Philip
On Moderation
The 185s are medium-distance trains yes, but I would argue that they are medium-distance STOPPING trains, not for use on the principal fast service on a given route. That's why Llandudno works, because it is all-stops to Chester and there are (or could/should be) faster trains between Chester and Llandudno Junction (carrying on the Holyhead/Bangor/Caernarfon) using a higher-standard of rolling stock (175s or LHCS).
I don't think that's sensible at all, since you cannot run from Wrexham to Birmingham with anything other than ETCS equiped 158s unless you divert Cambrian services to Crewe instead of Birmingham or terminate them at Shrewsbury. Also, I think the Manchester - North Wales services should be fasts, in the hands of 175s or LHCS, with the Llandudno stoppers going to Liverpool instead (those could be 185s). The only way of getting Wrexham to Liverpool via the Halton Curve (which is probably a good idea) is a Cardiff to Liverpool every two hours (unless the Birmingham-Wrexham-Holyhead services are diverted to run Birmingham-Wrexham-Liverpool, but that's more 158s that are then unavailable for the Cambrian).
I can't see what is wrong with using 185s on fast services, at least where there are no speed restrictions, such as North Wales. The DfT deemed them suitable for the Scotland services and whilst that was perhaps not an ideal situation, they are quite clearly thought of as suitable for express and fairly distance work. They have scored well in passenger surveys in the past too.
Last edited: