Strengthening or additional services for football matches

[Flying Claret]

Hello. Does anybody know what criteria, or who makes the decision to provide strengthened or additional services for cetian football matches? I'm aware that northern do this from time to time. Is it the TOC or the transport police or a combination? I have a vested interest as Burnley are playing man citeh on Saturday with 7,600 travelling. I'm not convinced the current Tod curve express will cope with demand.
Thanks...

 

[bunnahabhain]

It tends to be whether anything is available and if there's likely to be enough demand. EMT regularly run extras and strengthen services, there was going to be a 2300 Manchester Piccadilly to Derby HST for a FOOTEX this Friday 5th Jan, however a message came out two days ago saying it had been cancelled. There are semi regular HST moves in the core East Midlands area including the odd one that has run to Stoke, Manchester, Liverpool and Cambridge before for various sporting events. There are also regular strengthening moves on local routes into Derby, Nottingham and occasionally Lincoln and Norwich for matches, as well as a 2226 Leicester to Nottingham Ivanhoe line service on weekdays only when Leicester City are at home.

 

[greyman42]

There is usually an additional Newcastle-Durham-Darlington service after Newcastle United's evening matches. This is formed of a terminator from Kings Cross.

 

[roversfan2001]

Some TOCs may be more open to running extras or strengthening services than others; some may simply not have the stock available. I know that Northern do sometimes run Blackburn-Mill Hill-Preston services when North End come to Ewood but it needs to be planned out, extras round the Todmorden curve on Saturday would depend if the relevant people were prepared for all of the plastics to turn up for one game.

There are alternatives to get to Burnley though, which may influence decisions. Changing at Blackburn would be one though I'm not sure how much it would impact journey time. The X43 bus also runs between Manchester and Burnley.

 

[dk1]

I worked one on Monday as the 17:20 Norwich-Cambridge. GA generally run a 17:20 (SO) to Ely after every NCFC home game. My New Years Day service had the platform closed off at 17:15 & we departed early at 17:18 as the 3-car 170 was absolutely rammed.

 

[DarloRich]

Hello. Does anybody know what criteria, or who makes the decision to provide strengthened or additional services for cetian football matches? I'm aware that northern do this from time to time. Is it the TOC or the transport police or a combination? I have a vested interest as Burnley are playing man citeh on Saturday with 7,600 travelling. I'm not convinced the current Tod curve express will cope with demand.
Thanks...

I think the answer is it depends. I am aware in the past of football clubs contacting TOC's directly to ask for additional services to be put on usually around play offs/cup finals etc. The TOC's and NR are also aware of the fixture list ( or at least the original one before Sky change it!) and will try to target resources where they can. The problem is thta there arent that many spare resources to go around!

I even went on a CRICEX once when Durham played at Lords. That was an additonal Newcastle>Durham>Darlo>York> London and return. I think it was a service rather than special train. GNER put on a Friday night extra for Darlo fans after one of our play off final games. It left Kings Cross about 2330 and got back to Darlo about 0300. Awful journey.

 

[Flying Claret]

Thanks for the responses. Northern have tweeted today to warn fans that train will be busy. But have not mentioned any extra or strengthened services. Could be interesting on the 17.54 return journey.

 

[Flying Claret]

There are alternatives to get to Burnley though, which may influence decisions. Changing at Blackburn would be one though I'm not sure how much it would impact journey time. The X43 bus also runs between Manchester and Burnley.[/QUOTE]

I looked at the via Blackburn option. Unfortunately the line is closed. RRB in operation. - that would mean there's
Some rolling stock available for extra services.... wouldn't It?

 

[Spartacus]

As everything's coming from Clitheroe I think the best you can expect is a 3 car rather than 4 car, which most trains were last Saturday, but that's still better than most from Burnley I think.

 

[Class 170101]

GA run extra trains for West Ham matches and longer trains Tottenham home matches (whilst at Wembley). I know when they were at White Hart Lane extra trains were operated.

Ipswich gets one on Saturdays (like today's 1Y71) when the line is open to London but not aware of a weekday service for a long time.

 

[wls1]

GA run extra trains for West Ham matches and longer trains Tottenham home matches (whilst at Wembley). I know when they were at White Hart Lane extra trains were operated.

Ipswich gets one on Saturdays (like today's 1Y71) when the line is open to London but not aware of a weekday service for a long time.

c2c likewise, on weekends all mainlines are usually 12 car and loops 8, and if its on weekdays, then several ECS services are turned into pax trains.

 

[30907]

As everything's coming from Clitheroe I think the best you can expect is a 3 car rather than 4 car, which most trains were last Saturday, but that's still better than most from Burnley I think.

One diagram 4 vice 3 according to Northern, including the 1656 ex Clitheroe.

 

[greyman42]

Hello. Does anybody know what criteria, or who makes the decision to provide strengthened or additional services for cetian football matches? I'm aware that northern do this from time to time. Is it the TOC or the transport police or a combination? I have a vested interest as Burnley are playing man citeh on Saturday with 7,600 travelling. I'm not convinced the current Tod curve express will cope with demand.
Thanks...

What were the journeys like?

 

[dk1]

Additional 20:30 Nrw-Lst ran tonight after Chelsea visited using bins. 20:00 IC turned people away as absolutely wedged. Catering would've done very well on the 2000/2100 had it not been for staff sickness

 

[darloscott]

Northern ran an additional Sunderland-Middlesbrough & return Express today for their FA Cup game, formed of 3x 142s.

 

[dk1]

Two additional pairs of bins ran as 17:15 Ipswich & 20:30 Norwich to Liverpool Street last night. The 20:00 IC from Norwich was standing room only front to back after the game against Chelsea.

 

[TwinTurbostar]

Chiltern were running an extra service on Thursday evening direct to Wembley Stadium, due to the Spurs vs West Ham match. Not sure how busy that was but it was delayed by a couple minutes according to Realtime Trains. I'm not sure how long it was but it certainly looked like at least two DMU's together.

 

[Dai Corner]

Probably the biggest operations are in Cardiff for matches / events at the Principality Stadium, which is in the centre of the City a few minutes walk from Central station.

https://m.arrivatrainswales.co.uk/events/

ATW say 40,000 people get the train home after the match. i think it was after a EUFA cup match last year that there were simultaneous departures timetabled on the up Main and Relief lines every 15 minutes.

 

[GW43125]

Probably the biggest operations are in Cardiff for matches / events at the Principality Stadium, which is in the centre of the City a few minutes walk from Central station.

https://m.arrivatrainswales.co.uk/events/

ATW say 40,000 people get the train home after the match. i think it was after a EUFA cup match last year that there were simultaneous departures timetabled on the up Main and Relief lines every 15 minutes.

Remember it well. Rugby Cup final 3rd June. 4tph to London between 10pm and 4am. 67&mk2s drafted in to cover for an HST shortage...

My sole experience of travelling on GA on a match day was terrible. Lowestoft-Norwich on a single 153. Wedged doesn’t cut it. Guard begged for an extra unit to no avail.

 

[306024]

No amount of begging will help if there simply ain't a unit available. The rural lines into Norwich are always under pressure on match days, one reason why the Stadler fleet will be welcome. Elsewhere in EMU land it is relatively easy for GA to strengthen and run additional trains so long as it is outside the Mon-Fri peak.

 

[GW43125]

No amount of begging will help if there simply ain't a unit available. The rural lines into Norwich are always under pressure on match days, one reason why the Stadler fleet will be welcome. Elsewhere in EMU land it is relatively easy for GA to strengthen and run additional trains so long as it is outside the Mon-Fri peak.

It’s quite a kick in the teeth when you’ve got double 156s going the other way carting fresh air and you’re wedged in a single 153.

 

[306024]

Depends what the 2x156 previously did, or were required to do next. Perhaps strengthened for a similar working into Norwich from Yarmouth? Obviously better to have a 2 car and a 3 car train rather than a 1 car and a 4 car, but things can change constantly from the moment the units leave the depot. It isn't always as black and white as it appears.

 

[dk1]

It’s quite a kick in the teeth when you’ve got double 156s going the other way carting fresh air and you’re wedged in a single 153.

It wouldn't have been done on purpose.

 

[GW43125]

It wouldn't have been done on purpose.

I'm not saying it was. It's just irritating. That's all.

I get units can't be all over the place, to be fair to them there was nothing (except a 90) in Clown Point when we came past.

 

[Mag_seven]

Clown Point

 

[prod_pep]

Here are a few I'm aware of:

In WAGN and FCC days, there were football extras provided for Arsenal home games on the Hertford and Welwyn stoppers which terminated at Finsbury Park, then started there for the return workings. I think this practice continued into GTR's reign too but it has since been stopped. There were also outer suburban extras including one from Royston IIRC.

For Brighton home matches at Falmer, Southern's recent arrangements have been a 6 car 313 on the Brighton - Lewes service and a combination of 6, 7 and/or 8 car 377s on the Seaford workings.

When matches are on at Hampden Park, ScotRail provide regular Glasgow Central - Mount Florida shuttles (normally a 380 but previously 314s and 334s). The Cathcart Circle locals are also bumped up to 6 cars.

Finally, Merseyrail. They provide no extra services and almost never any additional capacity for football matches despite very high usage and a 'Soccerbus' service to both stadiums. Overcrowding is severe and trains almost always leave people behind in the aftermath of fixtures due to the lack of 6 car workings.

 

[GW43125]

On the flipside however, SWT bring in an entire extra half hourly service when there’s rugby at Twickenham!

 

[Fred26]

Here are a few I'm aware of:

In WAGN and FCC days, there were football extras provided for Arsenal home games on the Hertford and Welwyn stoppers which terminated at Finsbury Park, then started there for the return workings. I think this practice continued into GTR's reign too but it has since been stopped. There were also outer suburban extras including one from Royston IIRC.

They still run. However, GTR started cancelling them so often that they are now not advertised unless they are running. Control do not even bother to inform frontline staff that they're not running. Sometimes they turn up, sometimes not.

 

[Clansman]

When matches are on at Hampden Park, ScotRail provide regular Glasgow Central - Mount Florida shuttles (normally a 380 but previously 314s and 334s). The Cathcart Circle locals are also bumped up to 6 cars.

Kings Park also recieves non stop services from there to Central, but not prior to each event at Hampden.

 

[61653 HTAFC]

In years gone by, Northern have run an extra Sheffield to Huddersfield service when one of the South Yorkshire sides were playing us. Though due to capacity on the Penistone line they ran via Horbury with a reversal at Wakefield Kirkgate. We also had TPE run an additional 185 from Piccadilly to York after last year's FA Cup replay...

Though when we're at home, the 1311 from Batley towards Huddersfield will invariably be a 2-car Pacer!