West Country Independents

[THarris123]

Well if I had a fleet of buses and was deciding where to deploy them I'd look for a route(s) where buses regularly ran full and standing and passengers were left behind. I don't visit Bristol enough these days to know whether there any like this.

I'd maybe say something like 75 or 76. Or maybe even something from Bristol to Avonmouth.

 

[THarris123]

Crosville have also submitted a bit to VOSA - cancellation of 4/4A and change on 106

 

[TheGrandWazoo]

At a guess I'd probably say those will go for scrap probably by the end of the year. I think they were used only on a temporary measure knowing full well that those vehicles won't be kept when they drop the frequency again.

It'll be interesting to see First's response to the cancellation too. I personally don't see them dropping the frequency down to every 12 mins and maybe keeping it at every 10 mins whilst using a couple of the ALXs as reserves. Maybe a few of the ALXs will have the front repainted and be used on something like 36?

I don't see them going for scrap - aside from just being repainted, there are plenty of other vehicles around the UK that need to be replaced.

Also, as First have rebased their depreciation, these might actually still have some book value on them?

 

[swifty]

I don't see them going for scrap - aside from just being repainted, there are plenty of other vehicles around the UK that need to be replaced.

Also, as First have rebased their depreciation, these might actually still have some book value on them?

And they've just been refurbished inside as well. All they need is the front wedge painting and they'll be fine for the 6/7!

 

[swifty]

I'd maybe say something like 75 or 76. Or maybe even something from Bristol to Avonmouth.

They've tried both before and they didn't work, the X40 was a decent punt but I guess the custom wasn't there for a large amount of the route.

 

[carlberry]

A response from First wasn't unexpected, however the one that materialized was way OTT, no one had confidence in a competing 90 even before Wessex started.

If I was Rotala, I'd approach Stagecoach to see if they would be interested in buying what's left of Wessex Bristol inc Avonmouth depot.

What would they be buying? A few competing services and a few contracts that may change operator (ignoring the two that already are) or get cancelled completly at the next tender round. And a depot that's in a less useful place than Patchway.

 

[TheGrandWazoo]

They've tried both before and they didn't work, the X40 was a decent punt but I guess the custom wasn't there for a large amount of the route.

As I said - the THREE

I can't see it myself.

 

[Martin1988]

Service 680 from Filton College to Yate unusually had a 70 seat jonckheere mistral coach this evening instead of the usual merc benz vario minibus.

At least Eurotaxis will use coaches on there as and when needed as opposed to SGBC who insisted on their drivers using a minibus even if they had a full sized vehicle on their previous job.

 

[winston270twm]

What would they be buying? A few competing services and a few contracts that may change operator (ignoring the two that already are) or get cancelled completly at the next tender round. And a depot that's in a less useful place than Patchway.

A bigger existing platform to build off if they intend to expand further in to Bristol & compete with First. It hasn't actually been confirmed that Stagecoach are moving in to Patchway or that any deal will be done with SGBC, incidentally an operator with even less bus work than Wessex, most of which is schools.

 

[TheGrandWazoo]

A bigger existing platform to build off if they intend to expand further in to Bristol & compete with First. It hasn't actually been confirmed that Stagecoach are moving in to Patchway or that any deal will be done with SGBC, incidentally an operator with even less bus work than Wessex, most of which is schools.

I tend to agree with Carl. The depot is poorly located. Aside from the 51, there's nothing worth having service wise. The 3s are fairly minimal and the other stuff is tendered anyway and who knows at what rates.

Being a tenant at Patchway is probably more sensible than having to invest in a standalone base.

Perhaps it might be better for Rotala to dispose of the depot and instead focus on Burnett?

 

[winston270twm]

Perhaps it might be better for Rotala to dispose of the depot and instead focus on Burnett?

It's got to be getting to the point where excessive depot capacity must be being questioned, another option maybe to vacate Avonmouth & lease it out to another business. Pity things didn't happen earlier in the year, the may have been able to sell or lease Avonmouth to Edwards Coaches.

 

[TheGrandWazoo]

It's got to be getting to the point where excessive depot capacity must be being questioned, another option maybe to vacate Avonmouth & lease it out to another business. Pity things didn't happen earlier in the year, the may have been able to sell or lease Avonmouth to Edwards Coaches.

That was my thought - two depots for a combined fleet strength of c.60 vehicles?

 

[matt_splat]

It's got to be getting to the point where excessive depot capacity must be being questioned, another option maybe to vacate Avonmouth & lease it out to another business. Pity things didn't happen earlier in the year, the may have been able to sell or lease Avonmouth to Edwards Coaches.

why would Edwards want avonmouth from pictures i have seen they have invested a lot of money in there new depot.

 

[freetoview33]

why would Edwards want avonmouth from pictures i have seen they have invested a lot of money in there new depot.

They might have before hand.

 

[winston270twm]

why would Edwards want avonmouth from pictures i have seen they have invested a lot of money in there new depot.

If you re-read my post, I said 'pity things didn't happen earlier in the year' at Wessex i.e. before Edwards acquired their current depot.

Wessex Avonmouth is already an operational bus depot, whilst the premises Edwards acquired had to be converted / upgraded.

 

[Citistar]

If you re-read my post, I said 'pity things didn't happen earlier in the year' at Wessex i.e. before Edwards acquired their current depot.

Wessex Avonmouth is already an operational bus depot, whilst the premises Edwards acquired had to be converted / upgraded.

The premises that Edwards have moved in to are in a tidy, modern part of Avonmouth. In contrast, the Wessex depot is right in the middle of the older style, messy, dusty industrial zone. The layout of the Wessex depot is pretty poor and with minimal scope for improvement. I'm not sure Edwards would have looked at it and concluded it was the right place for them.

 

[swifty]

Wessex VDL/Wright LJ04LDC was broken down and seemingly abandoned across the exit from Temple Quay on the Temple Gate roundabout earlier taking down from 2 to 1 lane.

On the upside an Eclipse on the 90 leaving town earlier had 15 people on it, followed by a half full First decker. Wessex also had Scania Omniciti LX59CSF out all day on the One.

 

[Whiteway215]

Crosville have also submitted a bit to VOSA - cancellation of 4/4A and change on 106

Reported on another forum Crosville licence reduced by 10 following public inquiry on Thursday.

 

[winston270twm]

Wessex VDL/Wright LJ04LDC was broken down and seemingly abandoned across the exit from Temple Quay on the Temple Gate roundabout earlier taking down from 2 to 1 lane.

On the upside an Eclipse on the 90 leaving town earlier had 15 people on it, followed by a half full First decker. Wessex also had Scania Omniciti LX59CSF out all day on the One.

It doesn't sound as though some Wessex journeys are doing that sound, I assume they are the exception with it being pulled so quick

 

[Great_Western]

I wonder if Rotala will end up selling the entire Wessex business to Edwards? From what I have seen in and around South Wales, they seem to be a very competant operator with a lot of potential to expand.

 

[THarris123]

Reported on another forum Crosville licence reduced by 10 following public inquiry on Thursday.

Down from 35 to 24 vehicles

 

[THarris123]

I wonder if Rotala will end up selling the entire Wessex business to Edwards? From what I have seen in and around South Wales, they seem to be a very competant operator with a lot of potential to expand.

Are Edwards keen on taking on bus work in Bristol and Bath?

 

[TheGrandWazoo]

Are Edwards keen on taking on bus work in Bristol and Bath?

They have accumulated stage work with the acquisition of coach work. However, that has usually been a by-product of a business failure either Veolia or Silcox and tied in with coaching. Buying Wessex doesn't really fit that MO and they don't need the depot.

 

[Great_Western]

They have accumulated stage work with the acquisition of coach work. However, that has usually been a by-product of a business failure either Veolia or Silcox and tied in with coaching. Buying Wessex doesn't really fit that MO and they don't need the depot.

All valid points. Though I do think it is probably more likely than them being taken over by one of the big groups considering the state that they're in. Its all a bit of a mess really, with a city the size of Bristol there is plenty of room for more healthy competition.

 

[TheGrandWazoo]

All valid points. Though I do think it is probably more likely than them being taken over by one of the big groups considering the state that they're in. Its all a bit of a mess really, with a city the size of Bristol there is plenty of room for more healthy competition.

They were competing healthily for quite a while. However, Wessex were as complacent as First ever were. They could have secured the business but didn't and have been outmanoeuvred by First.

With the loss of the 16, and the other tendered work, I think there is a real possibility of Wessex exiting the stage.

 

[THarris123]

They were competing healthily for quite a while. However, Wessex were as complacent as First ever were. They could have secured the business but didn't and have been outmanoeuvred by First.

With the loss of the 16, and the other tendered work, I think there is a real possibility of Wessex exiting the stage.

Well at least from Bristol. Bath I'm not so sure about. I think we could see them carry on in Bath.

I certainly don't think that anyone will look to takeover or buy Wessex.

 

[winston270twm]

Well at least from Bristol. Bath I'm not so sure about. I think we could see them carry on in Bath.

First don't seem to be employing the same tatics in Bath as in Bristol against Wessex on existing routes at least, only when Wessex have tried to expand commerical routes i.e. the 14 etc

 

[TheGrandWazoo]

First don't seem to be employing the same tatics in Bath as in Bristol against Wessex on existing routes at least, only when Wessex have tried to expand commerical routes i.e. the 14 etc

They have but it's a much smaller market. They did commercialise tendered runs on the 178 (Bath to MSN) and on the 179 IIRC. They've also managed to get back preferred status for UoBath and SU so that helped with attacking Wessex on the Uni route and that's obviously been rebranded and received new fleet in the U1.

They left them alone to the no-hoper 20A/C and 12 much as they left them to the 505, 506 and 513/4 in Bristol.

 

[winston270twm]

They have but it's a much smaller market. They did commercialise tendered runs on the 178 (Bath to MSN) and on the 179 IIRC. They've also managed to get back preferred status for UoBath and SU so that helped with attacking Wessex on the Uni route and that's obviously been rebranded and received new fleet in the U1.

They left them alone to the no-hoper 20A/C and 12 much as they left them to the 505, 506 and 513/4 in Bristol.

Fair enough, wasn't aware First had comercialised some tendered work down in Bath as well.

 

[swifty]

They have but it's a much smaller market. They did commercialise tendered runs on the 178 (Bath to MSN) and on the 179 IIRC. They've also managed to get back preferred status for UoBath and SU so that helped with attacking Wessex on the Uni route and that's obviously been rebranded and received new fleet in the U1.

They left them alone to the no-hoper 20A/C and 12 much as they left them to the 505, 506 and 513/4 in Bristol.

Didn't Wessex also win the tender for the 379 once upon a time until First commercialised that as well?