People boarding before everyone has alighted

[DarloRich]

Is there anything that can be done about the crowds of people on platforms pushing onto trains before everyone has alighted?

I've tried a polite but firm raised voice, but it just gets me a torrent of abuse in return, while the few platform staff that do exist just look on from a distance.

Last night at Birmingham New Street I was among the last few people to alight from a terminating service and had to fight my way through the press of bodies crowding around the door and onto the train. Do people have no common sense or courtesy at all?

no they don't.

It isn't a problem for me. I am a former prop forward and tend to block the door way. Plus people bounce of me when they try to push past. I am also quite northern and happy to unleash a barrage of industrial language at such people. Tends to work '-)

 

[PeterC]

I once saw a well dressed businessman plant his briefcase in the middle of the chest of the person who was blocking him and push them right across to the platform wall.

I have pushed people out of the way when getting off an Underground train before now.

 

[AFC440]

The only place I know where that is done deliberately (and one day it's going to get someone killed) is Bank LU.

Reading this thread I immediately thought of Bank station. Had the door shut on me before customers were even off a few weeks ago. This was around 22:30 on a Saturday night so while busy, it wasn’t rush hour and several mins until next train so no reason why driver would be in such a hurry to leave.

 

[Bletchleyite]

Surprised to see it done when quiet. It is usual practice at Bank when it's really busy, but that's because the service would grind to a halt if they didn't. Equally, it is really dangerous.

I think there won't be a solution until Crossrail opens, at which point demand will reduce a bit and so it'll be less of an issue.

 

[al78]

I've never had this problem, and I always wait for people to get off, if nothing else, it is easier to go through a door when someone else isn't trying to come through it the other way. If people are trying to force their way oin when you are getting off, you could try just standing in the doorway, blocking it, and if anyone complains, just say in as patronising a voice as you can manage, that you can't get off the train if everyone insists on blocking your way. You still might get abuse, but the abuse is because people don't like their stupidity/thoughtlessness exposed, well tough, stuff em.This might only work if you are a big build, I doubt my 11 stone slender frame could pull it off.

 

[185143]

I was once at the front to board a 185 at Piccadilly and blatantly refused to budge until everyone had alighted. This was met with a LOT of pushing from passengers behind-and a few decided to give me abuse. That said, I'd do it again tomorrow!

I've stood in the doorway a few times too and refused to move until I could physically get off. I did once barge someone off the Metrolink-just as the doors were closing (at a different stop)-as he chose to barge past me when boarding...

Though it's not as frustrating as when people blatantly refuse to move down the aisles! One night last December, having already missed the previous service IIRC, I was on the verge of being left behind on a TPE at Occy Road by people who wouldn't move-telling me there was no space. As I could quite clearly see a bit of room in the aisle, I politely but rather firmly made it VERY clear that I WAS boarding that train... sure enough people soon moved!

 

[bramling]

If someone is being aggressive and breaking the law, then sometimes you need to give them robust instructions. Speak authoritatively and assertively, and with good use of language, and there is a chance they will listen (or at least think twice in future).

I will stand up for people who are being mistreated, where practicable.

The trouble is that there are plenty of people who talk authoritatively and assertively but what they’re coming out with is complete crap. Either through plain ignorance, or because they know this method often gets them what they want.

Whilst inter-personal dynamics can be a fascinating subject, there are times when I wish I could have an exclusion zone around me simply to avoid having to deal with idiots. One can but wish, but in all fairness there are way more good people than bad around, just sadly those bad ones really make themselves noticed.

 

[infobleep]

If anyone is in my way and where they shouldn't be I'll carry on through as best I can, especially if I've got a train to catch.

There is a section of the stairs at Surbtion, which can only fit one person before it hits a hand rail. Some people go up it, even though it says no exit at the bottom. Well I go down it, especially if I have a train catch. If they are there as well tough. I just go passed them as best I can. To be fair I have seen staff at the bottom to act as a barrier on more than one occasion.

As for getting off trains, if i haxe a bag I'm holding I will put that out in front of me or my arm. Will go out slightly. Then I try to carve my way through.

If I'm waiting I always stand to the side and wait for people to get off.

If others around me don't like anything I do, in respect if the things I've mentioned above, I wouldn't generally know, as I can't really read subtle body language! That can have its advantages at times like these.

 

[matt_world2004]

From my experiance people in London are better at waiting for people to get off than outside London, sometimes if people are late leaving boarding the train people walk on but apart from that most people wait (except in the tourist areas)

 

[infobleep]

That is a very silly comment indeed.

The idea of blowing whistles is to encourage people to get a move on so that services can run to time.

I’m sure you’re the first to complain when your train is late. Lateness is often due to passengers dawdling, large groups all attempting to board through one door etc.

You often hear them saying stand clear of the doors the train is ready to depart when people are getting on. When the next train isn't for 30 minutes, I certainly wouldn't be following their advice.

However I know it's to discourage people who might be rushing down the stairs. As is the don't board this train it is ready to leave automated announcements. That one can start playing as soon as passengers attempt to disembark.

A bigger source of encouragement to board a train that is about to depart though is the automated announcements advertising said train. Some of these have a habit of still playing as the train doors have closed and even sometimes as it's departing! When this happens and they announced passengers for x...., I immediately say to myself "Have just missed the train".

 

[Stampy]

Whilst waiting at PBO once for a relation to arrive recently, I witnessed the following.....

Due to a "operating incident" - trains were running late on East Coast, and as a consequence most of the trains were packed.

I'd checked up on RTT about the train I was waiting for, and it showed it passing Tallington, so it'd be about 10 mins or so before it arrived into PBO.

Meanwhile, a train pulled into Platform 1 and it was packed, and there were a few people on the platform trying to get on, it was then I saw....

One irate bloke in a suit stood ON the platform, literally grab a bloke on the TRAIN - haul him off, and then jump on in his place, before punching the door close button....

The poor chap (now on the platform) did a double take and then tried to get back on the train.....

He did get back on, as the local BTP promptly hauled Mr Business Suit OFF the train, and into the office for "a chat".

 

[YorkshireBear]

Today the same happened, Short formed service (Leeds - Liverpool) arrived at Piccadilly to people trying to push on. Fortunately I am 18 stone so actually they achieve very little and my bag has this homing beacon that seems to do well at hitting people.

 

[TwistedMentat]

I tend to go with the put my shoulder into it and barge through people trying to get on while I'm getting off.

But being a larger white male makes that a pretty viable option for me.

I have from time to time shouted for people to stand back so we can get off. Usually gets a response of people pulling back. No polite asking, a simple command and people will often listen without thinking.

 

[Bromley boy]

no they don't.

It isn't a problem for me. I am a former prop forward and tend to block the door way. Plus people bounce of me when they try to push past. I am also quite northern and happy to unleash a barrage of industrial language at such people. Tends to work '-)

“Industrial language” is always so much more effective when delivered in a broad northern accent.

 

[sw1ller]

Nice little trick I like to use is to get on the 1st class door where nobody is using and walk down the carriage into the vestibule. You then have to wait politely for everyone to carry on getting off but you’re already in the carriage as the last one passes. Nice little queue jump and nobody’s the wiser. Stress free and a seat. Dancer.

 

[mallard]

Nice little trick I like to use is to get on the 1st class door where nobody is using and walk down the carriage into the vestibule. You then have to wait politely for everyone to carry on getting off but you’re already in the carriage as the last one passes. Nice little queue jump and nobody’s the wiser. Stress free and a seat. Dancer.

That's totally unacceptable in my opinion. It certainly doesn't go unnoticed when I'm waiting to board and people jump the queue that way. You should wait your turn like everybody else. People moving through the train should wait for everyone who actually queued for that carriage to board before being allowed through.

While it's impractical and probably has safety implications, it'd be so much better if the inter-carriage doors were locked while the external doors are open.

 

[sw1ller]

That's totally unacceptable in my opinion. It certainly doesn't go unnoticed when I'm waiting to board and people jump the queue that way. You should wait your turn like everybody else. People moving through the train should wait for everyone who actually queued for that carriage to board before being allowed through.

While it's impractical and probably has safety implications, it'd be so much better if the inter-carriage doors were locked while the external doors are open.

Wait my turn like everyone else! This whole thread is about people being polite and waiting their turn!

No, use your nouce and get on the least stress free way possible. And it does go unnoticed by the vast majority.

I don’t know where, waiting my turn comes into this? Where does a queue start on a railway platform? In japan this would work, but not here. Hate me if you like but it’s a good method and works.

 

[Tractor37]

Being a train driver for the last 15 years I've come to the conclusion that passengers no longer have any manners or etiquette. Even on jobs at peak times, so commuters know the driver and guard have to change ends, they all still pile on then look at you stupid when you ask them to move so you can get into the cab. They look as to say well where are you going to stand. Rudeness. I as a child was always taught to let people alight first then board afterwards.

 

[sefton]

Nice little trick I like to use is to get on the 1st class door where nobody is using and walk down the carriage into the vestibule. You then have to wait politely for everyone to carry on getting off but you’re already in the carriage as the last one passes. Nice little queue jump and nobody’s the wiser. Stress free and a seat. Dancer.

That's totally unacceptable in my opinion. It certainly doesn't go unnoticed when I'm waiting to board and people jump the queue that way. You should wait your turn like everybody else. People moving through the train should wait for everyone who actually queued for that carriage to board before being allowed through.

This is the same argument as when two lanes go to one on the road. One group says you should all the road and ziplock at the end, the other says you should queue in the lane which remains open.

My view is if nobody is getting out* at a particular door even if it leads into first class, then if someone doesn't choose to use it, that is their choice and not my problem.

*obviously if someone is getting off then the same rules apply, wait until they have done so.

 

[Mutant Lemming]

Mooing and baaing at them intimating that they are behaving like cattle seems to upset people barging on board. Unfortunately it's a problem with our increasingly self obsessed society that many only see things that upset them and not the things that they do that upset others.

 

[Wivenswold]

With all the doom and gloom about passenger's behaviour, I'm happy to report that the good folk of Chelmsford are getting much better at waiting for passengers to alight. One didn't wait a few days back and several people asserted themselves and pointed out her mistake. For all our faults, us Essex types are a gregarious bunch and aren't afraid to pull together. Noticeable too when I last witnessed a fight on my train, 8 of us got up to break it up. No police needed, train not delayed, the chastised teenagers shuffled off at Colchester with fleas in their ears and red faces.

 

[gimmea50anyday]

this is a bug-bear of mine and it does happen on TPE 1/3 2/3 stock. I think its incredibly rude and arrogant of people to barge their way on board, especially when cyril and floss are struggling to get off with their suitcases! When I have large crowds at Leeds York or Manchester (or Liverpool with a 10min turn round) I will actively announce over the PA "please stand back and allow people to alight" it usually works but there's always one or two, totally oblivious because their mobile phone is welded to their ear...

 

[gimmea50anyday]

I’ve been in Manchester today. Some disruption on the Metrolink this evening saw some very busy trans and platforms.

At every station we called at between Deansgate Castlefield and Victoria saw people barging on before anyone had even got off. At Victoria it was particularly bad which was where I was getting off. I ended up having to be very assertive to get off the tram.

Never seen anything like it, at least in London passengers generally play by the rules.

Fatality at Rainhill involving a TPE service probably didn't help. Chat moss line suspended most of the afternoon with services diverted st helens central or Cheshire lines

 

[yorkie]

That's totally unacceptable in my opinion. It certainly doesn't go unnoticed when I'm waiting to board and people jump the queue that way. You should wait your turn like everybody else. People moving through the train should wait for everyone who actually queued for that carriage to board before being allowed through.

While it's impractical and probably has safety implications, it'd be so much better if the inter-carriage doors were locked while the external doors are open.

Nonsense. There is no concept of a train-wide queue; this would be unworkable. It is better to use all available doors (as practicable). Providing no-one is attempting to alight from the door, it's absolutely fair game to use that door, and better for dwell times to do so.

 

[Ianno87]

With all the doom and gloom about passenger's behaviour, I'm happy to report that the good folk of Chelmsford are getting much better at waiting for passengers to alight. One didn't wait a few days back and several people asserted themselves and pointed out her mistake. For all our faults, us Essex types are a gregarious bunch and aren't afraid to pull together. Noticeable too when I last witnessed a fight on my train, 8 of us got up to break it up. No police needed, train not delayed, the chastised teenagers shuffled off at Colchester with fleas in their ears and red faces.

A few weeks back I boarded an evening peak departure from Nottingham - what an utter delight. No scrum, just relaxed ambling to the doors. Then plenty of "oh no, after you, please" going around.

 

[Ianno87]

This is the same argument as when two lanes go to one on the road. One group says you should all the road and ziplock at the end, the other says you should queue in the lane which remains open.

My view is if nobody is getting out* at a particular door even if it leads into first class, then if someone doesn't choose to use it, that is their choice and not my problem.

*obviously if someone is getting off then the same rules apply, wait until they have done so.

On 387s, for about 8 seats in the 'composite' carriage, the nearest door *is* the first class door. Might as well use it... (quicker getting off too...)

 

[matt_world2004]

This is the same argument as when two lanes go to one on the road. One group says you should all the road and ziplock at the end, the other says you should queue in the lane which remains open.

My view is if nobody is getting out* at a particular door even if it leads into first class, then if someone doesn't choose to use it, that is their choice and not my problem.

*obviously if someone is getting off then the same rules apply, wait until they have done so.

Isnt it a bylaw offence to board accommodation for which you do not have the correct ticket. Several people have been reported for exiting first class doors when they didnt have a first class ticket I dont see why entering should be any different.

 

[Ianno87]

Isnt it a bylaw offence to board accommodation for which you do not have the correct ticket. Several people have been reported for exiting first class doors when they didnt have a first class ticket I dont see why entering should be any different.

Don't know the exact bylaw wording, but in some cases you have to enter/traverse first class to use toilets etc (e.g. 350s). Is it 'travelling' in First Class that is prohibited, not boarding/alighting? In my 387 example, I'm arguing that the First Class door is the most appropriate door for a small number of standard class seats.

It's also common at London terminals for the last few stragglers before departure to be ushered on by staff via the nearest first class door, then walk down the train, to give a prompt departure.

 

[matt_world2004]

It's also common at London terminals for the last few stragglers before departure to be ushered on by staff via the nearest first class door, then walk down the train, to give a prompt departure.

Doesnt that come under thr authorised person exemption.

 

[yorkie]

Isn't it a bylaw offence to board accommodation for which you do not have the correct ticket. Several people have been reported for exiting first class doors when they didn't have a first class ticket I don't see why entering should be any different.

I guess you are not well travelled; people are encouraged to do this at times. If a common sense approach was not adopted, some people would miss the train from termini. "Sorry, you can't board this train unless you agree to upgrade"? I can't see it somehow!