Cambridge North: Cambridge's new station

[MikePJ]

Cambridge North is on nationalrail.co.uk now, so it's easy to check journey times.
Looks like the extra stop will extend the journey to Norwich by two minutes.

 

[dk1]

What is the overall impact on end to end Norwich - Cambridge journey times as a result of the extra stop? And will all CBG-NRW trains stop?

Thanks!

All stopping, hence my earlier coffee comment

 

[jamesontheroad]

All stopping, hence my earlier coffee comment

You'll need to set up a repeat Deliveroo order

 

[dk1]

You'll need to set up a repeat Deliveroo order

Now you are talking. Either that or radio ahead via Cambridge PSB

 

[Class 170101]

because the current Kings Cross-Cambridge only fast (and return) service that's being extended to Ely Monday-Saturday doesn't exist on Sundays- only 3tph GN CBG-KGX(!). Of course, I'd have thought that Sunday passenger loadings would be able to cope with the KLN-KGX putting in a stop at Cambridge North.

Probably messes the timetable up on a Sunday and causes a conflict elsewhere.

 

[MikePJ]

An update here on progress from the Cambridge News. Looks like there's quite a lot to do over the next six weeks or so!

http://www.cambridge-news.co.uk/news/cambridge-news/first-trains-call-cambridge-north-12855056

Testing of passenger trains has begun at Cambridge's newest station ahead of its opening at the end of May.

An eight car class 317 train was the first to stop as planned at platform 3.

Trains will now be calling four to six times daily as train operator Greater Anglia puts the station's tracks through its paces.

A formal handover of the three platforms and rail systems to the operator will be made on April 21.

I'm assuming that the trains calling "four to six times daily" are ECS services.

 

[Fuzzytop]

I'm assuming that the trains calling "four to six times daily" are ECS services.

All ECS - the detail on realtime trains this week shows they're running the 317s on the Cambridge-Stansted shuttle empty to and from Cambridge North.

Great Northern are supposedly running a test ECS from Letchworth up to Lynn tomorrow, and back again, and Cambridge North is listed as a stop.

not long left - though judging by the video in the news report the fabric of the station building still has a way to go

 

[Xenophon PCDGS]

What is said to be the first day of passenger service operation at this new station? I have a rough note of May 30th from somewhere.

 

[jopsuk]

May 21st is what they've been very publicly saying- 1st day of new timetable. Current 1st train is the 0850 from Cambridge to Norwich, arriving CMB 0854.
After that there's the 0925 CBG - CMB (arrives 0930)- this will form the 0944 to Liverpool Street.

First GN train is the next day, the 0540 to KGX (the 0454 departure from KLN)

 

[Xenophon PCDGS]

May 21st is what they've been very publicly saying- 1st day of new timetable. Current 1st train is the 0850 from Cambridge to Norwich, arriving CMB 0854.
After that there's the 0925 CBG - CMB (arrives 0930)- this will form the 0944 to Liverpool Street.

First GN train is the next day, the 0540 to KGX (the 0454 departure from KLN)

Thank you for this information to update my records.

 

[ictl]

Does anyone know if Cambridge North will have a ticket office, or will it just have TVMs?

I emailed Greater Anglia, they confirmed that Cambridge North will not have a ticket office but will have a number of ticket machines and platform hosts there to assist customers.

Regarding tickets, GA have said that fares information should be available from 23rd April (four weeks before the station opens).

 

[L&Y Robert]

I emailed Greater Anglia, they confirmed that Cambridge North will not have a ticket office but will have a number of ticket machines and platform hosts there to assist customers.

"Platform hosts". eh! New terminology. Concourse hosts? Bus stop hosts? Footbridge hosts?
"Can't come right now, I'm hosting a platform".

 

[TheDavibob]

There's an article with Great Northern and Network Rail responding to concerns about the naff (initial) service to/from the north, in particular Waterbeach:

http://www.cambridge-news.co.uk/new...t-northern-responded-concerns-theres-12884933

A spokeswoman for [Great Northern] explained that services stopping at both Cambridge North and Waterbeach were restricted by overcrowding and infrastructure pressures.

She said: "There will be a few trains calling at both Waterbeach and Cambridge North, however this is due to King’s Lynn to Cambridge services calling at all stations including Waterbeach already being very busy.

"We are acutely aware of the high demand of the current services and have added in additional Ely services calling at Cambridge North or starting at the station to manage this demand and take the pressure off the King’s Lynn to Cambridge services.

"From December 2018, we will be able to offer more direct services between Waterbeach and Cambridge North, once Network Rail have carried out the platform extension upgrades between King’s Lynn and Cambridge, allowing eight-car trains to call at Waterbeach station."

A Network Rail spokesperson said: "We know that overcrowding on the King's Lynn services, particularly in the peak is an issue. That's why we're currently developing a scheme, in close collaboration with the operator, to lengthen the platforms to allow eight car trains to run.

"We have no confirmed timescales for delivery of that project as yet, but we'd hope to do it by the end of 2019."

The dates don't agree, and I haven't heard anything on recent plans to extend Waterbeach (not least because there's a good chance the station will be completely replaced in the reasonably-near future) -- what the heck are the actually talking about?

 

[jopsuk]

The Waterbeach Barracks development proposes both lengthening the existing platforms as a short term measure and relocating the station (closer to the development, which will have 6-10x the population of the current village) in the long term (presumably as something a little grander than two basic platforms, a couple of ticket machines and a couple of bus shelters staggered across an automatic half barrier crossing)

 

[TheDavibob]

The Waterbeach Barracks development proposes both lengthening the existing platforms as a short term measure and relocating the station (closer to the development, which will have 6-10x the population of the current village) in the long term (presumably as something a little grander than two basic platforms, a couple of ticket machines and a couple of bus shelters staggered across an automatic half barrier crossing)

Cool, wasn't sure if the redevelopment still wanted rather short-term lengthening, but good if they do.

 

[bspahh]

The ticket prices to Cambridge North are now listed on www.nationalrail.co.uk and www.thetrainline.com but not www.brfares.com

A ticket to Cambridge North is the same as a ticket to Cambridge. It doesn't list a fare for Cambridge to Cambridge North.

Greater Anglia and Great Northern have both written to the Fen Line Users Association http://www.flua.org.uk/ to say that doubling back will be initially allowed. This means the first off peak train from Ely to Cambridge is the 8.58 to Cambridge, to then get back to Cambridge North for 9.33. That is £4.50 instead of £6.90 for a peak train.

If I add on a Network Gold card, it isn't showing any discounts from £4.50 for the trains that leave after 9.30.

 

[arb]

For most of the day, NRE offers a double-back via Ely as the only way to do Waterbeach to Cambridge North, requiring two tickets, costing a total of £8.80 for a single.

 

[Ianno87]

For most of the day, NRE offers a double-back via Ely as the only way to do Waterbeach to Cambridge North, requiring two tickets, costing a total of £8.80 for a single.

What's it quoting for the handful of direct trains that do exist? The same as the Waterbeach-Cambridge fare? Assuming that doubling back is permitted as stated for the time being, this should permit travel via Cambridge without having to buy two tickets.

 

[TheDavibob]

Direct (off-peak single) Cambridge North - Waterbeach is £2.50, same as the doubling back fare. This is identical to the Waterbeach to Cambridge and Cambridge North to Cambridge fare (which is now definitely on Trainline).

Waterbeach to Cambridge North definitely routes via Cambridge, so maybe they've updated the tickets?

 

[arb]

National Rail Enquiries now offers Waterbeach to Cambridge North via Cambridge, as well as via Ely, but says that via Cambridge also needs two tickets - one anytime single (£2.50) and one off-peak single (£2.30), coming to £4.80 total.

I'm also amused by the xx47 journeys from Cambridge North to Waterbeach, costing £11.10 via three separate tickets - one for Cambridge North to Cambridge, then one for Cambridge to Ely, and the final one for Ely to Waterbeach

 

[TheDavibob]

National Rail Enquiries now offers Waterbeach to Cambridge North via Cambridge, as well as via Ely, but says that via Cambridge also needs two tickets - one anytime single (£2.50) and one off-peak single (£2.30), coming to £4.80 total.

Just check NRE and yes, it does. This is odd, as theTrainline is happy to route the Waterbeach - Cambridge North journey (£2.50, as per the handful of direct tickets on NRE) via Cambridge.

 

[jopsuk]

I do wonder if there will be political pressure on the metro mayor to get the Waterbeach platforms (temporary 8 car version) issue sorted so the Ely terminators can stop there? Could be a quick win.

 

[dk1]

I thought I may be one of the first trains to stop yesterday when brought up to a red at the end of platform 1. Even got to laugh with the workmen as I crawled at a snails pace so as to have a good snout (whilst keeping one eye on that dirty red peg) at the place. Looking quite impressive now with just cosmetics to finish it off.

 

[amateur]

where can one find published timetable/departure times

 

[philjo]

I do wonder if there will be political pressure on the metro mayor to get the Waterbeach platforms (temporary 8 car version) issue sorted so the Ely terminators can stop there? Could be a quick win.

As these presumably will be using 387s shortly which have SDO, couldn't 2x387 call at waterbeach using SDO ?

 

[jopsuk]

I may be wrong, but i think SDO on a DOO route requires the cab to be at the platform? If so, stopping an 8-car service there would mean blocking the level crossing, which would I think need modifications to the crossing (it's automatic half barrier) to stop the barriers rising whilst the train is stopped.

 

[MikePJ]

As these presumably will be using 387s shortly which have SDO, couldn't 2x387 call at waterbeach using SDO ?

No, because the platforms are staggered either side of the level crossing. So the back half of the train (in either direction) would foul the crossing. There appears to be a rule that DOO trains need to stop with the cab on the platform. The same problem at Shepreth and Foxton has led to platforms being extended there to avoid the need to keep crossings closed whilst the train is in the station.

 

[MikeWM]

It's a bit of a perfect storm, unfortunately, that no-one seems to have been capable of predicting in advance. Everyone who travels into Cambridge from the north knows that more capacity is urgently needed, but:

- we can't have more frequent trains, because Ely North junction works have been put off

- we can't have longer trains without SDO, because Waterbeach platforms need extending and that's been put off (and/or never officially been scheduled in the first place)

- we can't have longer trains with SDO at Waterbeach, even though we're about to get SDO trains, because either that fouls the level crossing (which possibly may be ok if altered (?), but no-one is planning on doing that) or the front end would be off the platform, which is apparently not allowed with DOO.

So as a result, we're about to get a nice new station at Cambridge North, which lots of people would like to use, that most services can't call at in the morning peak. Instead commuters will have to continue standing on chronically overcrowded services that pass through where they want to go and then double-back.

It really is rather frustrating that no-one seems to have seen this situation coming and done something about it ahead of time.

 

[TheDavibob]

It really is rather frustrating that no-one seems to have seen this situation coming and done something about it ahead of time.

There's also the element of not bothering to do anything drastic until the Thameslink timetable recast comes in. I don't think there's anything infrastructure-wise that will cause problems with both Cambridge fasts (extended to Ely) stopping at Cambridge North? I imagine it isn't included initially just because it doesn't quite work as is, and there's no major point getting it to work for a year or a year and a half.

This does result in an alarming number of trains skipping Cambridge North, however, as a glance at the GN timetable shows. The complete avoidance of the station on Sundays, for example. They do seem to be treating it as an operational inconvenience, rather than a boon for transport in the Cambridge area.

 

[fenman35]

There's also the element of not bothering to do anything drastic until the Thameslink timetable recast comes in. I don't think there's anything infrastructure-wise that will cause problems with both Cambridge fasts (extended to Ely) stopping at Cambridge North? I imagine it isn't included initially just because it doesn't quite work as is, and there's no major point getting it to work for a year or a year and a half.

This does result in an alarming number of trains skipping Cambridge North, however, as a glance at the GN timetable shows. The complete avoidance of the station on Sundays, for example. They do seem to be treating it as an operational inconvenience, rather than a boon for transport in the Cambridge area.

The Cambridge/Kings Lynn fasts all stop at Waterbeach currently, so must be 4 carrages only