Passengers bail from train near Wimbledon 2/10

[Master29]

Another nutjob claiming he wants to save humanity but ultimately achieves nothing but chaos. How many could have died if they fell onto the live rails. ****ing idiot.

 

[ainsworth74]

We used to have one here in the town centre, obviously a lot less people than at Wembley and all he got was a few funny looks. It just seemed to encourage him more though.

Never seen him for a couple of years now, I wonder of Ainsworth has seen him.

Don't remember him myself (and I hardly ever go into the centre anyway to be honest) but my mum does. She told me one time she walked up to him whilst he was spewing his bile and asked him about what God said about loving one another (or something like that) and she reports that seemed to stump him for a few minutes!

There was a couple that always appeared outside a shopping centre in Hull whilst I was there for Uni. They never really managed to get much of a following beyond a few funny looks. It was amusing watching them dodge snowballs that the local kids would lob at them in winter though!

 

[Lockwood]

I imagine it's probably difficult to show any crime has been committed despite the obvious risk to life and limb he has created by causing a panic.

Railway byelaws if nothing else?

 

[theageofthetra]

Why not wait until the platform, which was less than a minute away. Still as I said all this is doing is playing straight into the hands of terrorists and extremists who will undoubtedly be rubbing their hands with glee with the amount of paranoia that they've instilled into the public.

If we're getting this paranoid, perhaps we should have body scanners and luggage searches for everyone before they're allowed to enter a station.

Ideally. They manage this effectively on every Chinese metro and rail station- and they can be quite busy.

 

[Darandio]

Don't remember him myself (and I hardly ever go into the centre anyway to be honest) but my mum does. She told me one time she walked up to him whilst he was spewing his bile and asked him about what God said about loving one another (or something like that) and she reports that seemed to stump him for a few minutes!

I wish i'd seen it, never saw anyone talk to him ever. As he was quite old i'd imagine he has passed now.

We still get the 'Church on the Street' every Thursday, but they just sing and play guitar, fairly harmless.

 

[MP33]

I have seen a fellow and others have as well, who lives in Harold Wood and travels on TFL services and Greater Anglia services on Sundays, wearing sandwich boards and a hat with religious messages on it

 

[the sniper]

Well over 4500 mins worth of delays are attributed to this so far.

Is there an 'Act of God' delay code...?

 

[Bromley boy]

Railway byelaws if nothing else?

Is there a specific bylaw offence that would capture this situation?

I'd have thought assault would be the most likely criminal offence, due to the perceived threat of physical violence, but even that might be impossible difficult to establish in the absence of something more specifically threatening being said.

 

[ainsworth74]

Is there a specific bylaw offence that would capture this situation?

I'd have thought assault would be the most likely criminal offence, due to the perceived threat of physical violence, but even that might be impossible difficult to establish in the absence of something more specifically threatening being said.

Byelaw 6 would seem to do it:

6. Unacceptable behaviour

(8) No person shall molest or wilfully interfere with the comfort or convenience of any person on the railway.

 

[61653 HTAFC]

A few thoughts on this before I head out for my train home...

It doesn't matter that all the things that some religious people say are nonsense, the fact that some will commit violent acts in that name is bound to cause some people to panic.

Funny how this individual was reading from a Christian text, yet some have immediately jumped onto the "Islam is bad" bandwagon.

If ever there was a case to be made for better funding of mental health services, this is it.

Hope everyone has a good evening and stays safe!

 

[CarlSilva]

Funniest thread I've ever seen on here.
The mind can play tricks. A person's perception of reality aint' always the truth.
Just goes to show some people will believe anything.
I doubt that a bylaw about molesting or wilfully interfering with the comfort or convenience of any person on the railway really covers something like this. He hasn't molested anything or anyone, and 'willfully' is gonna be well near impossible to prove, unless a person admitted it.

 

[Bromley boy]

Byelaw 6 would seem to do it:

I suppose it might. This probably runs into the same issue as any potential assault offence. All the "perpetrator" has done is recite some religious text. Objectively speaking, is that any different from a muted conversation between passengers about religious matters? It's largely the situation (crowded commuter train, several recent attacks in London) that has caused the panic.

Playing rubbish rap music from a mobile phone's speaker is probably more annoying, and might be caught by that bylaw, but wouldn't cause a mass panic.

That particular bylaw seems very broadly drafted. I wonder if there have been any recent successful prosecutions under it and, if so, what types of behaviour might have prompted them?

 

[Paul180]

Just reading the comments on this story on Get Surrey there was more than one nut job on the train this morning.

I was on the first carriage of this train. This is not an accurate report of what happened in our carriage at least. A man came into our carriage and spoke with calm authority saying we needed to open the doors and evacuate. The was no stampede and no preacher in our carriage, we did however follow instructions and evacuate.
We also did not get back on the train - we were escorted to nearly Wimbledon station by staff.

What concerns me about this is some random person going down the train and ordering people to get off the train on to the track.

 

[Wombat]

I have problem with that.

1. They know that it's not uncommon to come to a brief stand outside WM at anytime of day.

2. Do you think that any extremist/terrorist is going to have a go at the same area so soon after the previous event, they know full well that security is going to be increased, they're going to be looking elsewhere to do it where the tensions and locals aren't quite so tetchy.

I think it's fair to question whether the circumstances justified a suspicion that the guy was going to detonate a bomb on board the train. But once that suspicion has taken hold, I don't think it's reasonable to expect passengers to calmly assess the routine stopping patterns of their trains (I commute through Wimbledon and I've no idea how often we stop outside).

As for security, well, if you think you've got someone with a bomb in your carriage, the horse has already left the stable.

 

[Elecman]

It turns out this guy was (presumably) a harmless nutter but anyone behaving like this is putting themselves at a substantial risk of being shot by armed police in the current climate.

I find the use of the term nutter here offensive as implying the person has a mental health issue which isn't substantiated.

 

[Elecman]

Anyone seen a picture of this loon?

And this is even more offensive

 

[Bromley boy]

I find the use of the term nutter here offensive as implying the person has a mental health issue which isn't substantiated.

I couldn’t care less what you find offensive. In any case you’re quite wrong.

According to the OED definition “Nutter” could mean “mad or eccentric” person, therefore it doesn’t necessarily imply a “mental health problem”.

https://en.oxforddictionaries.com/definition/nutter

For that matter, being suicidal religious terrorist doesn’t necessarily imply a mental health problem, either.

 

[Antman]

I think it's fair to question whether the circumstances justified a suspicion that the guy was going to detonate a bomb on board the train. But once that suspicion has taken hold, I don't think it's reasonable to expect passengers to calmly assess the routine stopping patterns of their trains (I commute through Wimbledon and I've no idea how often we stop outside).

As for security, well, if you think you've got someone with a bomb in your carriage, the horse has already left the stable.

If you think somebody in your carriage has a bomb getting off the train asap might be a good move, which appears to be exactly what they did?

 

[theageofthetra]

And this is even more offensive

What is offesive about the national bird of Canada?

 

[Cantab26]

It is rather surprising that the phrase "death is not the end" should provoke such an extreme hysteria. To the Christian mind this is very much a message of hope.

Then again, the level of religious literacy of most people of my acquaintance leaves much to be desired, so perhaps not so surprising after all.

 

[Bromley boy]

It is rather surprising that the phrase "death is not the end" should provoke such an extreme hysteria. To the Christian mind this is very much a message of hope.

Then again, the level of religious literacy of most people of my acquaintance leaves much to be desired, so perhaps not so surprising after all.

Rightly or wrongly we now live in a secular society where most people are not of the "Christian mind" and will not have an in-depth (or any) knowledge of religious texts.

From that perspective I'm sure you can see how the phrase "death is not the end" certainly won't inspire much hope on a packed London commuter train, in the presence of a potential suicide bomber, in light of recent events.

 

[Antman]

Rightly or wrongly we now live in a secular society where most people are not of the "Christian mind" and will not have an in-depth (or any) knowledge of religious texts.

From that perspective I'm sure you can see how the phrase "death is not the end" certainly won't inspire much hope on a packed London commuter train, in the presence of a potential suicide bomber, in light of recent events.

Absolutely, it would seem (to put it mildly) a rather strange thing to say on a rush hour train.

 

[Cantab26]

Absolutely, it would seem (to put it mildly) a rather strange thing to say on a rush hour train.

Stranger than using the words "hope" and "London commuter train" in the same sentence?!

 

[Bromley boy]

Stranger than using the words "hope" and "London commuter train" in the same sentence?!

Not that strange although most expect to hope for a seat rather than hoping the person muttering about death isn't a suicide bomber .

 

[Busaholic]

Those of us in or around London/most large cities will no doubt be familiar with these types. Often using a loud hailer, handing out pamphlets etc. Oxford Street seems a particular hotbed. God knows what they think they are achieving (pun intended).

There used to be a guy in the 1970s and 1980s who stood in Oxford Street (always on the south side, I noticed, but varied from near Bond Street to nearer Charing Cross Road) and his beef (pun intended) was that protein was the cause of all life's ills, of which lust seemed the most repugnant to his eyes. Meat and nuts were listed among several others on a huge board he used to carry. He looked, come to think of it, like an older Jacob Rees-Mogg, so I wonder if the latter is a relative. I would say he was present on every weekday on the street for twenty years, possibly more. I don't recollect ever seeing anyone engaging him in conversation: he had leaflets with him, but, again, I never saw him giving them out or anyone requesting one.

 

[Elecman]

What is offesive about the national bird of Canada?

Nothing but it wasn't the bird that was being referred to though but a derogatory term for a person with a mental health issue and that is offensive

 

[Beebman]

There used to be a guy in the 1970s and 1980s who stood in Oxford Street (always on the south side, I noticed, but varied from near Bond Street to nearer Charing Cross Road) and his beef (pun intended) was that protein was the cause of all life's ills, of which lust seemed the most repugnant to his eyes. Meat and nuts were listed among several others on a huge board he used to carry. He looked, come to think of it, like an older Jacob Rees-Mogg, so I wonder if the latter is a relative. I would say he was present on every weekday on the street for twenty years, possibly more. I don't recollect ever seeing anyone engaging him in conversation: he had leaflets with him, but, again, I never saw him giving them out or anyone requesting one.

I remember him, a gentleman by the name of Stanley Green:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stanley_Green

 

[abn444]

Nothing but it wasn't the bird that was being referred to though but a derogatory term for a person with a mental health issue and that is offensive

Everything is offensive these days

 

[Cantab26]

I remember him, a gentleman by the name of Stanley Green:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stanley_Green

Hmm...protein AND sitting are both the work of the evil one judging by that photograph.

 

[Bromley boy]

Nothing but it wasn't the bird that was being referred to though but a derogatory term for a person with a mental health issue and that is offensive

Once again you're incorrect. You should check what the words you are criticising actually mean before casting aspersions and showing yourself up!

"Loon" also means "silly or foolish person", in addition to the national bird of Canada. Once again nothing to do with "mental health issues".

https://en.oxforddictionaries.com/definition/loon

You seem more interested in finding offence than adding anything to the topic of discussion on this thread.

Why is that?