Jeremy Corbyn's Traingate

[Tetchytyke]

given that all the passengers featured bar Corbyn had their faces blurred its unlike they will complain.

They didn't, at least not at first. Virgin screwed up:

http://www.railforums.co.uk/showpost.php?p=2679275&postcount=153

(and it seems the image is still showing on their website...)

 

[TBY-Paul]

Corbyn's campaign manager was on BBC Breakfast this morning and did state that they had a seat reservation but due to a last minute change were unable to travel on the service for which they had reservations.

I wonder, did they cancel the reservations on the service they didn't take? or did they expect people on that service to realise those seats would be free to use?

 

[Andrewlong]

If you go onto Guardian website now, some journalists have taken the 11am train to Newcastle today to 'recreate' said journey and there were seats available.

 

[infobleep]

Sorry if this has already been mentioned but a spokesman has said the Fares are due to the Government and they would love to change them if Government regulations changed?

Is that correct that it's the Government's fact we have the fares that exist. I'm not entirely convinced but I don't have enough facts to be certain.

Also I may not think Corbyn is that great as a leader but he claimed they could get two seats together is that likely to be incorrect?

 

[Tetchytyke]

Sorry if this has already been mentioned but a spokesman has said the Fares are due to the Government and they would love to change them if Government regulations changed?

Is that correct that it's the Government's fact we have the fares that exist. I'm not entirely convinced but I don't have enough facts to be certain.

The government regulate certain fares, in this case the Super Off Peak. This means that the advance tickets (which are not regulated) have a natural price cap, because people will buy the walk-up ticket if two advances are more expensive.

What Virgin said was that this regulation affects their ability to regulate crowding. What they are actually trying to say, of course, is that if only the pesky government would let them fleece passengers for more, then overcrowding would reduce. Well, of course it would: charge £1m for a ticket and your train would be empty.

 

[jon0844]

Indeed, and VTEC/VTWC could have made him look like a tit without publishing unredacted CCTV images of their customers. They could even let him open his mouth and he'll do it all by himself. Or if he doesn't, "Doctor" Eoin will do it for him.

So they don't even have "making him look like a tit" as a valid reason for processing the CCTV data [emoji38]

In this time of 'pictures or it didn't happen' I am not sure they could.

 

[thenorthern]

Corbyn's campaign manager was on BBC Breakfast this morning and did state that they had a seat reservation but due to a last minute change were unable to travel on the service for which they had reservations.

Problem is before the 2009 expenses scandal it wasn't uncommon for MPs to just pay full fare for a journey, it wasn't ideal I know but realistically senior MPs need to be places at short notice so it was the best option and then they would claim the money back.

Since 2009 however many MPs have deliberately made lower claims to show that they are a "man of the people" which means in many cases try and claim next to nothing to prove a point.

 

[Taunton]

I still don't get the thing about MPs not travelling in First Class. Long ago I understand one of the aspects of being an MP was you were given a First Class season between London and your constituency because you would be frequently travelling to and fro. The pricing was agreed centrally between the railway and Westminster, it wasn't the full fare season price because they obviously didn't make the return journey every day, just as and when.

The government stipulates in their franchises that significant amounts of First Class is provided on long distance trains. Just who do they think this provision is for? If it is for "business travellers" that I would have thought that senior government members, of whatever party, are in the business of running the whole country, and thus certainly qualify.

 

[coppercapped]

Sorry if this has already been mentioned but a spokesman has said the Fares are due to the Government and they would love to change them if Government regulations changed?

Is that correct that it's the Government's fact we have the fares that exist. I'm not entirely convinced but I don't have enough facts to be certain.

Also I may not think Corbyn is that great as a leader but he claimed they could get two seats together is that likely to be incorrect?

If you want the full story on rail fare price regulation, you can do no better than the document "Regulated fares sn01904" published by the House of Commons Library. It can be found here.

Read and enjoy...

 

[infobleep]

The government regulate certain fares, in this case the Super Off Peak. This means that the advance tickets (which are not regulated) have a natural price cap, because people will buy the walk-up ticket if two advances are more expensive.

What Virgin said was that this regulation affects their ability to regulate crowding. What they are actually trying to say, of course, is that if only the pesky government would let them fleece passengers for more, then overcrowding would reduce. Well, of course it would: charge £1m for a ticket and your train would be empty.

It'd a shame the journalist didn't question Virgin further on that point to find out there views and examples. Might have been interesting.

However in usual journalistic fashion, they got a quote from Virgin [doesn't have to be Virgin in general but in this case is ] and then didn't follow it up.

Sent from my SM-G925F using Tapatalk

 

[thenorthern]

I still don't get the thing about MPs not travelling in First Class. Long ago I understand one of the aspects of being an MP was you were given a First Class season between London and your constituency because you would be frequently travelling to and fro. The pricing was agreed centrally between the railway and Westminster, it wasn't the full fare season price because they obviously didn't make the return journey every day, just as and when.

I think for the junior MPs it was seen as being out of touch given that their salary is only £60,000 per year which would put them as a middle class type of person which aren't normally people who travel First Class.

 

[absolutelymilk]

I have created the Traingate article on Wikipedia, feel free to add your comments on the talk page there.

 

[embers25]

I think that this series of tweets provides a pretty credible timeline of the incident iteslf, w/o judgement as to rights and wrongs of what happened

Actually not credible at all in fact incredibly biased and not what they said initially...it may be what they've backtracked to say since. If Corbyn or his team had said "We just wanted to sit together but there were no seats all together and so we decided to sit in the corridor until someone found some so we could remain together." that would have been fine. The problem is Corbyn didn't, he bitched about the train being "ram-packed" which it clearly wasn't and actually from the cctv there is even a good chance that his entire team of comrades could have got seats in the same unreserved coach but again that wouldn't have fitted his argument. As for Branson going quiet, unlike Corbyn he doesn't need to say anything else as his position is rock solid and everyone not deluded by Corbyn's lies believes him. Even those deluded enough to believe Corbyn mostly aren't disputing Branson's account they are trying to deflect away from it by arguing about the legality of using CCTV. Then to top it off in comes Manuel Cortes from TSSA to put his foot in it still further trying to support his comrade. Sorry but in this case the facts speak for themselves and the public know it and the fact this is now being reported all over the world has made Corbyn a laughing stock world wide but those still stuck in the past continue on blindly believing Corbyn the Redeemer and he keeps on lying more and more.

 

[Johnuk123]

Yesterday : Corbyn spokesman -

"That line about only wanting to sit with his wife is nonsense and not from us."

Today : Corbyn -

"Yes I did look for two empty seats together so I could sit down with my wife to talk to her."

What a bunch of liars, is this the bloke who was supposed to be trustworthy and honest ?

When he was filmed by his groupies lolling about on the floor like a true potential world statesman where was his wife ? if she was seated surely he could have sat on another single seat, well he could of course but his momentum mates traveling with him no doubt advised him not to as that would have defeated the whole object.

 

[Railsigns]

I have created the Traingate article on Wikipedia, feel free to add your comments on the talk page there.

I can see that article falling foul of Wikipedia's "notability" criteria. Nevertheless, you might want to copyedit the phrase: "too many seats on off-peaks trains (making them inefficient) rather than too many."

 

[absolutelymilk]

I can see that article falling foul of Wikipedia's "notability" criteria.

Similar articles exist for Piggate https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Piggate and the Miliband bacon sandwich https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ed_Miliband_bacon_sandwich_photograph

Nevertheless, you might want to copyedit the phrase: "too many seats on off-peaks trains (making them inefficient) rather than too many."

Thanks, corrected

 

[embers25]

From http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-37173048 go to end of the first minute of the radio clip (second one down) and even his supporters have gotten U-turning in a matter of seconds down to a fine art!!! Actually 3rd clip around 1 minute is even better where his campaign manager says all seats were reserved with bags and then that Jeremy was carrying 2 cups of coffee (not visible in the cctv) and bizarrely he wanted a seat to "get his head down before that event" as "he'd had quite a long day".....Three things there...firstly that 11am is considered a long day, secondly who drink coffee before sleep and thirdly Corbyn contradicts this version as he said he wanted to sit down and talk with his wife to prepare for the event....even his own team can't agree!!! Ohh even better is a little later in the campaign manager snippet is when he said he couldn't even see 1 seat together....sigh

 

[bnm]

They didn't film anyone on the train?

I'm aware of a video that "Doctor" Eoin Clarke posted on Twitter. I hope they throw the book at that asshat too.

That being part of the video recorded by Yannis Mendez who was in Corbyn's entourage. Video that has been published online. Presumably these asshats, and all the asshats who've republished, also have to have the book thrown at them?

That surely also applies to the asshats on this forum who've republished the unredacted Virgin stills, no?

The reality is no-one will have any book thrown at them. No laws have been broken. Stern words at best from the ICO for not following guidance.

 

[highdyke]

Corbyn losing the plot under pressure. Turns out the person that made the Branson benefiting from tax payers claim was from the rail union TSSA.

 

[Steveman]

If this stunt had been done by Farage then all the Corbyn lovers on here would be absolutely hammering him unmercifully but as it's Corbyn it's all made up and a media vendetta.

 

[EM2]

The video shown shows just the same number of empty seats (its the same video from where the stills were taken!).

Again, there is no proof that the seats were empty.

 

[313103]

If this stunt had been done by Farage then all the Corbyn lovers on here would be absolutely hammering him unmercifully but as it's Corbyn it's all made up and a media vendetta.

You havent read this forum then, or read the daily papers, or watch tv then. You must live a sheltered life, if you think Corbyn doesn't get vilified for everything he does. He gets far more then Farage does/did.

Sadly you bang on about Corbyn lovers hammering Farage, there seems plenty of Smith, May, Farage etc etc banging on about Corbyn. Two wrongs dont make a right.

 

[Taunton]

I think for the junior MPs it was seen as being out of touch given that their salary is only £60,000 per year which would put them as a middle class type of person which aren't normally people who travel First Class.

Yes, but this isn't a junior MP, it the Official Leader of Her Majesty's Opposition. Which however much you disagree with his politics (or not) is a significant position. He speaks with the Prime Minister multiple times a day. He gets an official government car with driver (Harold Wilson brought that in for the opposition leader). He has a whole country to cover (as he was doing here). It's not being on the Gravy Train to make reasonable transport available.

So who are the people you "normally" expect to find in First? Is everyone who rides in First on the ECML "out of touch"? My experience of flying by plane when the airline head happens to be aboard (it happened with both Walsh on British Airways and Stelios with Easyjet) is they may get sat at the front row with myriad quantities of work in briefcases, but also spend half the flight working back through all the passengers and staff, shaking hands, chatting, listening. That's not "out of touch".

 

[Steveman]

You havent read this forum then, or read the daily papers, or watch tv then. You must live a sheltered life, if you think Corbyn doesn't get vilified for everything he does. He gets far more then Farage does/did.

Sadly you bang on about Corbyn lovers hammering Farage, there seems plenty of Smith, May, Farage etc etc banging on about Corbyn. Two wrongs dont make a right.

Corbyn hasn't even come remotely close to the vilifying Farage has had for many many years.

 

[embers25]

Again, there is no proof that the seats were empty.

You're right we're all seeing things and 20 or so people could have all "gone to the toilet" or "reserved" them with their bags!!! Did Corbyn ask any of these mysterious people...No! The point about whether the seats are empty or not is actually academic as the trian clearly isn't "ram packed" and actually even if it was now that has also become academic as the bigger issue now is that Corbyn and his team, even after a whole day trying, still can't agree on a story and continue to lie and make up things to try to justify his actions. As PM he will be required to examine all available evidence thoroughly before responding to things...did he here? Not he did not, he responded claiming he was suffering due to the overcrowding without checking if the seats were empty and without checking his facts and his team, supporters and campaign manager have all done the same since and thus have all proven how unfit him and his comrades are to run a country.

 

[Steveman]

You're right we're all seeing things and 20 or so people could have all "gone to the toilet" or "reserved" them with their bags!!! Did Corbyn ask any of these mysterious people...No! The point about whether the seats are empty or not is actually academic as the trian clearly isn't "ram packed" and actually even if it was now that has also become academic as the bigger issue now is that Corbyn and his team, even after a whole day trying, still can't agree on a story and continue to lie and make up things to try to justify his actions. As PM he will be required to examine all available evidence thoroughly before responding to things...did he here? Not he did not, he responded claiming he was suffering due to the overcrowding without checking if the seats were empty and without checking his facts and his team, supporters and campaign manager have all done the same since and thus have all proven how unfit him and his comrades are to run a country.

They have had people on the radio today who were on the train in question who have said there were empty seats all over the train but no doubt they were lying and weren't real and part of the massive media witch-hunt.

 

[313103]

Corbyn hasn't even come remotely close to the vilifying Farage has had for many many years.

Well you and others are helping make that happen!

I think you will find that Corbyn has had more years of being vilified then Farage. Corbyn has been in politics for over 30 years, Farage the best part of 10.

 

[Tetchytyke]

Corbyn hasn't even come remotely close to the vilifying Farage has had for many many years.

Corbyn and Farage are very similar in terms of how, er, dedicated their supporters are. Corbyn can do something as idiotic as support the IRA and his supporters will deny it ever happened; Farage can Heil Hitler his way through school and his supports will deny it ever happened.

Farage, who was seemingly on Question Time every sodding week, had a very easy time of the press. Especially considering his past.

 

[highdyke]

Corbyn can't handle the media that's the problem.

He makes a perfectly valid point about overcrowded trains, except he picks one that there were spare seats AND he was offered a first class upgrade. Then goes to rub Virgin's nose in it. They have one of the best PR machines in the world, Corbyn stood no chance.

http://www.prweek.com/article/14067...teur-virgin-first-class-say-pr-professionals?

And in this modern media driven world, that's why Corbyn is doomed. He appeals to people like him, nobody else.

 

[backontrack]

Since when was Jeremy Corbyn a racist, islamophobic psycho who clearly wants to start a nuclear war with other countries? And since when were his supporters idiots who can't think for themselves?

I think he was talking about how Jeremy C. represents change, similar to Donald Trump.

I was indeed. In fact, I didn't mention their political views once.