Long Term Out of Use Units

[Silverlink]

Just out of intrest , does anyone know on the latest statuses of the two LM 350s . If they will be scrapped / returned /replaced etc

I think they will be repaired at some point. LM did get another 319 from Thameslink a month ago so that probably replaced one of the units

 

[adrock1976]

Regarding 221144, I am sure I read somewhere in a magazine around 2008/09 that should Virgin WC no longer require the cab ends, that it has to be put back the way it was i.e. remove the two centre coaches that were put in 142 and 143.

The easiest solution would be for Virgin WC to transfer 221142 and 143 to Arriva XC, with 221119 and 221120 transferring across.

I believe that the XC Class 221s still have the tilting mechanism fitted, but disabled.

 

[Matt Taylor]

I don't know what the nature of the damage is to 444002 and I'm not sure why there seems to be little haste in repairing it but it means that an extra 450 is being used to cover for it on a semi permanent diagram.

150916 is certainly back in service as it is currently on the 1615 Bristol to Portsmouth.

 

[455driver]

150916 is certainly back in service as it is currently on the 1615 Bristol to Portsmouth.

150916 is a quite recent reform using 150216 and 57212, the former middle coach from 150926 which has been disbanded and 150126 reformed.

150219 (52219) is the one damaged in Plymouth and 150938 had 150238 and 57219 was the unit formed up fro that.

 

[Segedunum]

Regarding 221144, I am sure I read somewhere in a magazine around 2008/09 that should Virgin WC no longer require the cab ends, that it has to be put back the way it was i.e. remove the two centre coaches that were put in 142 and 143.

The easiest solution would be for Virgin WC to transfer 221142 and 143 to Arriva XC, with 221119 and 221120 transferring across.

I believe that the XC Class 221s still have the tilting mechanism fitted, but disabled.

221136 and one other have lost a carriage each so it looks like we're instead just going to see an internal shuffle.

Sent from my LG-K350 using Tapatalk

 

[D365]

Why are those particular units losing carriages?

 

[Matt Taylor]

I heard that some of the XC 221s were losing vehicles so they can go to VT to reform the WCML 221s.

 

[59CosG95]

I heard that some of the XC 221s were losing vehicles so they can go to VT to reform the WCML 221s.

That already happened. 221144 was the sacrificial lamb that gave its 2 centre coaches to 221142 & 221143 to make those 2 units 5-car. 221141 (now with XC) never was 5-car; 141-144 were 4-car from the outset.

AIUI, some of the XC ones will lose a vehicle to bring 221144 back to 4-car formation; whether that involves re-jigging the Virgin fleet remains to be seen.

 

[221129]

That already happened. 221144 was the sacrificial lamb that gave its 2 centre coaches to 221142 & 221143 to make those 2 units 5-car. 221141 (now with XC) never was 5-car; 141-144 were 4-car from the outset.

AIUI, some of the XC ones will lose a vehicle to bring 221144 back to 4-car formation; whether that involves re-jigging the Virgin fleet remains to be seen.

The virgin fleet won't be affected at all. And I am unsure why you think it would be?

 

[221129]

I heard that some of the XC 221s were losing vehicles so they can go to VT to reform the WCML 221s.

You heard wrong.

 

[1D53]

333009 is back.

 

[221129]

221136 & 221140(?) are losing a centre car each to be inserted into 221144 to make 3x 4 Car units. 221144 will be joining XC. Nothing to do with Virgin at all.

 

[D365]

Why is 221144 being bought back into service only now?

 

[dk1]

I thought 170204 was to return sometime between now and July?

There have been rumours that it will return as a 2-car due to the centre car being more severely damaged than first thought. It has also been said that it could be renumbered 170274 so as to fit in better with diagramming.

 

[221129]

Why is 221144 being bought back into service only now?

Because the DfT said so? It was all in the timetable consultation.

 

[MCR247]

The two driving vehicles were only given to XC when the direct award was given AFAIK - although if you're asking why the DfT couldn't have allowed them to go over as soon as they weren't needed by Virgin, I don't know!

 

[D365]

... although if you're asking why the DfT couldn't have allowed them to go over as soon as they weren't needed by Virgin, I don't know!

Why is it decided now that three four-car units is better than two five-car units, that's what I'm interested to know...

 

[Domh245]

Why is it decided now that three four-car units is better than two five-car units, that's what I'm interested to know...

At it's simplest, it's brought an extra 2 cars into use (even if they are only equivalent to 1 middle car in capacity). In practice, it could buy more maintenance time, or the scenario I seem to remember being touted of allowing a 5 car train to become an 8 car train (2x4), and a 4 car (now in the 8 car) to become a 5 car. A sticking plaster, yes, but it's extra capacity.

And why now, because it coincided with the XC direct award

 

[MCR247]

Virgin decided that 2x5 car units was (and still is) better for them than 3x4 car. XC on the other hand would rather have 3x4 car than 2x5 car. Logically, both TOCs should have been able to approach DfT to enable a swap to occur, however that obviously didn't happen

 

[Crossover]

155346 has been "under refurbishment" for just over a year at Brodies Kilmarnock. It's the first one done so you'd expect it to take longer... just not this long! By all accounts there were severe corrosion issues discovered which weren't easy to patch up.

155346 photted back at Leeds the other day, presumably en-route to Neville Hill

I believe that the XC Class 221s still have the tilting mechanism fitted, but disabled.

Less disabled and more removed - I believe the whole mechanism was replaced with what basically amounts to some girders (not a technical explanation by any means!)

That already happened. 221144 was the sacrificial lamb that gave its 2 centre coaches to 221142 & 221143 to make those 2 units 5-car. 221141 (now with XC) never was 5-car; 141-144 were 4-car from the outset.

AIUI, some of the XC ones will lose a vehicle to bring 221144 back to 4-car formation; whether that involves re-jigging the Virgin fleet remains to be seen.

Why is it decided now that three four-car units is better than two five-car units, that's what I'm interested to know...

As I understand it, it's all about XC having additional carriages/seats. I was discussing with some other forum members that in reality it will probably equate to something in the order of a few thousand seats per year. I'm sure they'll put a good marketing spin on it!

 

[SpacePhoenix]

Less disabled and more removed - I believe the whole mechanism was replaced with what basically amounts to some girders (not a technical explanation by any means!)

Provided the tilt mechanisms that were removed haven't been disposed of, can they easily be re-installed?

 

[Class455]

455 845 is now back in service following its fire

 

[221129]

Provided the tilt mechanisms that were removed haven't been disposed of, can they easily be re-installed?

Why? What would the purpose be? XC don't use tilt and have no need for it..

 

[D365]

Why? What would the purpose be? XC don't use tilt and have no need for it..

I would assume the question is based on a scenario where the units are returned to the West Coast franchise...

 

[CosherB]

I would assume the question is based on a scenario where the units are returned to the West Coast franchise...

And the likelihood of that happening is ..... slim?

 

[MCR247]

Surely if anything they're all more likely to end up with XC than the other way around?

 

[swt_passenger]

I was discussing with some other forum members that in reality it will probably equate to something in the order of a few thousand seats per year. I'm sure they'll put a good marketing spin on it!

The intended figure for extra XC seats per year was 980,000 when the consultation started. Of course that was before they agreed that certain of the Scottish changes would be abandoned.

Add 980,000 additional seats across the network each year across CrossCountry services, by optimising use of the current fleet to meet today’s demand...
http://www.railforums.co.uk/showpost.php?p=2771535&postcount=1

Doesn't sound so good expressed per day of course...

 

[mervyn72]

Any sign yet of 170204 returning?

 

[nxea321446]

Any sign yet of 170204 returning?

170204 now back at Norwich

 

[RPM]

Chiltern have had a 168/0 unit out of service since late last year. The problem was a lack of replacement windscreens, which have had to be specially manufactured. 168003 and 168005 both suffered broken windscreens. A hybrid unit was made up to allow four out of the eight cars to remain in service, then last week the hybrid unit suffered a smashed windscreen too. They are still awaiting delivery of the replacement windscreens.