Long Term Future of Glasgow Queen St High Level

[clc]

The year is 2045. The final section of Scotland's high speed intercity network has just been completed. Glasgow-Aberdeen/Inverness services now depart from Central and run via the E2G HSR line and Forth Bridge.

All of the local and regional services which used to depart from Queen St High Level were diverted via the north-south cross city tunnel when it opened 10 years ago.

The only trains still calling at Queen St High Level are 1tp2h West Highland Line services.

Plans are being drawn up to convert the train shed to a high end shopping centre.

Is there anything else it could be used for?

 

[najaB]

Meeting/performing space.

 

[route:oxford]

The year is 2045.

Plans are being drawn up to convert the train shed to a high end shopping centre.

Is there anything else it could be used for?

I doubt there will be many large scale shopping centres planned post 2020 never mind 2045.

Indeed, I suspect a considerable amount 20th and 21st century retail developments will be razed by then (if not covered by a form of listing) following the changes to empty buildings rates relief.

The shed roof at Queen Street is gappy. You don't really notice it when it's raining as the droplets are heavy - but when it snows it blows up and between the panes and then falls inside the station. It's quite fun to see it really.

 

[BigCj34]

There made oodles of potential retail spaces in Glasgow, so turning it into even more would be silly. Also Queen St is about to get a makeover. Maybe Central and Queen St would have a linking walkway, with also one to St Enoch from Central. Edinburgh high speed services from Queen St may be improved further, while having electrified services to Aberdeen and Inverness. Hopefully the West Highland line will be faster than driving as well!

 

[me123]

Even if all the predictions come to light, I'd argue that Queen Street will still serve a useful purpose as a rail hub. I'm not convinced that everything's going to go through the tunnel (which would have a finite capacity) and GLQ high level would still be useful for expanding services.

When you think about expanding more local services to the likes of Perth and Dundee to (supplement the HS runs) and considering potential for new routes on the corridor (Kirkintilloch sounds like a good plan to go to the new low level station), then I'm sure there'll be plenty of services that can use both the tunnel and the existing station.

 

[edwin_m]

You could argue that as QS has a two-track throat, all its trains could be handled via a two-track tunnel under the city instead.

However I think there is merit in having some terminating capacity from the north, to handle any imbalance in services, terminate short workings and facilitate recovery if there is a blockage in the tunnel. There are also the West Highland trains which would probably still be diesels and therefore not allowed in the tunnel.

 

[snowball]

The year is 2045. The final section of Scotland's high speed intercity network has just been completed. Glasgow-Aberdeen/Inverness services now depart from Central and run via the E2G HSR line and Forth Bridge.

Would Glasgow-Inverness trains run that way? Sounds a long way round.

 

[Townsend Hook]

There are also the West Highland trains which would probably still be diesels and therefore not allowed in the tunnel.

It would probably be more economical to use bi-mode units than to keep the high level station open just for the West Highland services.

 

[Xenophon PCDGS]

Meeting/performing space.

A good example to cite is what is now termed Manchester Central, that has hosted party conferences and large business exhibitions.

 

[Clansman]

Given your scenario, it would make a great place for the future location of the Transport Museum. But with it being in the centre of Glasgow, you'd be better off using it for more commercial and recreational purposes.

 

[clc]

Would Glasgow-Inverness trains run that way? Sounds a long way round.

Based on previous discussions among knowledgable posters on here a theoretical high speed network could develop as follows:

Phase 1 - Edinburgh-Glasgow HSR.
Phase 2 - new 140mph Inverkeithing-Perth alignment with south eastern Perth bypass across Tay to speed up Aberdeen services.
Phase 3 - E2G HSR linked to Fife line.

With 140mph running for most of the route the Glasgow-Perth journey time for Inverness services could be around 45 minutes.

 

[route:oxford]

Based on previous discussions among knowledgable posters on here a theoretical high speed network could develop as follows:

Phase 1 - Edinburgh-Glasgow HSR.
Phase 2 - new 140mph Inverkeithing-Perth alignment with south eastern Perth bypass across Tay to speed up Aberdeen services.
Phase 3 - E2G HSR linked to Fife line.

With 140mph running for most of the route the Glasgow-Perth journey time for Inverness services could be around 45 minutes.

That's a huge amount of money to spend save 8 minutes on the current fastest journey time of 53 minutes from Glasgow to Perth.

I strongly suspect that electrification to Perth would eat into those 8 minutes - the 170s aren't the most sprightly units out of Queen Street.

 

[gazthomas]

Put a tram between Queen Street and Central

 

[sng7]

That's a huge amount of money to spend save 8 minutes on the current fastest journey time of 53 minutes from Glasgow to Perth.

I strongly suspect that electrification to Perth would eat into those 8 minutes - the 170s aren't the most sprightly units out of Queen Street.

I have done Glasgow to Perth non stop in approaching 45 mins once on the current infrastructure when there has been disruption, so there is no need to spend that money on it......

 

[clc]

That's a huge amount of money to spend save 8 minutes on the current fastest journey time of 53 minutes from Glasgow to Perth.

I strongly suspect that electrification to Perth would eat into those 8 minutes - the 170s aren't the most sprightly units out of Queen Street.

The infrastructure would have wider benefits for the intercity network:

Phase 1 would reduce Glasgow-Edinburgh journey time by 14 minutes (and also release capacity in the Central Belt).

Phase 2 would reduce Edinburgh-Perth/Inverness journey times by 35 minutes and would also reduce Edinburgh-Dundee-Aberdeen journey times.

Phase 3 would reduce Glasgow-Dundee-Aberdeen and Glasgow-Perth-Inverness journey times.

There wouldn't be any disbenefits in respect of Glasgow-Perth-Inverness journey times which I think is what snowball was concerned about and whose comments I was addressing.

 

[Clansman]

I have done Glasgow to Perth non stop in approaching 45 mins once on the current infrastructure when there has been disruption, so there is no need to spend that money on it......

Where's the time being sliced apart from non stop through Stirling?

Faster acceleration, Cumbernauld divert, 103mph on 100mph stretches (drivers are known to tinker over the limits to make up lost time)

 

[james73]

Had the Bruce Report ever been implemented, GQS High Level would've been a bus
station, with the lines routed into Glasgow North, an expanded 16-platform Buchanan
Street station.

http://urbanglasgow.co.uk/about1055.html


James H

 

[anti-pacer]

There won't be any trains then, we'll all have flying cars! ??????

 

[route:oxford]

Had the Bruce Report ever been implemented, GQS High Level would've been a bus
station, with the lines routed into Glasgow North, an expanded 16-platform Buchanan
Street station.

http://urbanglasgow.co.uk/about1055.html


James H

And electrified.