Bizzare Journey Route Suggestion

[First class]

Hi,

Just being using NRES for a lookup for Liverpool-Fishguard, and one of the three possible journeys was:

Liverpool-Chester (fair enough start...)
Chester-Holyhead (Erm, we're going the completely wrong direction!)
Holyhead-Dublin Ferryport (Ok, now we're in a wrong country!)
Dublin Ferryport-Dublin Connolly
Dublin Connolly-Enniscorthy
Enniscorthy-Rosslare Europort
Rosslare Europort-Fishguard Harbour (Finally- still got me here earlier than the train!)

Total Journey Time: 16 hours 32 minutes

I did not specify a 'VIA', it automatically routed me via Ireland. That must be up there in the Top 10 suggested routes!! Funnily enough it wouldn't give me the option of booking a £16.25 Single

Raises two questions:

1) What does it say about the train service there, if it is quicker to sail via another country?!
2) Shouldn't NRES be a bit more robust to suggest such ludicrous journeys?

Anybody got any other funny suggested journeys they'd like to share?

 

[mumrar]

Hi,

Just being using NRES for a lookup for Liverpool-Fishguard, and one of the three possible journeys was:

Liverpool-Chester (fair enough start...)
Chester-Holyhead (Erm, we're going the completely wrong direction!)
Holyhead-Dublin Ferryport (Ok, now we're in a wrong country!)
Dublin Ferryport-Dublin Connolly
Dublin Connolly-Enniscorthy
Enniscorthy-Rosslare Europort
Rosslare Europort-Fishguard Harbour (Finally- still got me here earlier than the train!)

Total Journey Time: 16 hours 32 minutes

I did not specify a 'VIA', it automatically routed me via Ireland. That must be up there in the Top 10 suggested routes!! Funnily enough it wouldn't give me the option of booking a £16.25 Single

Raises two questions:

1) What does it say about the train service there, if it is quicker to sail via another country?!
2) Shouldn't NRES be a bit more robust to suggest such ludicrous journeys?

Anybody got any other funny suggested journeys they'd like to share?

Whilst it is very poor, the week link is the service to Fishguard. It would be like calling trains a poor mode of transport because you can't get from Cambridge to Sugar Loaf quickly. You also didn't provide dates and times this journey was due to set out.

 

[First class]

No matter what date or time you put in, you still only get three options!

 

[mumrar]

No matter what date or time you put in, you still only get three options!

I did the enquiry for today and got the 3 options. No wonder the one is slower than the ferry, it is starting from Liverpool at 21.34! If you leave at 06.33 it takes under 7 hours to reach Fishguard

 

[krus_aragon]

There is some madness in NRE's method, given that Fishguard only sees two trains a day, which come to meet the ferry! If you can take the train as far as Whitland or Clarbeston Road, and then leap on a bus, you may get there sooner.

In your defence, however, NRE shouldn't list a (strange) route and then refuse to sell any tickets for it.

 

[googolplex]

I once had it suggest for a Crewe to Swansea trip Crewe-Runcorn-Crewe-Swansea with no vias specified etc.
They seem to have fixed it now, but it did strike me as rather odd at the time!

 

[matt]

Whats at Fishguard other than a ferry port? I would have thought most people going to Fishguard would be travelling to Ireland anyway.

 

[yorkie]

I did not specify a 'VIA', it automatically routed me via Ireland. That must be up there in the Top 10 suggested routes!! Funnily enough it wouldn't give me the option of booking a £16.25 Single

But NRES doesn't sell tickets anyway.

I tried it on thetrainline leaving at 8am and it also gave a 16+ hour journey, I assume it was routing via Ireland but when I clicked on the journey details it didn't show me any times and just gave an error message.

So I specified via Crewe and it came up with a journey of 7 hours 22 mins for the night arrival into Fishguard or 6 hours 44 mins for the early afternoon arrival. There are 2 trains per day into Fishguard.

I conclude that it isn't actually quicker via Ireland at all, but it is true that if you miss the first journey opportunity then you would get to Fishguard earlier if you go via Ireland rather than hang around for the next train. So if you ask to leave Liverpool at, say, 8am, the 0631 has left and it's ages until the connection to arrive for 0126, therefore it suggests you go via Ireland for a 0045 arrival.

So it's a non-story really.

 

[northernrail2009]

Whats at Fishguard other than a ferry port? I would have thought most people going to Fishguard would be travelling to Ireland anyway.

Nowt there as you say its just a small town with the port in it.

I wouldnt go to Fishguard for any other reason then to get the ferry.

 

[krus_aragon]

Whats at Fishguard other than a ferry port? I would have thought most people going to Fishguard would be travelling to Ireland anyway.

As I recall it's one of the larger towns in northern Pembrokeshire, and has a bit of tourist trade in the surrounding area. The train service would have long been cut if not for the ferry: all the intermediate stations on the branch have been closed since Beeching's days.

 

[Thewanderer]

Hi,

Just being using NRES for a lookup for Liverpool-Fishguard, and one of the three possible journeys was:

Liverpool-Chester (fair enough start...)
Chester-Holyhead (Erm, we're going the completely wrong direction!)
Holyhead-Dublin Ferryport (Ok, now we're in a wrong country!)
Dublin Ferryport-Dublin Connolly
Dublin Connolly-Enniscorthy
Enniscorthy-Rosslare Europort
Rosslare Europort-Fishguard Harbour (Finally- still got me here earlier than the train!)

Total Journey Time: 16 hours 32 minutes

I did not specify a 'VIA', it automatically routed me via Ireland. That must be up there in the Top 10 suggested routes!! Funnily enough it wouldn't give me the option of booking a £16.25 Single

Raises two questions:

1) What does it say about the train service there, if it is quicker to sail via another country?!
2) Shouldn't NRES be a bit more robust to suggest such ludicrous journeys?

Anybody got any other funny suggested journeys they'd like to share?

See you in Ireland so

 

[First class]

Incidentally, I've chosen to go from Liverpool-Holyhead via Fishguard on Wednesday. Priv staff get free ferry travel to/from Ireland.

I have to get the 0740 train from Rosslare-Dun Laohaire, (single).

Does anybody happen to know:

1) How much this fare will cost, and if I need a reservation
2) From Rosslare Europort to the station, and from Dun Laohaire to the ferry port, is it straightforward and well signed, or am I going to get lost?

Thanks!

 

[metrocammel]

Incidentally, I've chosen to go from Liverpool-Holyhead via Fishguard on Wednesday. Priv staff get free ferry travel to/from Ireland.

Liverpool to Holyhead via Fishguard..... that's an interesting route

and regards to the 'free' ferry travel, there's no such thing as a free lunch*...

You have to pay some sort of port tax. That works at at around £12 (each crossing) iirc.

*Some safeguarded staff and dependants/ spouses do get free travel on ferries, but it all depends on if the person in question was British Rail staff before Sealink was sold off. I am not sure on the technicalities of this, but as Sealink was privatised in 1984, you must have been employed before then to get any free ferry priviledges. I am not sure about Cal Mac privileges though, as far as I can assertain, that was never part of Sealink, but some BR staff did get free travel on Cal Mac (it was owned by LNER in the 1940s, and subsquently into the early days of BR, so this is possibly a throw back to any staff that may have been employed before this time- and of course, retired staff who still retain their priviledges)

 

[Thewanderer]

Incidentally, I've chosen to go from Liverpool-Holyhead via Fishguard on Wednesday. Priv staff get free ferry travel to/from Ireland.

I have to get the 0740 train from Rosslare-Dun Laohaire, (single).

Does anybody happen to know:

1) How much this fare will cost, and if I need a reservation
2) From Rosslare Europort to the station, and from Dun Laohaire to the ferry port, is it straightforward and well signed, or am I going to get lost?

Thanks!

First Class,

A Priv Standard Single from Rosslare Europort to Dun-Laoghaire is €10.

The rail station is about a 5-10 min walk from the ferry terminal. I have a map attached. The terminal is at the top centre, while the rail station (sorry shack) is at the roundabout at bottom centre. When exiting the terminal, turn left and follow the footpath around and out of the terminal.

The 0740 Rosslare Europort - Connolly is booked for a 2800 class unit in a 6 car formation, however a 4 car 29000 class unit can also turn up.

http://thewanderersirishrailphotos.fotopic.net/p55044807.html
shows the 2800's and 29000's at their home depot of Drogheda. In some cases you might get a 2600 + 2800 combo. Beware the 2600's have no tables and bench type seating. The 2800's have Richmond seats.

At Dun-Laoghaire the ferry terminal is next door to the train station. Upon exiting the barriers at Dun-Laoghaire TURN LEFT, pass the small retail outlet, down the stairs / escalator and exit the station. Cross the road and your at the ferry terminal.

Enjoy the trip!

The Wanderer.

 

[glynn80]

Incidentally, I've chosen to go from Liverpool-Holyhead via Fishguard on Wednesday. Priv staff get free ferry travel to/from Ireland.

I have to get the 0740 train from Rosslare-Dun Laohaire, (single).

Does anybody happen to know:

1) How much this fare will cost, and if I need a reservation
2) From Rosslare Europort to the station, and from Dun Laohaire to the ferry port, is it straightforward and well signed, or am I going to get lost?

Thanks!

Priv staff do not get free travel to Ireland, they are still required to pay Port Tax. This is £6.25 each way for the Irish Ferries route from Holyhead to Dublin. However this route is only available for Safeguarded staff and not for those who are TOCNE.

The ferry facilities you are entitled to, are clearly detailed within this document on the ATOC RST website (http://www.atoc.org/rst/_download/rules_guides/SRLS034_0609_ TOCNE.pdf), on pages 5 and 6. The only company that permit TOCNE to gain discounts to Ireland are Stena Line. The port tax chargeable on Stena Line services is £5.00 each way for the Stranraer to Belfast and Rosslaire to Fishguard routes.

 

[First class]

TOC Privilege Cards issued to TOCNE and their dependants are recognised
by Stena Line for free travel on its services to Eire and Northern Ireland.
Port Tax tickets must be obtained in advance and must be presented at the
embarkation port.

Valid on:

Holyhead-Dublin
Fishguard-Rosslare
Holyhead-Dun Laohaire

£5 port tax in each direction.

In ATOC's own words, it clearly says FREE. All of Stena's Irish routes are Free (subject to port tax). This applies whether safeguarded or not. I've done Holyhead-Dublin before, and I emailed my PRIV to the concessions department.

Also, in Ireland, do I need to use my FIP card to get a PRIV fare or is my normal ATOC one ok?

 

[glynn80]

TOC Privilege Cards issued to TOCNE and their dependants are recognised
by Stena Line for free travel on its services to Eire and Northern Ireland.
Port Tax tickets must be obtained in advance and must be presented at the
embarkation port.

Valid on:

Holyhead-Dublin
Fishguard-Rosslare
Holyhead-Dun Laohaire

£5 port tax in each direction.

I am not disputing any of the above, I stated that TOCNE were not permitted to use Irish Ferries route from Holyhead to Dublin, the Stena Line route is perfectly valid.

In ATOC's own words, it clearly says FREE. All of Stena's Irish routes are Free (subject to port tax). This applies whether safeguarded or not. I've done Holyhead-Dublin before, and I emailed my PRIV to the concessions department.

Just to clarify, when somebody mentions that they are entitled to "free travel" with regard to a facility, I usually take that to mean they do not pay for that facility, apologise if you were trying to infer a meaning other than this.

Also, in Ireland, do I need to use my FIP card to get a PRIV fare or is my normal ATOC one ok?

In Ireland you will need to use your FIP card to obtain PRIV rate however in Northern Ireland, I have had it confirmed by human resources management at NIR that an ATOC Privilege Discount Card will be accepted for the PRIV discount on their services.

 

[Thewanderer]

In Ireland you will need to use your FIP card to obtain PRIV rate however in Northern Ireland, I have had it confirmed by human resources management at NIR that an ATOC Privilege Discount Card will be accepted for the PRIV discount on their services.

This is incorrect.

A UK TOC Priv Card is vaild on all scheduled IE services.

My priv entitles me to travel on the following "foreign" companies.

Northern Ireland Railways.
ATOC / GBR Rail.
LUL
Stena Line
Irish Ferries.

 

[glynn80]

This is incorrect.

A UK TOC Priv Card is vaild on all scheduled IE services.

My priv entitles me to travel on the following "foreign" companies.

Northern Ireland Railways.
ATOC / GBR Rail.
LUL
Stena Line
Irish Ferries.

I am assuming you are an CIE Privilege Holder and if so I can only concur that your facilities are slightly different to ours. The FRPP does confirm that CIE Privilege Ticket Identity Holders are entitled to Reduced Rate Travel, without the need for a FIP card.

Privilege Ticket Identity Cards held by staff of the following administrations with that administration’s title printed on Cards:

Irish Ferries Ltd.
Irish Rail - Coras lompair Eireann (CIE)
Caledonian MacBrayne Ltd
Northern Ireland Railways

I am also assuming however, that this is not the case for all CIE employees (hence the fact the FRPP stated the administration's title must be printed on the card) and probably only applies to those that started employment before a certain date, similar to that of Safeguarded and TOCNE in the UK. Perhaps you can enlighten us Thewanderer?

With regard to ATOC PRIV holders, nowhere have I found it documented that an ATOC Staff Travel Card is valid for PRIV discounts on IE services. We in the UK, use the documents listed on the ATOC website, which list in detail what we are entitled to (http://www.atoc.org/rst/Travel_ Facilities_ Guides.asp). In said guides, it does state you must use your FIP card if attempting to gain reduced rate travel on foreign undertakings of which IE is one of the listed foreign administrations.

I did telephone NIR to clarify the issue surrounding their services and they did confirm that their services can be used at reduced rate travel without the FIP card and the ATOC Staff Travel Card would be sufficient. I have yet to attempt to use my PRIV on IE so cannot confirm if there is anything similar to the NIR arrangement, other than to say officially according to ATOC, it doesn't seem valid.

 

[Thewanderer]

I am assuming you are an CIE Privilege Holder and if so I can only concur that your facilities are slightly different to ours. The FRPP does confirm that CIE Privilege Ticket Identity Holders are entitled to Reduced Rate Travel, without the need for a FIP card.


I am also assuming however, that this is not the case for all CIE employees (hence the fact the FRPP stated the administration's title must be printed on the card) and probably only applies to those that started employment before a certain date, similar to that of Safeguarded and TOCNE in the UK. Perhaps you can enlighten us Thewanderer?

With regard to ATOC PRIV holders, nowhere have I found it documented that an ATOC Staff Travel Card is valid for PRIV discounts on IE services. We in the UK, use the documents listed on the ATOC website, which list in detail what we are entitled to (http://www.atoc.org/rst/Travel_ Facilities_ Guides.asp). In said guides, it does state you must use your FIP card if attempting to gain reduced rate travel on foreign undertakings of which IE is one of the listed foreign administrations.

I did telephone NIR to clarify the issue surrounding their services and they did confirm that their services can be used at reduced rate travel without the FIP card and the ATOC Staff Travel Card would be sufficient. I have yet to attempt to use my PRIV on IE so cannot confirm if there is anything similar to the NIR arrangement, other than to say officially according to ATOC, it doesn't seem valid.

Hi Glynn,

I have had this checked out and can confirm that all BR / ATOC Priv Cards are accepted for travel on IE services.

With regards our Priv Cards, all cards are vaild on the services listed on my last post unless endorsed on the front. The most common one is "Not valid Irish Ferries". Contract staff don't get Priv on Irish Ferries but all other staff do. I have never seen a Priv card that doesn't allow travel on ATOC services, possibly Dublin Bus and Bus Eireann Staff have such an endorsement as we all use the same design of card.

The Wanderer.