EU Referendum: The result and aftermath...

[Busaholic]

From memory I believe sky is far more popular in C2DE households than ABC1 households.

No reputable polling organisation would publish a poll so soon after the speech, but then no reputable polling organisation has.

 

[Domh245]

No reputable polling organisation would publish a poll so soon after the speech, but then no reputable polling organisation has.

SkyData isn't a member of the BPC, so you can't really take what they say as conclusive. After all, they released a poll that said something like 35% of 18-24 year olds turned out to vote whilst most other pollsters said it was nearer 65%

The YouGov poll from before the speech had:

Hard Brexit*: 39%

Some form of Soft Brexit: 25%

Try to stay: 23%

Not Sure: 13%

A technical plurality for Hard Brexit when considered alone, but you'd assume that if the hardcore remainers had to choose a form of brexit, they'd all go for a softer version giving them the plurality (and near majority)


*analogous to leaving single market

 

[cawky22]

A simple question -

If the referendum was to join the EU what would you vote?

This is to all the remainers too?

 

[miami]

The express tells me the pound has soared. Indeed it's at it's highest value against the dollar in nearly 2 weeks! It hasn't been this strong against the euro for 6 weeks.

 

[Cowley]

A simple question -

If the referendum was to join the EU what would you vote?

This is to all the remainers too?

I see what you did there.
Well you can't get me with your clever reverse psychology questions. I'm going to go back to reading about trains again.

 

[WelshBluebird]

A simple question -

If the referendum was to join the EU what would you vote?

This is to all the remainers too?

Assuming we would get the opt outs that in the real world we already had, then it is an easy answer to say yes.

If it involved joining as a totally new country, so we wouldn't have the opt outs, then that is admittedly a harder question.

But, despite what the media has been saying over the last year, we actually get a bloody good deal when it comes to our opt outs and the terms of our EU membership.

 

[Xenophon PCDGS]

I'd be interested to see a poll to see how many actually understand what the single market is.

I'd also be interested to see a poll of how many actually understood the implications of what the implications of the referendum actually involved.

 

[me123]

A simple question -

If the referendum was to join the EU what would you vote?

It's not a simple question, because many of us have little to no knowledge of life outside the EU (we first joined the EC in 1973). In fact, our country today would be very different if we weren't in the EU. Without knowing what point we'd be starting from, how can I be asked to make a decision?

 

[ainsworth74]

The express tells me the pound has soared. Indeed it's at it's highest value against the dollar in nearly 2 weeks! It hasn't been this strong against the euro for 6 weeks.

But it is, of course, still in the toilet compared to before the Referendum

 

[YorkshireBear]

A simple question -

If the referendum was to join the EU what would you vote?

This is to all the remainers too?

I would vote happily to join. Because i believe in what the EU stands for.

But what do i know

 

[Howardh]

A simple question -

If the referendum was to join the EU what would you vote?

This is to all the remainers too?

The first minute of the first day we leave the EU, we need a party formed who will take us back into the EU, maybe UKEP??

 

[AlterEgo]

A simple question -

If the referendum was to join the EU what would you vote?

This is to all the remainers too?

That's like asking if anyone in a republic would vote for a monarchy.

 

[Johnuk123]

The first minute of the first day we leave the EU, we need a party formed who will take us back into the EU, maybe UKEP??

Are you actually admitting that we might leave then because as far as I can see most remainers simply don't accept the decision full stop.
Every time I see that horrible individual Farron on the tv I want to smash the screen as he represents the remain point of view which is to use any means possible to reverse the referendum.
Farron, Clegg, Salmon, Sturgeon are all in the same boat in that they want another referendum or to simply ignore the vote.
Every time you see a prominent remainer on the tv they always say - "Of course I respect the referendum decision - but" then give loads of reasons why they actually don't accept it whatsoever.

 

[gareth950]

Every time I see that horrible individual Farron on the tv I want to smash the screen...........

That's funny, because I get that exact same feeling every time I see Nigel Farage, Paul Nuttall, Theresa May, Andrew RT Davies, David Davies, Boris Johnson or Liam Fox on the TV or hear them on the radio. Or even read about them on the internet.

Theresa May is truly deluded if she thinks she can make a few speeches full of nice sounding, 'patriotic' rhetoric and suddenly 'heal' the deep divides in this country. I'm beyond angry about what her government is going to do to this country and the damage that future generations, and my generation, who will be around long after the people who have imposed Brexit on us have gone, will have to live with.

Indeed, most Brexiters have the luxury of being able to sit back and just watch Brexit unfold, not worrying about the economic or social consequences. Once I've finished my education, I'll have to live with the consequences of the next 3 years of political turmoil for the rest of my life.

 

[Johnuk123]

That's funny, because I get that exact same feeling every time I see Nigel Farage, Paul Nuttall, Theresa May, Andrew RT Davies, David Davies, Boris Johnson or Liam Fox on the TV or hear them on the radio. Or even read about them on the internet.

Theresa May is truly deluded if she thinks she can Make a few speeches full of nice sounding, 'patriotic' rhetoric and suddenly 'heal' the deep divides in this country. I'm beyond angry about what her government is going to do to this country abd the damage that future generations, and my generation, will have to live with.

Yet another one who doesn't respect the referendum because it didn't go his own way.
Stop being so insular, there is actually a world outside the EU, why do so many remainers think the world stops at the EU.

 

[northwichcat]

Every time I see that horrible individual Farron on the tv I want to smash the screen as he represents the remain point of view which is to use any means possible to reverse the referendum.

How dare he suggest that we should only go through with leaving the EU if the majority of the electorate are happy with the leaving terms! There's a number of people, even some posters in this thread, who said they voted Leave but wouldn't be happy if we left the single market. Leave's campaign even said we could be part of the single market after leaving so you could argue the referendum result is invalid if the plan is to leave the single market. The Lib Dems lost a lot of support because they didn't block the Conservative's tuition fees proposals, so how can you prove most people still support Leave even though the terms of leaving have changed from what they were last June?

 

[ainsworth74]

I'm still confused why 'Remoaners' are supposed to now all sit down and say how wonderful it is that we're leaving just because the Referendum didn't go our way? I seem to recall asking previously, and I'll do so again now, but when did it become unacceptable to express an opinion that is contrary to the result of an vote? When did we decide that we cannot debate anything once a vote has been taken? That we have to blindly accept that vote and can't say a word against it?

I respect the Referendum result and accept that we're going to leave the EU. But I'll be damned if I'm going to sit down and shut up just because we lost.

 

[northwichcat]

I'm still confused why 'Remoaners' are supposed to now all sit down and say how wonderful it is that we're leaving just because the Referendum didn't go our way? I seem to recall asking previously, and I'll do so again now, but when did it become unacceptable to express an opinion that is contrary to the result of an vote? When did we decide that we cannot debate anything once a vote has been taken? That we have to blindly accept that vote and can't say a word against it?

I respect the Referendum result and accept that we're going to leave the EU. But I'll be damned if I'm going to sit down and shut up just because we lost.

Indeed. How many people have said there are unhappy with the current government? Me for one. We even have a chance to change that in 2020, we don't automatically have a chance to re-enter the EU in 2024.

 

[Howardh]

Are you actually admitting that we might leave then because as far as I can see most remainers simply don't accept the decision full stop.
Every time I see that horrible individual Farron on the tv I want to smash the screen as he represents the remain point of view which is to use any means possible to reverse the referendum.
Farron, Clegg, Salmon, Sturgeon are all in the same boat in that they want another referendum or to simply ignore the vote.
Every time you see a prominent remainer on the tv they always say - "Of course I respect the referendum decision - but" then give loads of reasons why they actually don't accept it whatsoever.

I think he, like myself, wants a referendum on the outcome of the negotiations. As in democracy?

let's face it, from now on the government can do what they like without any comeback from the public. They could decide that to leave the single market is wrong and to leave but keep strong ties (EEA) and still pay in for the privilege of free trade, and even keep freedom of movement. What Mother Teresa says now isn't necessarily what will emerge.
Happy with that? Like a say on it? Well you can't, no second referendum....

 

[me123]

I'm still confused why 'Remoaners' are supposed to now all sit down and say how wonderful it is that we're leaving just because the Referendum didn't go our way? I seem to recall asking previously, and I'll do so again now, but when did it become unacceptable to express an opinion that is contrary to the result of an vote? When did we decide that we cannot debate anything once a vote has been taken? That we have to blindly accept that vote and can't say a word against it?

I respect the Referendum result and accept that we're going to leave the EU. But I'll be damned if I'm going to sit down and shut up just because we lost.

Couldn't have put it better myself.

Nigel Farage was quite open in saying that a 52:48 referendum would be unfinished business. He's not saying that now, is he? The "shut up and be happy" argument doesn't work because we know that the europhobics would only have intensified the moaning if they'd lost.

The reality of the situation - yes I accept that we are leaving the EU. I do not accept that the decision was an informed decision - I did not find any information during the campaign that allowed people to make an informed decision. But it is a decision that has been taken and we will leave the EU, for better or worse.

The inaction from the government has been astounding. The plan from Mrs May announced yesterday is truly terrible, and I cannot believe that it has taken over six months to formulate twelve meaningless statements. We will be leaving the EU on 1st April 2019, and in that time we have to renegotiate trade deals with many countries around the world, revamp quite a large portion of our legislature, and deal with our own internal constitutional crises. But don't worry, there's a dozen meaningless statements to look at. That only took six months.

 

[miami]

That's like asking if anyone in a republic would vote for a monarchy.

Really isn't, as the benefit of a monarchy is in the history. A new monarchy wouldn't have any of that.

I would vote to join the EU. I'm with Winston.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

Farron, Clegg, Salmon, Sturgeon are all in the same boat in that they want another referendum or to simply ignore the vote.

Boaty McBoatface. The public have spoken!

If a patient comes up to a doctor saying they need this and that, and the doctor examines them and find that actually this and that would be very bad for the patient, and all they need is a placebo, what would you expect the doctor to do?

Every time you see a prominent remainer on the tv they always say - "Of course I respect the referendum decision - but" then give loads of reasons why they actually don't accept it whatsoever.

In a 52-48 referendum this would be unfinished business by a long way.

I accept that the public voted narrowly to leave in an advisory referendum to keep the tory party together. I will still fight it, that's what an opposition is supposed to do - be opposed to government policy that they believe will be terrible. Given that this vote has already left us at least £300m a week worse off they've got some good evidence to believe that.

 

[zuriblue]

I'm still confused why 'Remoaners' are supposed to now all sit down and say how wonderful it is that we're leaving just because the Referendum didn't go our way? I seem to recall asking previously, and I'll do so again now, but when did it become unacceptable to express an opinion that is contrary to the result of an vote? When did we decide that we cannot debate anything once a vote has been taken? That we have to blindly accept that vote and can't say a word against it?

I respect the Referendum result and accept that we're going to leave the EU. But I'll be damned if I'm going to sit down and shut up just because we lost.

The problem is that the leavers seem to demand total capitulation from the remain side, which is not going to happen. The same seems to have happened in the US with Trump's election where there have been a few people assulted for expressing anti-Trump views.

Certainly I can't imagine that had it been 48-52% the other way the leavers woudl have just shut up.

 

[miami]

Yet another one who doesn't respect the referendum because it didn't go his own way.
Stop being so insular, there is actually a world outside the EU, why do so many remainers think the world stops at the EU.

The day we leave the EU we also leave behind favourable trade agreements with many of those countries

 

[radamfi]

Yet another one who doesn't respect the referendum because it didn't go his own way.
Stop being so insular, there is actually a world outside the EU, why do so many remainers think the world stops at the EU.

I could understand if we gained freedom to live and work in other countries that we don't at the moment, but it looks like the only place we will be able to live in will be the UK. That's a massive loss compared with today. Even Ireland is now looking dodgy.

So surely you can understand why people are upset about it?

 

[Railops]

How dare he suggest that we should only go through with leaving the EU if the majority of the electorate are happy with the leaving terms! There's a number of people, even some posters in this thread, who said they voted Leave but wouldn't be happy if we left the single market. Leave's campaign even said we could be part of the single market after leaving so you could argue the referendum result is invalid if the plan is to leave the single market. The Lib Dems lost a lot of support because they didn't block the Conservative's tuition fees proposals, so how can you prove most people still support Leave even though the terms of leaving have changed from what they were last June?

Having listened to a lot of radio phone-ins last night and today it seems loads of Inners are now coming round to Outers. Even arch Inner Mark Carney has admitted he was wrong with his dire warnings of Brexit disaster.
I imagine another referendum today would see an increase in the Out vote.
Britain ended 2016 as the strongest of the world’s advanced economies with growth accelerating in the 6 months after Brexit.

 

[Howardh]

I could understand if we gained freedom to live and work in other countries that we don't at the moment,

Yes indeed. Can you imagine the result of any trade deals with the US will result in "Oh, hi, you can now waltz into the US with just your passport, pick a house and live in it and help yourselves to our jobs...."

OK, people do go and live/work there, but it ain't anything like as easy to do as it is in the EU, where it is a RIGHT.

If Brexiters think that by leaving the EU the world becomes larger, it's quite the opposite. The restrictions make it smaller.

 

[Senex]

I'm still confused why 'Remoaners' are supposed to now all sit down and say how wonderful it is that we're leaving just because the Referendum didn't go our way? I seem to recall asking previously, and I'll do so again now, but when did it become unacceptable to express an opinion that is contrary to the result of an vote? When did we decide that we cannot debate anything once a vote has been taken? That we have to blindly accept that vote and can't say a word against it?

I respect the Referendum result and accept that we're going to leave the EU. But I'll be damned if I'm going to sit down and shut up just because we lost.

Very well put! Thank you.

When we have a general election and the side that we may detest wins, we accept the result and live with it, but we certainly do not give up the fight for what we believe in and the hope of overturning the result next time round. And that's also just what the losers of the 1975 referendum did. Why should those of us on the losing side in this referendum behave any differently, especially when the result was so much closer and yet the government intends to go for the most extreme form of separation?

 

[Domh245]

But it is, of course, still in the toilet compared to before the Referendum

I saw a couple of pictures on the BBC yesterday which I can't find now but was to this effect:

"The pound surged"

"But was still down compared to it's pre-referendum values"

The reality of the situation - yes I accept that we are leaving the EU. I do not accept that the decision was an informed decision - I did not find any information during the campaign that allowed people to make an informed decision. But it is a decision that has been taken and we will leave the EU, for better or worse.

Agreed. Ultimately it's the fault of a terrible PM who will hopefully be remembered as such.

The inaction from the government has been astounding. The plan from Mrs May announced yesterday is truly terrible, and I cannot believe that it has taken over six months to formulate twelve meaningless statements. We will be leaving the EU on 1st April 2019, and in that time we have to renegotiate trade deals with many countries around the world, revamp quite a large portion of our legislature, and deal with our own internal constitutional crises. But don't worry, there's a dozen meaningless statements to look at. That only took six months.

I think that calling it a plan is rather ambitious - it reads more as a series of goals than anything that you might expect as a plan.

 

[Howardh]

Having listened to a lot of radio phone-ins last night and today it seems loads of Inners are now coming round to Outers. Even arch Inner Mark Carney has admitted he was wrong with his dire warnings of Brexit disaster.
I imagine another referendum today would see an increase in the Out vote.
Britain ended 2016 as the strongest of the world’s advanced economies with growth accelerating in the 6 months after Brexit.

Blimey, and there's me thinking we were still in the EU and will be so for at least the next two years :roll:

When did we leave...have I missed it??

 

[radamfi]

Getting back into the EU will be a challenge but getting back into the single market might be a lot easier and might not even need a referendum.