Gospel Oak to Barking Line (GOBLIN) electrification

[trivran]

Once complete, will trains from Barking run through to Richmond or Clapham Junction? Is there any reason why they couldn't?

The fact that there are no platforms at Gospel Oak isn't exactly a barrier but it is a factor in reasoning for not doing so.

 

[Class 170101]

Press release

http://www.networkrailmediacentre.c...-starts-to-prepare-for-longer-electric-trains

Only connections to two power supplies? Is the article serious?

 

[rebmcr]

Only connections to two power supplies? Is the article serious?

Three feeder stations, each with a connection to two grid supplies for redundancy.

 

[bramling]

Only connections to two power supplies? Is the article serious?

That's normal for OHLE.

The cost of tapping into the grid is *high*. I'm not familiar with this scheme, but my interpretation of the article is they're simply utilising the existing Feeder Stations at West Ham and Acton Lane, and slightly extending the area these supplies already cover. Depending on the siting of neutral sections it would be theoretically possible for the line to be fed entirely from the Gospel Oak end, entirely from the Barking end, or from both if there's a neutral section at South Tottenham.

A relatively sparse service of short EMUs is never going to need a massive supply of power, so I'd have been surprised to see massive investment in grid connections. The only real hope of one would have been to have provided reinforcement to the wider area, but my interpretation of the article is this isn't what's happening.

 

[TheKnightWho]

That's normal for OHLE.

The cost of tapping into the grid is *high*. I'm not familiar with this scheme, but my interpretation of the article is they're simply utilising the existing Feeder Stations at West Ham and Acton Lane, and slightly extending the area these supplies already cover. Depending on the siting of neutral sections it would be theoretically possible for the line to be fed entirely from the Gospel Oak end, entirely from the Barking end, or from both if there's a neutral section at South Tottenham.

A relatively sparse service of short EMUs is never going to need a massive supply of power, so I'd have been surprised to see massive investment in grid connections. The only real hope of one would have been to have provided reinforcement to the wider area, but my interpretation of the article is this isn't what's happening.

We should remember that there are absolutely no barriers to them implementing such a reinforcement scheme in the future, and that GOBLIN electrification makes that easier.

 

[Class 170101]

Three feeder stations, each with a connection to two grid supplies for redundancy.

Whats the third one please?
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

That's normal for OHLE.

The cost of tapping into the grid is *high*. I'm not familiar with this scheme, but my interpretation of the article is they're simply utilising the existing Feeder Stations at West Ham and Acton Lane.

I would have expected connections into the WAML at Northumberland Park and the ECML in the Haringay for resilence as well as West Ham and Acton Lane.

So no blocks between Camden Road and Willesden Jn via Gospel Oak at the same time as Fenchurch Street to Barking then?

 

[rebmcr]

Whats the third one please?

Electricity will be provided by three new power switching stations along the route and one of these is already in place at Gospel Oak. A second near South Tottenham is almost complete and a third will be installed close to Barking station in the coming months. Each switching station links to two power supplies at Acton and West Ham, so if one supply breaks down engineers can switch to the other, minimising disruption for passengers.

_____

 

[Class 170101]

Thats only two feeder stations West Ham and Acton Lane. Whats the third feeder station please?

 

[traji00]

OHLE masts (?) have appeared between Crouch Hill and Harringay Green Lanes.

This is at the latter (poor picture of mine):

Edit: more masts are along the route. The equipment is similar in style to the Newton-le-Willows route OLE

 

[AM9]

... A relatively sparse service of short EMUs is never going to need a massive supply of power, so I'd have been surprised to see massive investment in grid connections. The only real hope of one would have been to have provided reinforcement to the wider area, but my interpretation of the article is this isn't what's happening.

A single ended feed may be OK with four 4-car EMUs per hour each way, but when they decide to start putting class 90s at the head of freights, that may be a bit more difficult to maintain the voltage within limits.

 

[snowball]

A single ended feed may be OK with four 4-car EMUs per hour each way, but when they decide to start putting class 90s at the head of freights, that may be a bit more difficult to maintain the voltage within limits.

The WCML manages OK. Its grid connections are about 28 miles apart if I remember correctly, divided into sections half that length, each fed from one end (though switchable in emergencies). Acton to Barking is only 16 miles.

 

[AM9]

The WCML manages OK. Its grid connections are about 28 miles apart if I remember correctly, divided into sections half that length, each fed from one end (though switchable in emergencies). Acton to Barking is only 16 miles.

Will the GOBlin have ATs?

 

[edwin_m]

Will the GOBlin have ATs?

"Classic Boosterless" according to Rail Engineer mag. Which I think means no AT or boosters with return solely through the rails.

 

[snowball]

"Classic Boosterless" according to Rail Engineer mag. Which I think means no AT or boosters with return solely through the rails.

See the bottom of page 44 in GazK's book:

http://www.railforums.co.uk/showthread.php?t=138230

 

[Mordac]

New press release on NR website.

http://www.networkrailmediacentre.c...ay-between-gospel-oak-and-barking-80-complete

VIDEO: work to electrify railway between Gospel Oak and Barking 80% complete

Downloads

Thursday 1 Dec 2016

London & South East

Work to electrify the last London Overground route is 80% complete, a key milestone in the £133m upgrade to the railway between Gospel Oak and Barking, which will see two car diesel trains replaced with four car electric trains from 2018.

Engineers have spent the last five months lowering over three miles of track at five sites between Gospel Oak and Barking, to make way for new masts that will carry overhead wires to power new electric trains. Video footage has captured some of the work taking place along the route.

[youtube]bR52OxwEmZg[/youtube]

Work completed includes:

1,700 metres of track lowered through the heart of Walthamstow from Pretoria Avenue (close to Blackhorse Road Station) to Queens Road (just beyond Walthamstow Queens Road Station)
Lowering the whole of Walthamstow Queens Road Station including platforms, ramps and stairs
Working against the clock to lower track between Gospel Oak and Upper Holloway during the October half term, as not to disrupt a local schools
Lowering the railway through a Victorian tunnel between Crouch Hill and Harringay Green Lanes
Connecting the Gospel Oak to Barking Line and the East Coast Main Line to provide an additional route for electrified freight traveling between the lines
The first overhead wires were installed at Barking in mid-November



Richard Schofield, Network Rail’s route managing director for Anglia, said: “At 80 per cent complete, it won’t be long until the last diesel operated London Overground route is electrified, helping to meet growing passenger demand as part of our Railway Upgrade Plan. We’re now focused on installing the overhead line and power switching stations so that we can reopen the route next year. I’d like to thank everyone for their continued patience while the work is carried out.”

Engineers are now focused on installing over 100km of overhead wires and over 600 structures to support them, and three power switching stations to power new trains. The two-car diesel trains will return once the project is complete in February next year, until the new electric trains arrive in 2018.

Passengers and residents across north and east London will benefit from the work to electrify the route, which is part of Network Rail's Railway Upgrade Plan, and includes:

The introduction of new longer electric trains from 2018 with twice as much space
Hundreds of thousands of people living close to the line – which covers 14 miles and runs through seven London boroughs – will also benefit from a reduction in CO2emissions from the railway.

Network Rail is delivering the project, which is being funded by the Department for Transport and Transport for London (TfL). J Murphy & Sons is the main contractor.

Notes to editors

Electrification of the Gospel Oak to Barking route is an £133m investment jointly funded by the Department for Transport and Transport for London.
The route runs for 14 miles through seven London boroughs.
Passenger demand on the route has doubled since 2008 resulting in overcrowding at peak times.
For project updates follow @NetworkRailGOBE on Twitter or visit networkrail.co.uk/gobe

I think if this tells us anything, is that full blockades are the way to go for electrification projects in the future. I know this wouldn't be feasible everywhere (like the GWML), but would probably work for the North West, definitely Scotland and Brum.

 

[edwin_m]

New press release on NR website.
I think if this tells us anything, is that full blockades are the way to go for electrification projects in the future. I know this wouldn't be feasible everywhere (like the GWML), but would probably work for the North West, definitely Scotland and Brum.

Not sure you can draw that conclusion. The reason for blockades here was the extensive civils work needed for the track lowering. If it had been done in overnight possessions then very little work would have been done each night before they track had to be restored to working condition for the following morning. This isn't true of the OLE installation itself, where the time penalty of stopping and re-starting work is much smaller, except in the case of bad planning such as putting the road rail access point several miles from the worksite! I think it will continue to be a case of horses for courses, with projects needing major civils work having more blockades (but probably weekend possessions rather than long ones like this).

 

[GRALISTAIR]

I think if this tells us anything, is that full blockades are the way to go for electrification projects in the future. I know this wouldn't be feasible everywhere (like the GWML), but would probably work for the North West, definitely Scotland and Brum.

Not sure you can draw that conclusion. ---- I think it will continue to be a case of horses for courses, with projects needing major civils work having more blockades (but probably weekend possessions rather than long ones like this).

Agreed. Sorry to be slightly OT. I think Lostock Jct -Wigan would definitely benefit from a total blockade. With correct planning it could be done very quickly IMHO. Same for Oxenholme -Windermere.

GOBLIN has certainly been helped with a total blockade.

 

[Starmill]

The people who live near the line will benefit from a reductio in CO2 emissions? I don't think so, carbon dioxide isn't a pollutant!

 

[Mordac]

Agreed. Sorry to be slightly OT. I think Lostock Jct -Wigan would definitely benefit from a total blockade. With correct planning it could be done very quickly IMHO. Same for Oxenholme -Windermere.

GOBLIN has certainly been helped with a total blockade.

Agreed with edwin or me? I can't tell because your bolding his post makes it seem like you're agreeing with him, yet what you go on to say with me. :P

 

[GRALISTAIR]

Agreed with edwin or me? I can't tell because your bolding his post makes it seem like you're agreeing with him, yet what you go on to say with me. :P

Both really - total blockades really have their advantages - but it has to be horses for courses. Even on the GWML if/when it gets completed I can see an advantage for a total blockade on the Bath route. Just park the HOPS train etc on the line and get it done. Would not be a good idea for Didcot - Oxford though.

I will say again though to get back OT -GOBLIN - a no brainer.

Should one of us start a new thread on speculation of what projects would really be benefit and be practical for a total blockade?

 

[TheKnightWho]

New press release on NR website.

http://www.networkrailmediacentre.c...ay-between-gospel-oak-and-barking-80-complete



I think if this tells us anything, is that full blockades are the way to go for electrification projects in the future. I know this wouldn't be feasible everywhere (like the GWML), but would probably work for the North West, definitely Scotland and Brum.

I think once the mainlines are done (and yes, this will take decades...) then this may well be the way forward for the smaller lines which we can afford to close for a period of time like the GOBLIN.

 

[87015]

I think once the mainlines are done (and yes, this will take decades...) then this may well be the way forward for the smaller lines which we can afford to close for a period of time like the GOBLIN.

It's only possible because of the very nearby diversionary route over the NLL. You'd need something like that to get operator buy in.

Anyway it needs to handed back on time and completed yet before it's deemed a good job...

 

[dviner]

It's only possible because of the very nearby diversionary route over the NLL. You'd need something like that to get operator buy in.

Cast your mind back to the planned blockade at Watford a couple of summers ago...

 

[59CosG95]

I think if this tells us anything, is that full blockades are the way to go for electrification projects in the future. I know this wouldn't be feasible everywhere (like the GWML), but would probably work for the North West, definitely Scotland and Brum.

Definitely. I can imagine the Cross-City being shut between Longbridge and Redditch when they get around to wiring all the lines, which they'll probably have to do in advance of wiring down the Lickey.

 

[Class 170101]

Anyway it needs to handed back on time and completed yet before it's deemed a good job...

I'll believe that when I see it.

 

[edwin_m]

Definitely. I can imagine the Cross-City being shut between Longbridge and Redditch when they get around to wiring all the lines, which they'll probably have to do in advance of wiring down the Lickey.

What more wires are needed on the Redditch branch? It was electrified with the rest of the Cross-City in the 1990s and the passing loop with associated electrification was added a couple of years ago.

There may be a need for a shutdown while the new wires towards Bromsgrove are linked up at Barnt Green, but I assume the junction was fully wired when the branch was done as per normal practice, so making this connection wouldn't be a big job.

If you're referring to the four-track section between Longbridge and Barnt Green, all passenger trains use the inner (electrified) tracks and I don't see any reason for this to change, as it is too short for a passenger train to overtake another one unless the slower one stops.

 

[Class 170101]

I Imagine the Cross City route will be closed between Kings Norton and Longbridge when the centre pair of lines are wired but doubtless thats years away.

 

[YorkshireBear]

The people who live near the line will benefit from a reductio in CO2 emissions? I don't think so, carbon dioxide isn't a pollutant!

You know that diesel emissions do not just consist of CO2 don't you?

 

[rebmcr]

A single ended feed may be OK with four 4-car EMUs per hour each way, but when they decide to start putting class 90s at the head of freights, that may be a bit more difficult to maintain the voltage within limits.

The freight chord to connect northwards on the MML is a separate electrification scheme, which would appear to offer the opportunity for electrical bolstering if necessary for trains in excess of EMU loadings.

 

[edwin_m]

The freight chord to connect northwards on the MML is a separate electrification scheme, which would appear to offer the opportunity for electrical bolstering if necessary for trains in excess of EMU loadings.

There won't be electric freight on the MML for the foreseeable future. Even when the electrification scheme is finished it won't serve any freight terminals, even allowing the "last mile" diesel capability of the class 88. So there is little point in electrifying the connecting line.

However the GOBLIN is a better route from the Tilbury line to the WCML, because it bridges the GE main line which the alternative North London Line route crosses on the flat at Stratford. So there is the potential for GOBLIN to carry electric freight as soon as it is able to.