I was travelling on 220034 (I think) which had an external door Failure in the first class carriage meaning it was locked out of use for safety reasons. However I was on a HST earlier in a day with a door out of use yet that Carriage could still be used. Could anyone enlighten me as too why it couldn't still be used on the voyager especially as the CrossCountry staff were still travelling in it.
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Voyager Door Failure
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dk1
Veteran Member
There would have to be a working door that the other end. Was this the door nearest the driving cab?
dk1
Veteran Member
Think the ruling is that there has to be an adjacent door operating. I know we've taken a 153 out of traffic for that reason but was ok when another unit attached at the failed door end. Same as if there is a power failure in coach B or K on Intercity GA sets they are locked out of use as no passenger vehicle either side.
dk1
Veteran Member
No problem mate. It can be treated differently for many reasons but that's how it's always been explained to me.
From my training back as a guard a few months ago, we were told that if the extreme front or rear door is defective, then the entire coach should be locked out, yet in the MS coach, there needs to be two doors defective on the same side for it to be locked out.
It's all down to whether there is an acceptable passenger egress route in the event of an emergency.
For non-gangwayed stock like voyagers, locking an end door in a driving vehicle out of use means that if some kind of incident blocks the "good" end doors, passengers are effectively trapped between the incident, and a locked door.
On the 16x units, one of the two driving vehicles contains the emergency equipment. If A or D doors are locked out of use, not only is the coach locked out, but the whole unit.
For non-gangwayed stock like voyagers, locking an end door in a driving vehicle out of use means that if some kind of incident blocks the "good" end doors, passengers are effectively trapped between the incident, and a locked door.
On the 16x units, one of the two driving vehicles contains the emergency equipment. If A or D doors are locked out of use, not only is the coach locked out, but the whole unit.
What is the MS coach?
The most basic rule (it is modified for some stock and situations) is that a passenger carrying vehicle must have at least 4 emergency exits.
On a normal coach with 4 doors its simple. If a coach with a gangway has a door locked out then as long as passengers can go via a gangway past the locked door to open doors then its fine.
Coaches only need to be locked out when end doors are locked. So on a unit if the doors nearest the driving cab were locked then there is no emergency exit at that end, coach has to come out of use, same with coaching stock, if the doors nearest the loco or DVT are locked the coach comes out of use.
Although in a recent rule book revision there is a get out of jail free clause about coaches remaining in service with Operations Control permission in certain situations.
On a normal coach with 4 doors its simple. If a coach with a gangway has a door locked out then as long as passengers can go via a gangway past the locked door to open doors then its fine.
Coaches only need to be locked out when end doors are locked. So on a unit if the doors nearest the driving cab were locked then there is no emergency exit at that end, coach has to come out of use, same with coaching stock, if the doors nearest the loco or DVT are locked the coach comes out of use.
Although in a recent rule book revision there is a get out of jail free clause about coaches remaining in service with Operations Control permission in certain situations.
tsr
Established Member
Oh yes indeed - many variants. For example, in some cases, you can have diagonally opposite doors locked OOU, but not both sets of external doors to the same vestibule, or both sets on the same side of the coach.
Something specific to the class that Esurient has been instructed on. It's not as universal as their post would indicate.
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