Theresa May calls General Election on 8th June.

[backontrack]

Are you old enough to remember "Red Robbo" in full spate in some of the car manufacturing plant meetings in which he held forth. Nothing "knee-jerk" about what actually happened there in real life.

It was something of that ilk that inspired the writers of the "Fawlty Towers" series to write the Basil Fawlty diatribe about strikes in the car industry in the "Kipper and the Corpse" episode....
"Another car strike, marvellous, isn't it. The taxpayers pay them millions each year, so they can go on strike. It's called Socialism. If they don't like making cars, why don't they get themselves another bloody job - designing cathedrals or composing violin concertos

That's it. The British Leyland Concerto - in four movements, all of them slow. with a four hour tea-break in between".

Ah, Basil Fawlty. The outstanding expert authority on British politics, and evidently with a better understanding of the concept of socialism than anyone real. :P

 

[Xenophon PCDGS]

Ah, Basil Fawlty. The outstanding expert authority on British politics, and evidently with a better understanding of the concept of socialism than anyone real. :P

Remember that the comedy television series was set in the time period that well reflected the much higher profile of the Trades Unions, the type that the RMT seem to emulate in 2017.

High profile industrial action events of that time included the Grunwick film processing plant and the Wapping dispute that concerned newspaper publishing.

 

[fowler9]

Remember that the comedy television series was set in the time period that well reflected the much higher profile of the Trades Unions, the type that the RMT seem to emulate in 2017.

High profile industrial action events of that time included the Grunwick film processing plant and the Wapping dispute that concerned newspaper publishing.

Indeed it is a miracle that BMW, Audi and Mercedes still make cars all in the same country despite having unions. Someone should tell Chancellor Merkel she is doing something wrong.

 

[muddythefish]

Indeed it is a miracle that BMW, Audi and Mercedes still make cars all in the same country despite having unions. Someone should tell Chancellor Merkel she is doing something wrong.

Strong trade unions, high wages, high taxes, good public services, top class products the world wants to buy. The Tories have taken us us down the path of low wages, low takes, decrepit public services and decimated manufacturing.

 

[muddythefish]

Remember that the comedy television series was set in the time period that well reflected the much higher profile of the Trades Unions, the type that the RMT seem to emulate in 2017.

High profile industrial action events of that time included the Grunwick film processing plant and the Wapping dispute that concerned newspaper publishing.

Never mind Basil, the Victorian language in your posts is comedy gold! Keep it up.

 

[Butts]

Strong trade unions, high wages, high taxes, good public services, top class products the world wants to buy. The Tories have taken us us down the path of low wages, low takes, decrepit public services and decimated manufacturing.

Pull you head out of your arse for just a moment and share with us anything the Conservatives have ever done that you consider to be worthwhile ?

Could it be that Labour have contributed to any of the charges you lay against the Tories ?

You are far to blinkered

 

[EM2]

Pull you head out of your arse for just a moment and share with us anything the Conservatives have ever done that you consider to be worthwhile ?

I honestly can't think of many.
Gay marriage was good. Purchase of social housing was good, but not allowing that stock to be replaced wasn't.
I am actually a bit better off, but I would rather that everyone else is too, and that is certainly not the case.

EDIT - actually, I'll add the triple lock, as that benefits my wife

 

[southern442]

I honestly can't think of many.
Gay marriage was good.

The gay marriage bill was more of a Cameron bill rather than a Conservatives bill. It was a very respectable achievement, bringing potential benefit to my own life, but it was won primarily off the back of Labour and Lib Dem MPs.

 

[PHILIPE]

The gay marriage bill was more of a Cameron bill rather than a Conservatives bill. It was a very respectable achievement, bringing potential benefit to my own life, but it was won primarily off the back of Labour and Lib Dem MPs.

It was one of he first things he said he would do after winning the election. It made me wonder whether he had a member of the Chipping Norton Set, Old Etonian pal or a party donor pushing him to treat the issue with such urgency.

 

[47802]

It was one of he first things he said he would do after winning the election. It made me wonder whether he had a member of the Chipping Norton Set, Old Etonian pal or a party donor pushing him to treat the issue with such urgency.

I think Cameron was a more modern Tory in many respects I think he knew what he needed to do to win centre ground votes and stem the tide of UKIP, unfortunately his referendum gamble didn't pay off, I think Mrs May is bit more of a Traditional Tory in some respects.

For those in the centre like me, there are a couple of things she has come out with which I don't think really appeal to the centre vote she is after, one is talk of fox hunting, the other is Grammar Schools. But then I think Corbyn and his cronies are so unappealing to many in the centre like me that she can likely get away with it.

 

[fowler9]

I think Cameron was a more modern Tory in many respects I think he knew what he needed to do to win centre ground votes and stem the tide of UKIP, unfortunately his referendum gamble didn't pay off, I think Mrs May is bit more of a Traditional Tory in some respects.

For those in the centre like me, there are a couple of things she has come out with which I don't think really appeal to the centre vote she is after, one is talk of fox hunting, the other is Grammar Schools. But then I think Corbyn and his cronies are so unappealing to many in the centre like me that she can likely get away with it.

The thing is the press are getting away with telling everyone that Labour want to take us back to the 70's while the Tories are talking about bringing back Grammar schools and fox hunting. There was a double page article in the Mail yesterday about Labours association with the Soviet Communists in the 1930's with a massive photo of Corbyn. There was no mention of the Mail being chums with the Nazis or the Tories being cosied up to Pinochet, Erdogan, Duterte or the House of Saud etc. etc.

 

[47802]

The thing is the press are getting away with telling everyone that Labour want to take us back to the 70's while the Tories are talking about bringing back Grammar schools and fox hunting. There was a double page article in the Mail yesterday about Labours association with the Soviet Communists in the 1930's with a massive photo of Corbyn. There was no mention of the Mail being chums with the Nazis or the Tories being cosied up to Pinochet, Erdogan, Duterte or the House of Saud etc. etc.

Well yes the majority of the Newspaper press is right wing that's nothing new, and its a good excuse for the left wing to use, not that people may not actually like their policies.

But I seem to recall some of the right wing press were more supportive of Tony Blair than the Tories at one point, but they clearly don't like the prospect of a left wing Labour Government as I don't, I don't actually read the Newspapers much these days, so it doesn't really have much of bearing on the fact I don't like him, Mcdonnell, the inept Diane Abbot, or most of his policies.

Personally on the day of the Election I hope the Sun repeat their famous headline for Kinnock "If Corbyn wins today will the last person to leave Britain please turn out the lights", although ironically I think having Kinnock in charge would be 10 times more acceptable to me than Corbyn.

 

[Howardh]

Polls suggest a slight shift towards Labour but nowhere near good enough. The Libdems haven't improved, so if we're to make June the end of May there's gonna have to be a huge shift and quickly.

Think the only thing Corbyn can do is come out and say "right, we're the party that will keep you in the EU (as best we can)" and try to grab the Libdem and remain vote, otherwise the Tories are walking it.

But I think people are scared of where Labour will get the cash to fund their policies.

 

[fowler9]

Well yes the majority of the Newspaper press is right wing that's nothing new, and its a good excuse for the left wing to use, not that people may not actually like their policies.

But I seem to recall some of the right wing press were more supportive of Tony Blair than the Tories at one point, but they clearly don't like the prospect of a left wing Labour Government as I don't.

Personally on the day of the Election I hope the Sun repeat their famous headline "If Corbyn wins today will the last person to leave Britain please turn out the lights"

I can well imagine the right wing press being supportive of Tony Blair, Labour under him were pretty much the same as the Tories were at the time.

And it isn't an excuse. It is a fact in all fairness. If we are going to have stories about what Labour did in the 1930's then lets have stories about what the right wing were up to in the past and now. Lets have more about the Chicago boys and Thatchers mate Pinochet. Lets have more about buddying up with Duterte and Erdogan and selling weapons to oppressive regimes.

 

[47802]

Polls suggest a slight shift towards Labour but nowhere near good enough. The Libdems haven't improved, so if we're to make June the end of May there's gonna have to be a huge shift and quickly.

Think the only thing Corbyn can do is come out and say "right, we're the party that will keep you in the EU (as best we can)" and try to grab the Libdem and remain vote, otherwise the Tories are walking it.

But I think people are scared of where Labour will get the cash to fund their policies.

Why I voted remain and I wouldn't vote him, I don't think he even really believes in the EU anyway, Ed Miliband did far more in the remain campaign than he did from what I saw and in fact my estimation of Ed went up.

Also from a Brexit viewpoint I think most people voted Brexit mainly on Immigration although a lot of politicians will say that's not the case, and Corbyn doesn't believe in immigration controls whatever the manifesto says.

Also although I voted Remain the country voted to leave and thats it, so on that basis I want someone who will stand up Brussels and try and get the best deal and I don't believe Corbyn can do that.

 

[fowler9]

Why I voted remain and I wouldn't vote him, I don't think he even really believes in the EU anyway, Ed Miliband did far more in the remain campaign than he did from what I saw and in fact my estimation of Ed went up.

Also from a Brexit viewpoint I think most people voted Brexit mainly on Immigration although a lot of politicians will say that's not the case, and Corbyn doesn't believe in immigration controls whatever the manifesto says.

Also although I voted Remain the country voted to leave and thats it, so on that basis I want someone who will stand up Brussels and try and get the best deal and I don't believe Corbyn can do that.

The country didn't vote leave, about a quarter of it did and loads of people most affected (UK citizens living abroad) weren't allowed to vote. There is no best Brexit deal uless we are willing to make concessions. Its like trying to leave your mobile phone contract and hoping to keep some of the services for free.

You have to remember that it is a general election. You are voting for a party not a president. If you don't like Corbyn it can be dealt with later. No one voted for Theresa May to be Prime Minister. She just ended up with the job.

 

[47802]

The country didn't vote leave, about a quarter of it did and loads of people most affected (UK citizens living abroad) weren't allowed to vote. There is no best Brexit deal uless we are willing to make concessions. Its like trying to leave your mobile phone contract and hoping to keep some of the services for free.

You have to remember that it is a general election. You are voting for a party not a president. If you don't like Corbyn it can be dealt with later. No one voted for Theresa May to be Prime Minister. She just ended up with the job.

What rubbish yes are voting or a party but you are also voting for who will be Prime Minister and its likely cabinet (eg Diane Abbot), if you think I'm voting for the Labour Party in a hope that Corbyn might disappear at a later stage you must be joking.

The country didn't vote to leave really, how do you make that out, sounds like one of those people who wont accept the result if they don't like it,. Yes some people didn't vote well that's their choice and they carn't really moan if they didn't vote. I believe Ex pats were allowed to vote who had been out of the country for up to 15 years, I didn't like the result but I accept it and don't then try and say it wasn't a fair vote.

 

[fowler9]

What rubbish yes are voting or a party but you are also voting for who will be Prime Minister and its likely cabinet (eg Diane Abbot), if you think I'm voting for the Labour Party in a hope that Corbyn might disappear at a later stage you must be joking.

The country didn't vote to leave really, how do you make that out, sounds like one of those people who wont accept the result if they don't like it,. Yes some people didn't vote well that's their choice and they carn't really moan if they didn't vote. Ex pats were allowed to vote who had been out of the country for up to 15 years, I didn't like the result but I accept it and don't then try and say it wasn't a fair vote.

Look mate fair play but there are lots of people who have been out of the country for more than 15 years who will be massively affected by it. Not to mention many people from the EU who live and work here and pay taxes who were not allowed to vote.

And what I said isn't rubbish. No one voted for Theresa May to be Prime Minister and yet here she is deciding how we are going to leave the EU and calling an early general election.

 

[PHILIPE]

Had the result gone the other way, I doubt we would have heard a squeak out of the Brexiteers and not moans because the result didn't go their way. They would have just accepted the status quo. What riles me is not the majority of those voted Remain, but those of them do not let it rest at that and accept the result and try various tactics to try and obstruct and frustrate Brexit. Gina Miller, of course. What did she achieve through her actions. The vote to trigger Article 50 still went through.

 

[simonw]

Had the result gone the other way, I doubt we would have heard a squeak out of the Brexiteers and not moans because the result didn't go their way. They would have just accepted the status quo.

Nigel Farage election night before the result was known '48:52 would be unfinished business'

 

[EM2]

...various tactics to try and obstruct and frustrate Brexit. Gina Miller, of course. What did she achieve through her actions. The vote to trigger Article 50 still went through.

Having gone through the proper scrutiny that Miller argued for.

 

[fowler9]

Had the result gone the other way, I doubt we would have heard a squeak out of the Brexiteers and not moans because the result didn't go their way. They would have just accepted the status quo. What riles me is not the majority of those voted Remain, but those of them do not let it rest at that and accept the result and try various tactics to try and obstruct and frustrate Brexit. Gina Miller, of course. What did she achieve through her actions. The vote to trigger Article 50 still went through.

So why bother having voting then. If someone voted for something once why not just let it lie and never vote on it again? Why are we having a general election? The Tories won last time so why don't we just leave them there? "The People" voted to leave the EU so just leave them alone. Yadda yadda.

The daftest thing about the Brexit vote is that people who voted to leave the EU think that anyone who disagrees should shut up and if they don't they are undemocratic! Ha ha ha.

 

[Jonny]

Having gone through the proper scrutiny that Miller argued for.

It had hardly any scrutiny, and what was done was basically booted at the first threat of parliamentary ping-pong. It was very much a Pyrrhic victory.

 

[Senex]

It had hardly any scrutiny, and what was done was basically booted at the first threat of parliamentary ping-pong. It was very much a Pyrrhic victory.

And we seem to have tacitly accepted a position where the result of any referendum, whether the legislation setting it up stated that it was binding or not, is considered binding on the representative parliament, trumping any further rational debate or the exercise by the Opposition of its right and duty to oppose in what it may see as the national interest.

 

[Barn]

And we seem to have tacitly accepted a position where the result of any referendum, whether the legislation setting it up stated that it was binding or not, is considered binding on the representative parliament, trumping any further rational debate or the exercise by the Opposition of its right and duty to oppose in what it may see as the national interest.

Most decisions may properly be taken by our representatives in Parliament but, I would argue, this does not include the core decision about who should govern us. That has to be for the people - the opposite is tyranny. That's why Cameron had to grant the Scottish indyref when it became obvious there was a widespread demand for one, against his better judgement as a unionist.

 

[47802]

Look mate fair play but there are lots of people who have been out of the country for more than 15 years who will be massively affected by it. Not to mention many people from the EU who live and work here and pay taxes who were not allowed to vote.

And what I said isn't rubbish. No one voted for Theresa May to be Prime Minister and yet here she is deciding how we are going to leave the EU and calling an early general election.

Well if she doesn't get elected again she wont be making the decisions on brexit will she.

Most Prime Ministers serve full terms in office, in the case of Cameron he did the honourable thing in my view unlike some politicians who cling to Power like grim death.

If Corbyn got in and was replaced for any reason It would likely be Mcdonnell in my view and he strikes as the sort of Politician who will cling to power like grim death in fact it wouldn't surprise me if we ended up with a left wing dictatorship with him, and I'm not entirely sure about Corbyn either. Now that might sound a bit far fetched but its no more far fetched than some of the comments I have seen on here from left wingers.

 

[DarloRich]

If Corbyn got in and was replaced for any reason It would likely be Mcdonnell in my view and he strikes as the sort of Politician who will cling to power like grim death in fact it wouldn't surprise me if we ended up with a left wing dictatorship with him, and I'm not entirely sure about Corbyn either. Now that might sound a bit far fetched but its no more far fetched than some of the comments I have seen on here from left wingers.

Tinfoil hat day again? Corbyn might be useless but he isnt a dictator. :roll:

 

[47802]

Tinfoil hat day again? Corbyn might be useless but he isnt a dictator. :roll:

Maybe not but I'm not too sure about Marxist McDonnell

 

[furnessvale]

The daftest thing about the Brexit vote is that people who voted to leave the EU think that anyone who disagrees should shut up and if they don't they are undemocratic! Ha ha ha.

That is only what brexiters have had for the last 40 years.

I will concede that in 40 years time, another vote should be held.

 

[DarloRich]

Maybe not but I'm not too sure about Marxist McDonnell

I am fairly certain that again, despite uselessness, he isnt a dictator.