Chains as a measurement.

[greyman42]

Why are Chains still used as a measurement of distance on the Rail network. They seem to be an outdated way of measuring distance to most people and most people do not even know what one is, never mind how far a chain is.

 

[D869]

Why not, no they are not and yes we do.

 

[Altfish]

The railway is made up of mile posts. A chain is an 80th of a mile which is handy in that it is divisible by 2, 4, 8, 16, 5, 10, 20 and 40.
In the ideal world we'd work in Km, m and mm. But that means digging up all the mile posts and replacing them with Km posts.

Chains are good

 

[kentuckytony]

I am in the US of A and I know all about chains. I went off and did full research after I got into UK trains.
It wasn't hard and makes a lot of sense. It also makes one feel apart of railway history and part of a special group.
I have a hand-drawn diagram of all the derivations needed. (Will post of anyone is interested.)

 

[InOban]

It must cause confusion since the distance markers along the line are in km, aren't they? And no-one under about 50 was taught imperial measurements at school. The rod, pole or perch, anyone?

 

[Darandio]

It must cause confusion since the distance markers along the line are in km, aren't they?

Where? UK? No.

 

[MichaelWells]

It must cause confusion since the distance markers along the line are in km, aren't they? And no-one under about 50 was taught imperial measurements at school. The rod, pole or perch, anyone?

22 year old, taught Imperial in school, uses both Imperial and Metric in a Job. prefer a mix of both really, Miles and Meters

 

[Hellzapoppin]

But not everyone works on the railway and us that do understand perfectly what chains are. Why do you say it's outdated ? Why change something just because it's old ?It's metric I don't understand.

 

[bearhugger]

I am in the US of A and I know all about chains. I went off and did full research after I got into UK trains.
It wasn't hard and makes a lot of sense. It also makes one feel apart of railway history and part of a special group.
I have a hand-drawn diagram of all the derivations needed. (Will post of anyone is interested.)

Yes please, if you don't mind!

 

[Y Ddraig Coch]

to be fair I don't know how many Turkish lira or Japanese yen there are to the great British pound at the moment. google in seconds gives me a currency calculator and tells me though. The same can easily be done for miles / km and chains , it's 2017, google is your friend

 

[birchesgreen]

It must cause confusion since the distance markers along the line are in km, aren't they? And no-one under about 50 was taught imperial measurements at school. The rod, pole or perch, anyone?

I believe they have started teaching kids it again. I wasn't though as i am old and imperial is meaningless to me, but i can use google.

 

[robbeech]

Where? UK? No.

OHLE is measured in KM. This is something i only found out the other day.

 

[Darandio]

OHLE is measured in KM. This is something i only found out the other day.

Thats a new one on me too. I did think the thread was about track distance though.

 

[Ploughman]

Just think of the amount of historic records that would need amending.
Most structures are located in miles and chains.
Bridges, Culverts, Drains etc to name a few.

 

[GRALISTAIR]

I thought one chain was the exact length of a cricket pitch

 

[Spankthemonkey]

Part of our heritage, chains are railways and cricket pitches, Britain's two greatest gifts to the world. Surprised the EU didn't try to metric it out when they did our fruit and veg stalls a few years back.

 

[snowball]

OHLE is measured in KM. This is something i only found out the other day.

Depends when it was put up. On the WCML the numbers on the overhead structures use miles south of Weaver Junction (1960s) and kilometres north of there (1970s). The ECML is all km.

Edit: all civil engineering design has been done in metric since the early 1970s, so projects like the Reading remodelling or Norton Bridge flyover, to give two recent examples, will have been designed entirely in metric.

 

[ainsworth74]

I thought one chain was the exact length of a cricket pitch

I think you'll find that it's the cricket pitch that is the exact length of a chain not the other way round!

 

[8stewartt]

One chain is 22 yards which is a cricket pitch. There are 10 chains in a furlong and 8 furlongs in a mile. I'm 26, it's quite easy.

 

[snowball]

One chain is 22 yards which is a cricket pitch. There are 10 chains in a furlong and 8 furlongs in a mile. I'm 26, it's quite easy.

Cricket would be simpler in metric. 22 yards is 20.1168m and nobody would notice if the .1168 (less than 5 inches) was dropped.

 

[TUC]

But not everyone works on the railway and us that do understand perfectly what chains are. Why do you say it's outdated ? Why change something just because it's old ?It's metric I don't understand.

WellI'm 55 and I haven't got a clue how long a chain is. I was only taught metric even when I was at school.

 

[WatcherZero]

Part of our heritage, chains are railways and cricket pitches, Britain's two greatest gifts to the world. Surprised the EU didn't try to metric it out when they did our fruit and veg stalls a few years back.

They didnt, only EU rule was metric measurements had to be displayed alongside imperial. Metrication goes back further, in 1963 the confederation of British Industry surveyed its members and the majority wanted to shift to bring alignment with the US, in 1965 it became official policy of British industry and in 1966 the government issued a white paper on the change and announced they would decimalise the currency by 71.

 

[MarkyT]

As a rule of thumb for backs of fag packets, envelopes etc, it's worth noting a chain is fairly close to 20 metres in length. On that basis one quarter mile is about 400m (actually 402.25m) Continental railways are often marked every 200m, i.e. 5 lengths per km. I had to become fairly proficient in quickly converting between the systems on joining British Rail back in the 1980s. Fully metric surveyors still use the term 'chainage' for longitudinal distance along an alignment, road or rail. It derives from using standard length physical chains in measurement. I don't see the point of a widescale conversion today. On the fly conversion has never been easier and mileposts are really landmark datum points that are rarely a true mile apart, being affected by any inaccuracies in the initial setting out possibly nearly two centuries ago, as well as periodic slewing and realignment.

 

[xotGD]

What next? Convert all of our railways to 1 metre gauge?

If you want weird units of measurement, try the acre-foot as a unit of volume - used in the US.

 

[Class 170101]

Part of our heritage, chains are railways and cricket pitches, Britain's two greatest gifts to the world. Surprised the EU didn't try to metric it out when they did our fruit and veg stalls a few years back.

They did try. I think I read / heard that until HS1 it was illegal to use metric measurements on the railway. To get EU money for HS1 there needed to be a change in the law as HS1 is measured in metric and not imperial.

 

[pdeaves]

Depends when it was put up. On the WCML the numbers on the overhead structures use miles south of Weaver Junction (1960s) and kilometres north of there (1970s). The ECML is all km.

This page shows which bits are imperial and which are metric: http://www.railwaycodes.org.uk/electrification/mast_prefix1.shtm

 

[pdeaves]

In the ideal world we'd work in Km, m and mm. But that means digging up all the mile posts and replacing them with Km posts.

A bigger problem is changing all the records. Do not underestimate how many there are!

 

[StarCrossing]

Cricket would be simpler in metric. 22 yards is 20.1168m and nobody would notice if the .1168 (less than 5 inches) was dropped.

Would you like 10-ball overs too?

 

[Bevan Price]

I am not sure if it has ever been repealed, but it was a legal requirement for railways to locate mileposts every 1/4 mile. I think the idea arose to prevent malpractice by some "dodgy" rail managements, who charged (freight) customers on the basis of "exaggerated" mileages.

Yes - modern surveys are metric, but the cost of replacing every milepost would be horrendous, and there are much better uses for the money.

 

[Hellzapoppin]

I have access to the legacy as built cabling drawings for the Western and they're all in imperial measurements, some of them for the Swindon works go back to the 1940s, would be impossible to try and convert them to metric.