Delay Repay - Barrier Swallowed My Ticket

[duncanp]

I was travelling from Kilmarnock to Glasgow yesterday evening, on a any time single ticket £6.40.

Arrived just after 19:30 to catch the 19:57.

The 19:57 was eventually cancelled because the incoming train from Glasgow developed an engine fault after Barrhead.

The 20:57 was also late because it had to run at caution speed between Auchinleck and Hurlford because of reports of trespassers on the line. It eventually left at 21:10.

Scotrail staff handed out delay repay forms, and according to the blurb I could have claimed a 100% refund as the delay was over an hour.

On arrival at Glasgow Central the barrier swallowed my ticket, and the staff refused to get it back to me, saying that I should have asked to be let through beforehand.

Has anyone else had this happen to them, and did they get anywhere by writing to the TOC subsequently?

It is probably flogging a dead horse to try and get a refund now, but I think the forms for delay repay should alert customers to the possibility that their ticket may be retained by the barrier, and that they should ask to be let through if they need to keep the ticket for a delay/repay claim.

Similarly if a ticket needs to be retained for expenses purposes.

 

[AlterEgo]

Do you have any proof of purchase like an online booking confirmation or receipt?

 

[duncanp]

I do have a booking confirmation.

 

[najaB]

I do have a booking confirmation.

Email them, copying in the booking confirmation.

 

[AlterEgo]

Email them, copying in the booking confirmation.

This.

They should pay out. It's standard practice to.

 

[rebmcr]

The barrier staff's attitude sounds terrible.

 

[najaB]

The barrier staff's attitude sounds terrible.

If the OP had gone up them, ticket in hand to ask to be let through and they had said "No, put in the barrier." then you might have a point. The OP put the ticket (railway property) in the barrier when he shouldn't have. Getting a specific ticket back can be a time consuming process, during which time they aren't able to do their 'real' job.

It sounds unfortunate, but not terrible.

 

[miami]

If the OP had gone up them, ticket in hand to ask to be let through and they had said "No, put in the barrier." then you might have a point. The OP put the ticket (railway property) in the barrier when he shouldn't have. Getting a specific ticket back can be a time consuming process, during which time they aren't able to do their 'real' job.

It sounds unfortunate, but not terrible.

As long as the delay repay does not require the ticket (which is many cases is the only proof of purchase) as evidence for the delay, then that's probably ok.

 

[Senex]

If the OP had gone up them, ticket in hand to ask to be let through and they had said "No, put in the barrier." then you might have a point. The OP put the ticket (railway property) in the barrier when he shouldn't have. Getting a specific ticket back can be a time consuming process, during which time they aren't able to do their 'real' job.

It sounds unfortunate, but not terrible.

How should the OP be expected to know that he should not have put his ticket in the barrier?

 

[najaB]

How should the OP be expected to know that he should not have put his ticket in the barrier?

I'm making no comment on if he should or should not have known. I'm stating why the barrier assistant's behaviour wasn't "terrible".

 

[duncanp]

How should the OP be expected to know that he should not have put his ticket in the barrier?

I think the point is that the average person wouldn't necessarily know in advance whether the barrier is going to retain a ticket.

Nor would they know that they should ask to be let through the barriers manually, without being told in advance.

In fact, when the barrier retained my ticket, I paused for a short while, and one of the barrier staff said in a somewhat patronising fashion "..come on, there is a big gap for you to go through, that's what it's for..." When I said I needed my ticket, he said that I had to wait two minutes, and then proceeded to walk away and ignore me.

The second person I asked said that it was my fault, as I should have been asked to be let through the barriers, and that there was nothing she could do.

Some people in the rail industry seem to have a "can't do" or "the customer is always wrong" attitude.

This contrasts with the member of staff at Kilmarnock station who went out of her way to keep people informed, and went on to hand out delay repay forms without being asked.

 

[JimmyR]

The policy is no ticket no comp. You'll have to email in and explain with your proof of purchase. If you try and claim through Delay Repay they'll just reject it.

 

[gray1404]

Please make a formal complaint about the member of barrier staff member you spoke to. Please give a full description of the staff member in your complaint. A TOC has to let you keep your ticket for the purposes of delay repay. If they are treating you in this way then they will be doing it to other passengers. It is totally rude and wrong and need to be stopped.

 

[najaB]

A TOC has to let you keep your ticket for the purposes of delay repay.

I agree that the TOC has to let you keep your ticket. I'm less convinced that they *must* go fish it out of a barrier after you've put it in.

 

[njr001]

I had a similar problem at Cardiff Central a few months ago,: I wished to retain my ticket to claim on my expenses, the barriers were unmanned so had no option to insert ticket. I then managed to find a member of station staff who was most helpful, unfortunately he couldn't immediately find the ticket, however it offered to let me take all the tickets. That evening I did manage to find my ticket, whilst searching through the tickets I came across one that had been endorsed, requesting that the passenger be allowed to travel on a later train as the booked train was too full to accommodate the passenger and their surfboard.

 

[Hadders]

The policy is no ticket no comp. You'll have to email in and explain with your proof of purchase. If you try and claim through Delay Repay they'll just reject it.

Where is this documented? I've had claims paid in the past without a ticket.

 

[gray1404]

I think for future reference though, if you need to retain your ticket for delay repay/passenger charter claim, best make this known to barrier staff in person. I still accept that it would have been good for them to retrieve the ticket for you. You were not to know that the barrier would retain it.

I second the advise given here that you should send an email to ScotRail customer service claiming for the delay and using your booking confirmation as the proof of travel. Even if you didn't have this (thankfully you do) you could argue that the TOC already has you ticket as their barrier took it off you and their staff refused to give it back.

Good luck and make sure you claim still!

 

[JimmyR]

Where is this documented? I've had claims paid in the past without a ticket.

"You will need to provide your ticket, or a copy of it, with your claim form."

Also I've worked in their Customer Relations department.

 

[bb21]

I think for future reference though, if you need to retain your ticket for delay repay/passenger charter claim, best make this known to barrier staff in person. I still accept that it would have been good for them to retrieve the ticket for you. You were not to know that the barrier would retain it.

Yes.

I second the advise given here that you should send an email to ScotRail customer service claiming for the delay and using your booking confirmation as the proof of travel.

Agreed.

Even if you didn't have this (thankfully you do) you could argue that the TOC already has you ticket as their barrier took it off you and their staff refused to give it back.

Oh, god, please don't.

 

[talldave]

If you're on a delayed service, it's worth taking a pic of your ticket on your phone before disembarking just in case this happens. I also take a pic of the train that includes a platform clock, if at all possible.

 

[headshot119]

I agree that the TOC has to let you keep your ticket. I'm less convinced that they *must* go fish it out of a barrier after you've put it in.

Slightly different circumstance... But if you'll bear with me!

Travelling on the return portion of a Radyr - Wrexham General Off Peak Return, stop short at Cathays, so I could drop off some stuff at home before heading on to Radyr, I'd been delayed an hour by ATW so needed the ticket to put in a claim.

Barrier swallowed the ticket as the staff there refuse to let you through until the ticket has gone through the barrier. (Which I can partially understand). Member of staff then refuses to retrieve the ticket from the barrier as once a ticket is swallowed it's used up apparently.

Sent off a complaint to ATW and I received a refund on my extra Cathays to Radyr single I needed to buy. Assurance that staff would be retrained at Cathays. Assurance that staff should ALWAYS retrieve a ticket that still has validity and that barrier staff across there network should ALWAYS retrieve a ticket if the passenger needs to make a claim.

Food for thought I think, though I accept it's different TOCs involved here.

 

[AnonymousUser1]

I agree that the TOC has to let you keep your ticket. I'm less convinced that they *must* go fish it out of a barrier after you've put it in.

exactly

there is a difference between 'allowing the passenger to retain the ticket ' ( i.e. letting them through a manual gate / using staff id badge to activate the barrier ) and taking the barrier apart and fishing through the retained stubs bin ..

anyone with gate line experience tell us how long it takes to
- block a ticket barrier to allow access to fiddle
-, open the barrier casing
- retrieve the container and replace it
and restart the barrier ?

never mind how long it would take to retreive the correct ticket ...

based on how long it takes to change the roll on reciept printers / label printers it;s going to be a couple of minutes assuming it;s designed to allow this to be done easily ... plus the time to 'close' that line and then reopen it

 

[duncanp]

Whether it is advisable to open the barrier to retrieve a ticket depends on how busy the station is, and how many other barriers there are.

I do accept that it may be necessary for a passenger to wait a few minutes until arrivals from an incoming train have cleared the barrier, but I think it is unacceptable for staff to just say "..tough s**t, you should have asked to be let through.."

in my case it was at Glasgow Central at 10pm on a Sunday, so not exactly the evening rush hour.

Also, the delay repay form, and also the section of the website relating to delay repay, should emphasise the need to retain ticket, and the need to ask to be let through the barriers.

 

[ffm]

If the OP had gone up them, ticket in hand to ask to be let through and they had said "No, put in the barrier." then you might have a point. The OP put the ticket (railway property) in the barrier when he shouldn't have. Getting a specific ticket back can be a time consuming process, during which time they aren't able to do their 'real' job.

It sounds unfortunate, but not terrible.

Why should he not have? That is the required action at the ticket barrier!

 

[AnonymousUser1]

Why should he not have? That is the required action at the ticket barrier!

assuming you don't have a good reason to retain the ticket e.g. expenses / DWP or delay claim ...

 

[najaB]

I had a similar problem at Cardiff Central a few months ago,: I wished to retain my ticket to claim on my expenses, the barriers were unmanned so had no option to insert ticket...

That's interesting as it's my understanding that barriers aren't supposed to be left in operation if there is nobody available to supervise their use - either in person or via a video link. Good that they gave you all the tickets though.

 

[LordCreed]

anyone with gate line experience tell us how long it takes to
- block a ticket barrier to allow access to fiddle
-, open the barrier casing
- retrieve the container and replace it
and restart the barrier ?

To empty a ticket bin is a pretty quick process, maybe 30 seconds to a minute top. It's finding the tickets out of the pile that is the challenge.

 

[DaveNewcastle]

I agree with this advice:

Email them, copying in the booking confirmation.

They should pay out. It's standard practice to.

It's unfortunate that you hadn't known, or remembered, that the barrier would be likely to retain the ticket. But once they've been dropped into the bin it's more than a small inconvenience to take the barrier and member of staff out of action to attempt to recover one!

So, I disagree with this comment:

The barrier staff's attitude sounds terrible.

And I vigourously disagree with this:

Please make a formal complaint about the member of barrier staff member you spoke to. Please give a full description of the staff member in your complaint. . . . . . It is totally rude and wrong and need to be stopped.

I see absolutely no basis, not point in making 'a complaint' about this, and reject the proposition that it is "totally rude and wrong". Requesting compensation with a copy of the booking and a brief explanation that the barrier retained the ticket is all that you should need to do to resolve the situation.

 

[najaB]

in my case it was at Glasgow Central at 10pm on a Sunday, so not exactly the evening rush hour.

If the ticket bins hadn't been emptied in a while there could have been *hundreds* of tickets in there. That's something else to consider.

 

[Bletchleyite]

If the ticket bins hadn't been emptied in a while there could have been *hundreds* of tickets in there. That's something else to consider.

The last three (or so) stay in the mechanism, though, so can be retrieved more easily.

I've had tickets retrieved from barriers before, it is very quick if you ask for it quickly.