London Bridge - Brighton: Thameslink or Southern?

[chriskeene]

They are operated by Govia Thameslink Railway.

It's all the same company. The ticketing settlement agreement allows for company-restricted fares but has no provision for brand-restricted fares. See www.railforums.co.uk/showthread.php?p=2736554t#post2736554

Is this also true then for Southern/Gatwick Express?
I have a season ticket, however a friend I was with had bought a Southern only ticket to Brighton, only noticing this once on the train at Victoria.

As (nearly) all Brighton trains are now the red Gatwick Expresses and all stop at Gatwick, plus the idea of (only) Gatwick Expresses departing 13/14 now a rarity especially during the peaks, it was difficult to tell which services are which. And seemed a little unfair to be selling Southern only tickets when the gatick expresses are so similar in service.

 

[HH]

I've spent an awful lot of time looking at GTR and I have to say that I concur with 377/5 on this. GTR are doing pretty much as they have to under the conditions of the Franchise Agreement. For some reason the additional London Bridge - Brighton trains that run in the off peak and Saturdays (but not Sundays for some reason) were made Thameslink trains. Everything else flows from that, DfT decision.

 

[JonathanH]

I've spent an awful lot of time looking at GTR and I have to say that I concur with 377/5 on this. GTR are doing pretty much as they have to under the conditions of the Franchise Agreement. For some reason the additional London Bridge - Brighton trains that run in the off peak and Saturdays (but not Sundays for some reason) were made Thameslink trains. Everything else flows from that, DfT decision.

As far as I recall the original plan for the London Bridge works was for Thameslink to run:

2tph Bedford to Brighton
2tph Bedford to Blackfriars / Herne Hill siding
2tph London Bridge to Brighton

This would all have been Thameslink stock.

With Southern stock made available for the London Bridge to Brighton trains there was enough Thameslink stock to extend the 2tph Bedford to Blackfriars trains onto Gatwick via Redhill.

Is this really as bad as thing as it is being presented in this discussion?

 

[maniacmartin]

Is this also true then for Southern/Gatwick Express?
I have a season ticket, however a friend I was with had bought a Southern only ticket to Brighton, only noticing this once on the train at Victoria.

This specific issue is best discussed in the thread yorkie linked to, or failing that in the Fares section of the forums. It's not as clear cut as yorkie claims

 

[HH]

As far as I recall the original plan for the London Bridge works was for Thameslink to run:

2tph Bedford to Brighton
2tph Bedford to Blackfriars / Herne Hill siding
2tph London Bridge to Brighton

This would all have been Thameslink stock.

With Southern stock made available for the London Bridge to Brighton trains there was enough Thameslink stock to extend the 2tph Bedford to Blackfriars trains onto Gatwick via Redhill.

Is this really as bad as thing as it is being presented in this discussion?

Actually they go to Three Bridges; and no, it's not a bad thing at all; it's the confusion over branding and fares that's the opposite of good...

 

[physics34]

pretty sure a set of "Thameslink PIS codes" couldve been uploaded onto the SN 377s database with a little bit of thought.

 

[HH]

pretty sure a set of "Thameslink PIS codes" couldve been uploaded onto the SN 377s database with a little bit of thought.

And cost. Said cost being dependent on how much of said database was already filled with existing announcements - the railways have some history of getting just the minimal amount of storage, thereby requiring a physical upgrade if additional messages have to be added.

 

[Joe Paxton]

pretty sure a set of "Thameslink PIS codes" couldve been uploaded onto the SN 377s database with a little bit of thought.

I raised this issue earlier in the thread, and Class377/5 addressed it in post #30.

Essntially sounds like it's not remotely as easy as one might well think it could be.

 

[Class377/5]

pretty sure a set of "Thameslink PIS codes" couldve been uploaded onto the SN 377s database with a little bit of thought.

The TOC is completely different to the PIS codes so no. Or do you suggest re-writting the PIS software using 20 year tech costing millions to do so. It's a temporary fix to run as many trains as possible.

 

[infobleep]

The TOC is completely different to the PIS codes so no. Or do you suggest re-writting the PIS software using 20 year tech costing millions to do so. It's a temporary fix to run as many trains as possible.

Will any of this trains go on new routes when the timetables change in the future or will they just stick to existing routes, current temporary fix aside.

 

[Class377/5]

Will any of this trains go on new routes when the timetables change in the future or will they just stick to existing routes, current temporary fix aside.

By May 2018 timetable change, the Brighton to London Bridge service will be extended to Cambridge. All services will be 700s by this point.

However the current weekday timetable is tied to Southern services so needs a big re-write that is part of next year. The weekends are a different question but don't believe they will be dealt with different time.