Edinburgh Gateway (Update 11/12: Now open)

[cle]

So the HSTs may well be scheduled to stop then, for Inverness and Aberdeen?

How about ScotRail Aberdeen services?

 

[railjock]

Any clue as to the impact on services to South Gyle?

 

[me123]

I raised that very point a while ago, and my understanding is that South Gyle will retain the same service (i.e. 4tph served by stoppers). It would allegedly be too politically sensitive to consider withdrawing the service.

 

[Clansman]

So the HSTs may well be scheduled to stop then, for Inverness and Aberdeen?

How about ScotRail Aberdeen services?

The Chieftain goes via Edinburgh Park and Stirling so it'll only be the Aberdeen HSTs, I'm not sure about XC though.

 

[Class 170101]

So the HSTs may well be scheduled to stop then, for Inverness?

Possibly only if its diverted via Kirkcaldy which it does on occasion the route via Stirling is blocked.

Scotrail Inverness services do use this route in normal service though so there is the opportunity for direct services between Inverness and Edinburgh Airport - though how useful that may be if Inverness Airport gets its own station I wouldn't like to say.

 

[me123]

^ Even if Inverness airport gets a station, the a call at Edinburgh Gateway will be extremely useful. Inverness airport only has a small number of services to London, Dublin, Bristol, Manchester and Amsterdam. By contrast, Edinburgh serves a much wider range of destinations and subsequently receive passengers from across Scotland (to list just a few destinations - Paris, New York, Istanbul, Abu Dhabi, Madrid, Frankfurt, Barcelona, and lots of holiday routes too).

 

[sng7]

If nothing else the Inverness trains would also provide a useful link for people from Perth as well who would go to Edinburgh anyway.

 

[oldman]

It is a matter of balancing the interests of long-distance passengers to the Gateway, who save perhaps 15-20 minutes, with the passengers for central Edinburgh or beyond, who lose perhaps 5 minutes. I guess the latter group are going to be the great majority. For longer distance passengers it doesn't make a huge difference, for local passengers it does.

 

[Romilly]

I note that trains are timetabled to start calling at Edinburgh Gateway with effect from the December timetable change. Is this still expected to go ahead on time?

I also see that no VT East Coast, or Cross Country, trains are for now timetabled to call at Edinburgh Gateway. Is that expected to be a permanent state of affairs, or are VTEC and XC just waiting to see if the new station opens on time?

 

[MidnightFlyer]

I note that trains are timetabled to start calling at Edinburgh Gateway with effect from the December timetable change. Is this still expected to go ahead on time?

ScotRail seem to think so:

New gateway for integrated travel
Wednesday, 2 November 2016
A brand new station set to make integrated travel easier than ever is set to open its doors on Sunday 11 December.

Edinburgh Gateway interchange, situated between South Gyle and Dalmeny stations, will offer rail passengers from Fife and further north the option to transfer directly onto the tram network for onward travel to Edinburgh Airport.

A combined train and tram ticket, is available for advance purchase online or in stations, for those planning their next getaway.

The new interchange station – part of the Scottish Government’s Edinburgh Glasgow Improvement Programme – will offer wider benefits other than fast airport connections.

Local residents will have direct trains to Perth, Dundee and Inverness, as well as to the city centre and Fife. When combined with the nearby South Gyle station, six trains per hour will serve North West Edinburgh instead of the current four.

Edinburgh Gateway will also provide increased choice for Fife-based commuters travelling to Edinburgh Business Park, with 14 trains arriving at Gateway or South Gyle between 07:00-09:00 hrs. For the return leg, a similar number of services will depart these stations during the evening peak.

The number of trains calling at South Gyle will reduce from current levels to two per hour, but with an additional service in the morning and evening peaks.

The station will offer a bright and accessible space, packed with modern amenities.

ScotRail Alliance Managing Director, Phil Verster said: “Edinburgh Gateway interchange will be a hugely convenient transport hub for a vast array of customers, bringing new journey opportunities and better connections for people travelling into and around the capital.

“Thanks to the smooth transition with the tram network, this is another step forward for integrated travel and supports the future economic investment and activity in the area.”

Notes
The opening of Edinburgh Gateway on 11 December coincides with the start of ScotRail’s winter timetable. Opening hours will be 06:10-00:10 Mon-Sat and 08:30-00:10 – Sunday.
Currently North West Edinburgh has four trains per hour to/from Edinburgh and Fife – all calling at South Gyle. The opening of Edinburgh Gateway will see an increase to six trains per hour each way, four stopping at Edinburgh Gateway and two at South Gyle.
Around two thirds of customers who currently use South Gyle station, travel to or from stations in Fife.
The new timetable balances calls between South Gyle and Edinburgh Gateway to improve rail access for a wider range of residents in North West Edinburgh, along with providing greater choice for those travelling between Edinburgh Business Park and Fife.

Services that will call at Edinburgh Gateway include:

Edinburgh - Glenrothes (both directions of the Fife Circle)
Edinburgh – Perth
Edinburgh – Dundee
Edinburgh – Inverness

https://www.scotrail.co.uk/about-scotrail/news/new-gateway-integrated-travel

 

[Blindtraveler]

Oh so they are reducing South Gyle calls then? Bad move IMO. Stopping Inverness trains there also seams unusual but I guess they know what theyr doing.

I only hope the claim about facilities isnt just spin, I was disapointed in Edinburgh Park when it opened.

 

[Altnabreac]

Oh so they are reducing South Gyle calls then? Bad move IMO. Stopping Inverness trains there also seams unusual but I guess they know what theyr doing.

I only hope the claim about facilities isnt just spin, I was disapointed in Edinburgh Park when it opened.

I think that is a reasonable balance. The vast majority of South Gyle passengers are heading for the offices at Edinburgh Park.

On foot the distances will be broadly similar for offices around the central tram stop like HSBC and Diageo. Offices in the north of the park such as Sainsburys Bank and BT will be closer to Edinburgh Gateway.

And Gateway has the option for interchanging to Tram to cut down your walking distance.

it's only really people working in the SE of Edinburgh Park like the RBS building that will be inconvenienced by the change.

 

[Clansman]

I'm a bit perplexed at the Inverness call, considering Aberdeen is omitted. Should of just kept the same principle as in place where local/semi-fast services provide a connection to Intercity services, such as Perth and Dundee semi-fasts. Could atl east omit a call on the Inverness service to redress the balance; Markinch springs to mind. I can't understand why Aberdeen gets the fast services and Inverness is stuck with hee-haw calls in Fife. Just my opinion.

Never the less I'm looking forward to the opening of Gateway, and the link it'll provide to the ever expanding airport. Passed through it while the train was chasing yellows so we were only doing around 20mph, all the signs are up and the glass roofs on the canopies have been laid.

 

[me123]

Oh so they are reducing South Gyle calls then? Bad move IMO. Stopping Inverness trains there also seams unusual but I guess they know what theyr doing.

South Gyle is very close to Edinburgh Gateway, so stopping at both stations will significantly slow trains down for little benefit. That said, the reduction to 2tph is largely off peak, with peak times continuing to enjoy a reasonably high level of service (up to 4tph). So for people traveling to Edinburgh Park via South Gyle Station, South Gyle will remain a viable option in peak times. Sadly, the off peak frequency is not regular (because 1tph comes from and goes to each side of the circle) and there are long gaps.

Inverness trains will essentially be stopped as they are an extension to the hourly Perth service. This gives Perth an hourly service to Edinburgh Gateway. Aberdeen trains will not stop as they are time sensitive, so Haymarket-Leuchars non-stop runs will be maintained. That said, the Dundee (and Arbroath) services will be stopping, so an option remains available with a change in Dundee.

To be honest, it would have been easier to just close South Gyle, but some people would certainly be inconvenienced and it would be politically unacceptable.

 

[railjock]

South Gyle is very close to Edinburgh Gateway, so stopping at both stations will significantly slow trains down for little benefit. That said, the reduction to 2tph is largely off peak, with peak times continuing to enjoy a reasonably high level of service (up to 4tph). So for people traveling to Edinburgh Park via South Gyle Station, South Gyle will remain a viable option in peak times. Sadly, the off peak frequency is not regular (because 1tph comes from and goes to each side of the circle) and there are long gaps.

Inverness trains will essentially be stopped as they are an extension to the hourly Perth service. This gives Perth an hourly service to Edinburgh Gateway. Aberdeen trains will not stop as they are time sensitive, so Haymarket-Leuchars non-stop runs will be maintained. That said, the Dundee (and Arbroath) services will be stopping, so an option remains available with a change in Dundee.

To be honest, it would have been easier to just close South Gyle, but some people would certainly be inconvenienced and it would be politically unacceptable.

Will the fares to South Gyle and Gateway he the same as could get complicated if you want to get to work and miss a train.

 

[Chrism20]

Will the fares to South Gyle and Gateway he the same as could get complicated if you want to get to work and miss a train.

Waverley to South Gyle £2.50 single
Waverley to Gateway £3.10

Fares are in the booking engine.

 

[marks87]

Aberdeen trains will not stop as they are time sensitive, so Haymarket-Leuchars non-stop runs will be maintained. That said, the Dundee (and Arbroath) services will be stopping, so an option remains available with a change in Dundee.

On one hand I'm disappointed that there won't be a fast Dundee-Leuchars-Gateway, but on the other hand for travel to the airport the semi-fast will be quicker than going to Haymarket and back out again on the tram/bus.

Swings, roundabouts etc.

 

[hibtastic]

It will be interesting to see if the longer distance services from VTEC and XC will call at Edinburgh Gateway. I think there is a strong case for them to do so given how rapidly Edinburgh Airport is expanding.

Interestingly the new Edinburgh Airport Masterplan will be published for consultation on Friday outlining how the airport will further expand. I'd expect increased terminal space and airside stands.

I have read discussions on another forum where people have suggested that one possibility could be the closure of the secondary runway and a new domestic terminal down by the Gateway Station. I am not sure I can see this happening though.

 

[Altnabreac]

It will be interesting to see if the longer distance services from VTEC and XC will call at Edinburgh Gateway. I think there is a strong case for them to do so given how rapidly Edinburgh Airport is expanding.

Interestingly the new Edinburgh Airport Masterplan will be published for consultation on Friday outlining how the airport will further expand. I'd expect increased terminal space and airside stands.

I have read discussions on another forum where people have suggested that one possibility could be the closure of the secondary runway and a new domestic terminal down by the Gateway Station. I am not sure I can see this happening though.

I'd suspect the former (secondary runway closure) is more likely to happen than the latter (a new terminal).

The land released for freight capacity and development could be very valuable.

 

[hibtastic]

I'd suspect the former (secondary runway closure) is more likely to happen than the latter (a new terminal).

The land released for freight capacity and development could be very valuable.

The runway closure would be required for any new terminal down near the Gateway Station anyway. However I suspect we will just see the development of the current South East Pier and flipping the airport around so that the Cul-de-sac is used for Domestic with the rest of the terminal being appropriately configured for international services.

This year they are currently creating additional and much needed wide body stands adjacent to the SE Pier and the proposed new terminal extension to accommodate a more permanent immigration hall.

 

[Xenophon PCDGS]

What is the 3-letter station code that has been chosen for this station (EGY is free at present)?

 

[Chrism20]

What is the 3-letter station code that has been chosen for this station (EGY is free at present)?

EGY is indeed the code that will be used.

 

[sng7]

I doubt they will be in a rush to close the second runway as it is used multiple times a year overnight to allow them to do maintenance on the main runway.

 

[marks87]

I have read discussions on another forum where people have suggested that one possibility could be the closure of the secondary runway and a new domestic terminal down by the Gateway Station. I am not sure I can see this happening though.

That would be novel - rebuild (sort of) the airport next to the railway station instead of building a rail link to the airport.

If (and it's a big if) this ever got off the ground*, then presumably they'd adopt the Gatwick solution of a people-mover between the new and existing terminals.

*Ba-boom, tish.

I doubt they will be in a rush to close the second runway as it is used multiple times a year overnight to allow them to do maintenance on the main runway.

Maybe they could build Heathrow's third runway as a second (parallel) runway at Edinburgh

Actually, there is space for a second runway to the North without requiring too much demolition work (if any). The River Almond might present a problem, however.

----

In terms of services stopping at the station, I wonder if there would've been sufficient demand for a couple of terminal platforms to accept extensions to services from the south that would normally terminate at Waverley (Tweedbank, or even VTEC/TPE/XC)?

 

[clc]

Is there any possibility that in the long term they could revisit building a heavy rail station at the terminal, a cheaper version of EARL?

 

[me123]

Is there any possibility that in the long term they could revisit building a heavy rail station at the terminal, a cheaper version of EARL?

Is it needed? The current rail routes all have reasonable Edinburgh Airport links via the stations at Park and Gateway. There's no obvious new route that would encompass Edinburgh Airport. An Edinburgh Gateway-Winchburgh "bypass" has the problem that it would simply shift the bottleneck elsewhere rather than creating capacity.

 

[mark-h]

It would have made sense a few years ago to build a new terminal and close the current one. Instead they extended and modified the existing building to create an expensive but unsatisfactory solution.

Had the teminal been replaced (near Edinburgh Gateway) then it would have shortened the Edinburgh Tram route.

That would be novel - rebuild (sort of) the airport next to the railway station instead of building a rail link to the airport.

The current Gatwick South Terminal was built next to Gatwick Racecourse station. It replaced the old Beehive terminal which had a new station, further down the line.

 

[92002]

The runway closure would be required for any new terminal down near the Gateway Station anyway. However I suspect we will just see the development of the current South East Pier and flipping the airport around so that the Cul-de-sac is used for Domestic with the rest of the terminal being appropriately configured for international services.

This year they are currently creating additional and much needed wide body stands adjacent to the SE Pier and the proposed new terminal extension to accommodate a more permanent immigration hall.

Not that it's really much to do with Edinburgh Gateway station.

However the second runway at Edinburgh airport is already out of use and used as a parking bay for executive planes and larger ones that don't have anything to do for a day or two.

The completed solution would be a new a new terminal joined to the new station. Plenty of space to fit one in the area.

Then use the leftover tram lines to connect to Ratho, Uphall
and Livingston. Much better solution than the current buses.

Perhaps just a bit too much joined up thinking in that one though. It would of course also give space for a new second runway.

 

[najaB]

Not that it's really much to do with Edinburgh Gateway station.

However the second runway at Edinburgh airport is already out of use and used as a parking bay for executive planes and larger ones that don't have anything to do for a day or two.

Not in day to day use, out of use and closed are three different things - as the railways demonstrate to us all the time.

Edinburgh Airport has two runways and while 12/30 isn't used every day, it definitely still usable and occasionally used.

 

[me123]

That all being well and true, there could well be a business case for closing 12/30 provided the business case stacked up. Realistically, both runways can't really be used simultaneously to their full individual capacity. A new terminal could very easily be of more benefit on the site than its current use at some point in the future, and whilst it could be argued that a single runway limits potential capacity and that a second parallel runway would be a superior solution if it is needed further down the line (of course the Almond gets in the way and adds significant expense, but I'd argue it's possible to build to the North of the river with relatively minimal bulldozing and the provision of a couple of taxiways on bridges).