IDEA: Combined regional railcards into one for all ages

[BigCj34]

Stopping short of an open-aged National Railcard, my idea was to have all the regions that do offer a railcard for instance, the Annual Gold Card zone, Devon and Cornwall Card, Highland card, etc. and have all the regional discounts available in one "super" railcard that can be used in all the discount regions.

It could cost £50 (as an example figure), and offer discounts in all the zones that offer a regional railcard, the higher price is suggested to the fact that the price would need to be split multiple ways and not completely eradicate the regional railcards which residents of those areas can still buy a Dales/Devon and Cornwall/Highland etc. Railcard for £10 or so if they don't intend to use the full range. It will also reflect the extra coverage of the Annual Gold card zone against the Network zone, though without having to buy a £160 season ticket for a route that won't be used for the discount.

The advantage I see is someone holding this card who intends to visit a regional railcard zone may be incentivised to use rail transport where they might not otherwise, especially when some of the zones cover routes that aren't particularly fast.

Now clearly what should exist and what is logistically possible to implement with the current railway governing structure are two entirely different things. Furthermore restrictions might need to be harmonised as some offer discounts on anytime tickets, advacne tickets and before 10am whereas other do not. Would this be a feasible idea, or would there be too many stakeholders who might fear they would lsoe out? I would imagine it would be popular enough just for the Annual Gold Card zone coverage alone.

 

[takno]

Stopping short of an open-aged National Railcard, my idea was to have all the regions that do offer a railcard for instance, the Annual Gold Card zone, Devon and Cornwall Card, Highland card, etc. and have all the regional discounts available in one "super" railcard that can be used in all the discount regions.

It could cost £50 (as an example figure), and offer discounts in all the zones that offer a regional railcard, the higher price is suggested to the fact that the price would need to be split multiple ways and not completely eradicate the regional railcards which residents of those areas can still buy a Dales/Devon and Cornwall/Highland etc. Railcard for £10 or so if they don't intend to use the full range. It will also reflect the extra coverage of the Annual Gold card zone against the Network zone, though without having to buy a £160 season ticket for a route that won't be used for the discount.

The advantage I see is someone holding this card who intends to visit a regional railcard zone may be incentivised to use rail transport where they might not otherwise, especially when some of the zones cover routes that aren't particularly fast.

Now clearly what should exist and what is logistically possible to implement with the current railway governing structure are two entirely different things. Furthermore restrictions might need to be harmonised as some offer discounts on anytime tickets, advacne tickets and before 10am whereas other do not. Would this be a feasible idea, or would there be too many stakeholders who might fear they would lsoe out? I would imagine it would be popular enough just for the Annual Gold Card zone coverage alone.

So that's a plan for people in the southeast who already benefit from cheap stuff to get more cheap stuff whenever they deign to visit the regions, while the rest of us continue to get nothing? Can't see the appeal tbh

 

[BigCj34]

So that's a plan for people in the southeast who already benefit from cheap stuff to get more cheap stuff whenever they deign to visit the regions, while the rest of us continue to get nothing? Can't see the appeal tbh

The card would be open for anyone, and the Annual Gold Card area goes to Shrewsbury and Norwich so its not just Southeast. A National Railcard would be the ideal of course, but my idea is something that may be easier to implement going on discount cards that already exist.

 

[yorksrob]

I have pondered this myself as well. As a Dales Railcard holder, it would certainly be useful to be able to obtain discounts in places such as the Whitby line and Cornwall etc as a sort of mutual exchange. From those route's point of view, there's a potential extra traffic for very little effort to be generated, and more incentive for people in their own hinterland to by the local card. One thing I don't understand is why charge more than the usual railcard cost ? Such a hike would probably be necessary to persuade the TOC's to adopt a National Railcard, but I would have thought the normal cost would be fine for this, although they would presumably all have to cost the same (which they don't currently).

The Network Railcard is an interesting one - it is a regional card obviously, and from a personal point of view, it would be useful not to have to buy my local card and the Network card. However, as pointed out above, including it would exacerbate the already glaring disparity with the rest of the country without a railcard.

 

[BigCj34]

The idea of charging more would be to appease any reaction from potential lost revenue in the regional railcard areas and include the Gold Card zone which is of course more expansive than the Network zone.

Out of interest, who receives the revenue for the regional cards? Is it just divided between the participating Doc's?

 

[yorksrob]

The idea of charging more would be to appease any reaction from potential lost revenue in the regional railcard areas and include the Gold Card zone which is of course more expansive than the Network zone.

Out of interest, who receives the revenue for the regional cards? Is it just divided between the participating Doc's?

I think that in this case, you're not actually increasing the geographical reach of the railcard areas, and residents of one railcard area are likely to live far away enough from the other areas, that such abstraction on such a scale would be unlikely to be a problem. I also think that a £50 price would be damaging to the existing local railcard schemes. However, a larger cost would be justified for a wholly national railcard valid across the network.

 

[BigCj34]

I think that in this case, you're not actually increasing the geographical reach of the railcard areas, and residents of one railcard area are likely to live far away enough from the other areas, that such abstraction on such a scale would be unlikely to be a problem. I also think that a £50 price would be damaging to the existing local railcard schemes. However, a larger cost would be justified for a wholly national railcard valid across the network.

How would a £50 price damage local schemes? Many regional schemes could receive £2 (as an example) out of the £50 cost, money they may not otherwise get. Plus if someone only plans to use the existing regional railcard they can continue to pay £10 rather than £50. I guess the only issue might be someone who loves near a Gold Card zone and a regional railcard zone, such as someone in eastern Wales or in Devon.

A truly national railcard would be great, one that costs around £80 or so, certainly less than £100. How much risk the government, TOC's and other stakeholders are willing to bear is another question though!

 

[JonathanH]

This discussion completely misses the point of the local area railcards which is to allow higher fares to be charged to visitors to an area to better reflect the costs of operation while encouraging regular travel from people who live in an area to make journeys often on that route, perhaps to the nearest town.

Just because someone lives in the Yorkshire Dales doesn't mean the railway should get less money from that person when they go to Cornwall on holiday.

The Railway, as with any other business, charges what it thinks is the right price for the service it offers.

 

[yorksrob]

This discussion completely misses the point of the local area railcards which is to allow higher fares to be charged to visitors to an area to better reflect the costs of operation while encouraging regular travel from people who live in an area to make journeys often on that route, perhaps to the nearest town.

Just because someone lives in the Yorkshire Dales doesn't mean the railway should get less money from that person when they go to Cornwall on holiday.

The Railway, as with any other business, charges what it thinks is the right price for the service it offers.

But it could encourage that person to use the railway when they go to Cornwall, whereas as a tourist, they are probably as likely to use the car.

This is where the railway completely misses the point (as usual).

 

[yorksrob]

How would a £50 price damage local schemes? Many regional schemes could receive £2 (as an example) out of the £50 cost, money they may not otherwise get. Plus if someone only plans to use the existing regional railcard they can continue to pay £10 rather than £50. I guess the only issue might be someone who loves near a Gold Card zone and a regional railcard zone, such as someone in eastern Wales or in Devon.

A truly national railcard would be great, one that costs around £80 or so, certainly less than £100. How much risk the government, TOC's and other stakeholders are willing to bear is another question though!

Locals would be less likely to buy it.

You'd need more than just a discount on your local line to get people to stump up fifty quid.