and be cheeky and do your GIF thing (not for me but it is for others).

But when the wires have fallen down in Retford or some other catastrophe has occurred that is not the moment to be posting a cheeky GIF or trying to 'matey' with your passengers. Just get the info out there and cut the Virgin Style.

 

[IanD]

How many posts in the 13 pages are relevant or on topic to the questions I posed? I stopped reading after a while when it shifted to pages on bank holidays.

I suppose you won't know if you don't read them. Such dedication to your cause.

 

[AlterEgo]

Okay so, I'll just let it be publicly known that I work for the Social Media team for VTEC.

Just before I get a torrent of abuse or people asking my initials so they know which one I am, I'm trying to gain information from the community about our feeds.

Is there anything that we do well? Anything that we don't do as well on or could improve?

Things to improve on, in my view:

1) Don’t tweet gifs and metaphorically high five each other on Twitter when there’s serious disruption on.

2) Get yourselves trained on retailing tickets. There are some fundamental knowledge gaps.

3) Don’t tweet answers you’re not sure about. Take the extra few minutes to look them up.

4) Don’t always feel the need to have the last word. Sometimes you shouldn’t even reply to a first tweet, if it is obviously abusive or leading you down a dead end with no obvious resolution. Sometimes the customer just wants to shout at you. Feel empowered to ignore that sort of stuff.

 

[warriorofrovac]

In terms of being a smart-arse, this is more down to the individual than a company style. As had been said earlier in this thread from someone in Northern, we do receive a lot of abuse on a daily basis and there is only so many times I can be told to kill myself because a train is delayed before it gets grating and you do get a bit sarcy.

Unfortunately commuters aren't the worst, there are just as many rail enthusiasts who make our lives difficult..and there are many usernames here that I see crop up on twitter. Some have the mindset that since they are rail enthusiasts they know the company better than we do because someone who works on twitter all day can't possibly know anything about trains.

Sometimes we get the answer wrong, it happens...especially as people demand answers within seconds. Unfortunately there are those who will jump on every opportunity and mistake as a chance to slate the company. "Can't spell, so how can you run a train company" In times when it is busy, we simply don't have the manpower to be able to spend a few minutes to get the answer.

Things to improve on, in my view:

1) Don’t tweet gifs and metaphorically high five each other on Twitter when there’s serious disruption on.

2) Get yourselves trained on retailing tickets. There are some fundamental knowledge gaps.

3) Don’t tweet answers you’re not sure about. Take the extra few minutes to look them up.

4) Don’t always feel the need to have the last word. Sometimes you shouldn’t even reply to a first tweet, if it is obviously abusive or leading you down a dead end with no obvious resolution. Sometimes the customer just wants to shout at you. Feel empowered to ignore that sort of stuff.

That's some good feedback! Especially about retailing tickets. Are there any serious gaps on particular types you know of?

 

[Darandio]

we do receive a lot of abuse on a daily basis and there is only so many times I can be told to kill myself because a train is delayed before it gets grating and you do get a bit sarcy.

I can only imagine how terrible that feels, but surely you should then not reply? Giving a sarcy reply doesn't seem that professional, which seems to be a gripe used most often against VTEC Twitter.

 

[warriorofrovac]

I can only imagine how terrible that feels, but surely you should then not reply? Giving a sarcy reply doesn't seem that professional, which seems to be a gripe used most often against VTEC Twitter.

Sometimes a sarcy reply to someone like that will often shut them up...it's a bit of a reality check for them as they didn't expect to get a reply from an actual human being...other times, it's someone just frustrated in which case it definitely does come off as unprofessional...it's a fine balancing act.

Similarly, you can ignore some and they won't post again as they just wanted to vent...there are others that you'll ignore and that'll ignite a crusade in them to troll you online trying to get a rise...I've had that a lot where the individual has jumped on my reply to other people...which doesn't look great for us either. We can block them, sure! but we don't want to start blocking everyone who is mean to us.

 

[Marklund]

Sometimes a sarcy reply to someone like that will often shut them up...it's a bit of a reality check for them as they didn't expect to get a reply from an actual human being...other times, it's someone just frustrated in which case it definitely does come off as unprofessional...it's a fine balancing act.

Similarly, you can ignore some and they won't post again as they just wanted to vent...there are others that you'll ignore and that'll ignite a crusade in them to troll you online trying to get a rise...I've had that a lot where the individual has jumped on my reply to other people...which doesn't look great for us either. We can block them, sure! but we don't want to start blocking everyone who is mean to us.

That's a pretty honest answer, and I respect you for having to put up with the perils of social media like that.
Don't envy that at all.

I'd concur with what was said earlier. If there's info to be given, it really has to be 100% correct, especially fares information, as you are the face of the company, just as much as the Booking Office, and On Train staff are.

 

[AlterEgo]

That's some good feedback! Especially about retailing tickets. Are there any serious gaps on particular types you know of?

The errors I see are across the board - I just think general training would be useful. There is a lot of useful advice on this forum which is all cited and referenced. This is generally aimed at ticket purchasers but it the fares guide would be a useful place to start: https://www.railforums.co.uk/forums/railuk-fares-ticketing-guide.153/

I have done the Twitter desk role at two TOCs (neither of them are VTEC!). The job is basically as easy or as hard as you want to make it. Personally, I don’t think back-sassing customers is a good idea, nor is it constructive. If someone really wound me up then I would simply ignore them. Ignoring people can be as satisfying as indulging them. You should also take the attitude that you can’t win. Twitter is a very uneven playing field, distorted massively towards the little man. The little man is always right and the corporation is always wrong on Twitter. This is even more the case now than when I used to work the Twitter desk. Overall I’d rate the job as a very cushy one, I loved doing it, and as I said, it’s as easy a job as you want to make it. There’s scope to avoid a lot of conflict there, much more so than if you were front line at a station.

Edit: finally, you may wish to be aware that you are traceable on here and you should be careful what you say. It took me 20 seconds to find out which member of the Twitter team you are, along with other personal details. I’m not a creep, it’s just a lot of people don’t realise how easily accessible their details are!

 

[MG11]

Sometimes a sarcy reply to someone like that will often shut them up...it's a bit of a reality check for them as they didn't expect to get a reply from an actual human being...other times, it's someone just frustrated in which case it definitely does come off as unprofessional...it's a fine balancing act.

Similarly, you can ignore some and they won't post again as they just wanted to vent...there are others that you'll ignore and that'll ignite a crusade in them to troll you online trying to get a rise...I've had that a lot where the individual has jumped on my reply to other people...which doesn't look great for us either. We can block them, sure! but we don't want to start blocking everyone who is mean to us.

What about the customer who said that your refurbished trains look a little basic; meaning they expected a more intense refurbishment; one of your team replied with "we think you look a little basic", that's surely un-called for, the person wasn't being abusive, just giving feedback.
With regards to being told to go and kill yourself etc, then surely that is what the block option is there for, similar to if a passenger was abusive to a member of staff at the station, they can rightly be refused travel.
Working in customer service, you can't let one person's behaviour affect how you treat the rest of your customers. You have to not be able to treat every Tweet as a personal attack. It's a case of block and report, then move on and provide excellent service to the next Tweeter. I appreciate that your job can be mentally draining, but surely if you learnt not to treat insults from customers (who do not know you, cannot see you and would probably wish no harm on you personally if they did know you) personally and let it ride over you, you might find your job easier.

Similarly, on this forum, we have a small minority of members who might treat others without the respect they would give if not behind the anonnymous comfort of fake names and avatars, we as members just have to report what we can and not take it to heart.