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Railways under Theresa May administration

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LNW-GW Joint

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I found the following speech made by Grayling in 2007. Much of it could still apply today, and what does not has more or less happened already.
Chris Grayling: A new approach to Britain's Railways
http://conservative-speeches.sayit.mysociety.org/speech/599877

That was when he was in opposition.
We need to minimise political interference in the day to day workings of the railway, and to let our rail professionals get on with the job
Not sure that turned out too well (electrification delays etc).
It also mentions Merseyrail could save £30m over Network Rail's costs if they had control of their network, only for them to turn and flee when they realised the true costs.

But it does show he is at least familiar with the brief.
 
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Philip Phlopp

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Not sure that turned out too well (electrification delays etc).

Political interference is the reason electrification is delayed - successive transport secretaries stopped preparations being made for electrification - if various departments had been allowed a tiny little bit of extra time and money, a lot of the trouble we see today could have been avoided.

Reversing a policy of 20 years standing was always going to be difficult, we just didn't know how difficult until we got stuck in.
 

Mikey C

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BIG decisions like HS2 (or the new runway) aren't decided by the Secretary of State anyway, as they're far too important, and electorally sensitive; it's be Theresa May who'll decide on such things.

After all the Northern Powerhouse and HS3 was George Osborne's baby, not Patrick McLoughlin's
 

Peter Mugridge

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Chris Grayling was an excellent Shadow Transport Secretary and someone who really understood the brief back then, defending the railways against the attacks they suffered under the Labour Government. The days since 2010 must stand to be the best for the railways in modern history as far as national and local politics have stood, and I have no doubt things will improve even further under Grayling.

He also does know a thing or two about railways; he even had a book on the subject published once although i don't have a copy of it. Must remedy that...
 
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Interesting response from Philip Hammond on the Nothern Powerhouse

CnWFVkxWgAARlhF.jpg:large
 
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Philip Phlopp

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Interesting response from Philip Hammond on the Nothern Powerhouse


1


http://twitter.com/edcox_ippr/status/753655127555309568/photo/1

The LBC Interview with Nick Ferrari ? (If the attribution isn't right, could a moderator fix it. It's a radio interview, text from http://www.itv.com/news/tyne-tees/update/2016-07-14/what-happens-now-to-the-northern-powerhouse/).

Philip Hammond: I think that it's been clear and obvious for many years that if Britain is going to be a sustainably prosperous country we have to spread the prosperity across the nation. We can't just have it clustered in the southeast of England, and the investment particularly in transport infrastructure to allow the potential of our northern cities in particular to be realized is a crucial contribution to the overall prosperity of the economy going forward, and I believe that those big transport infrastructure projects are going to be key to Britain's future.

That ties in with what a couple of experts were saying on Newsnight - infrastructure is a problem and will need some serious expenditure to fix, not just the Northern Powerhouse, but around Sheffield too. I'd guess HS2 will be going ahead, though maybe with further alterations (particularly in light of the comments about Sheffield which are interesting in light of the changes to the route around Sheffield).
 

CdBrux

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That ties in with what a couple of experts were saying on Newsnight - infrastructure is a problem and will need some serious expenditure to fix, not just the Northern Powerhouse, but around Sheffield too. I'd guess HS2 will be going ahead, though maybe with further alterations (particularly in light of the comments about Sheffield which are interesting in light of the changes to the route around Sheffield).


I think the citizens of the Sheffied city region would view themselves as a part of the Northern powerhouse!
For those of us who didn't see newsnight (and can't watch on iplayer as living outside the UK) what was mentioned relative to Sheffield? Electrification to / through Rotherham & Barnsley to allow HS2 and eventually NPR trains through there?
 

HH

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I'm pretty sure it won't be just Theresa May who decide on such things, but rather it will be a Cabinet decision.

Officially that's the position. Under Cameron most decisions were made by a small coterie and then "rubber stamped" by the full cabinet. May may be different... :D
 

AM9

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Technically at Redhill our 12 Coach Class 377's with 752 (roughly) seats are being replaced by Class 700's with just 666 seats. That is less to me

So how many seats will be provided in the proposed timetables when the full fleet is rolled out, through the peak hour(s)? That's all that matters, not how many each train carries.
 

Philip Phlopp

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I think the citizens of the Sheffied city region would view themselves as a part of the Northern powerhouse!
For those of us who didn't see newsnight (and can't watch on iplayer as living outside the UK) what was mentioned relative to Sheffield? Electrification to / through Rotherham & Barnsley to allow HS2 and eventually NPR trains through there?

Paraphrasing (from watching Newsnight on iPlayer) for you.

The expert I was most interested in was Rain Newton-Smith, Director of Economics at the CBI, who was talking about

Building more connections between Sheffield, Manchester and Leeds, she was also taking about further south, in the Midlands, where there needs to be better connections between Nottingham and Leicester, as an example.

There should be a focus on transport infrastructure between some of the UK's biggest cities.

Martin Wolf from the FT was more general but making the same sort of points about spending, the failure to do more to spread growth and whether the geography of the economy will be more balanced by Brexit as a result of London's economy shrinking.

The general consensus was Northern Powerhouse was a start, there's still lots more to be done, and there's still Midlands Powerhouse to begin to think about. East West Rail is the sort of thing people might want to mention, but then remember it's linking Oxford and Cambridge and despite being an excellent example of (re)joining two UK cities, it falls down because it's seen as something for the south, for the wealthy, for an elite despite being anything but.
 
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YorkshireBear

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Paraphrasing (from watching Newsnight on iPlayer) for you.

The expert I was most interested in was Rain Newton-Smith, Director of Economics at the CBI, who was talking about

Building more connections between Sheffield, Manchester and Leeds, she was also taking about further south, in the Midlands, where there needs to be better connections between Nottingham and Leicester, as an example.

There should be a focus on transport infrastructure between some of the UK's biggest cities.

Martin Wolf from the FT was more general but making the same sort of points about spending, the failure to do more to spread growth and whether the geography of the economy will be more balanced by Brexit as a result of London's economy shrinking.

The general consensus was Northern Powerhouse was a start, there's still lots more to be done, and there's still Midlands Powerhouse to begin to think about. East West Rail is the sort of thing people might want to mention, but then remember it's linking Oxford and Cambridge and despite being an excellent example of (re)joining two UK cities, it falls down because it's seen as something for the south, for the wealthy, for an elite despite being anything but.

I think it can almost be summarised as East West links from Oxford North!

The following links IMHO need an upgrade of stock and the route.
1. Lincoln to Derby/Leicester. Including grade separation at Newark.
2. Doncaster to Manchester Via Sheffield.
3. Core TPE but including the Hull branch and Middlesborough in particular.

These three would make a huge difference for me. I am positive there are more ideas but i think East West is the key to all these power house ideas.
 

CdBrux

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Paraphrasing (from watching Newsnight on iPlayer) for you.

The expert I was most interested in was Rain Newton-Smith, Director of Economics at the CBI, who was talking about

Building more connections between Sheffield, Manchester and Leeds, she was also taking about further south, in the Midlands, where there needs to be better connections between Nottingham and Leicester, as an example.

There should be a focus on transport infrastructure between some of the UK's biggest cities.

Martin Wolf from the FT was more general but making the same sort of points about spending, the failure to do more to spread growth and whether the geography of the economy will be more balanced by Brexit as a result of London's economy shrinking.

The general consensus was Northern Powerhouse was a start, there's still lots more to be done, and there's still Midlands Powerhouse to begin to think about. East West Rail is the sort of thing people might want to mention, but then remember it's linking Oxford and Cambridge and despite being an excellent example of (re)joining two UK cities, it falls down because it's seen as something for the south, for the wealthy, for an elite despite being anything but.


Thanks for that, much appreciated. I would tend to agree with the thinking you have summarized here and I hope East West is firmly kept on the board plus extending thinking to the south west as well, although probably on a smaller scale there. What I think is also important, and less talked about, is connections within the cities themselves. I have been living in Munich for the last 7 months, it is way ahead of any non London UK city in transport provision (and that includes roads). For sure it will take a long time to catch up, but it must also be in the aims.
 

ChiefPlanner

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Thanks for that, much appreciated. I would tend to agree with the thinking you have summarized here and I hope East West is firmly kept on the board plus extending thinking to the south west as well, although probably on a smaller scale there. What I think is also important, and less talked about, is connections within the cities themselves. I have been living in Munich for the last 7 months, it is way ahead of any non London UK city in transport provision (and that includes roads). For sure it will take a long time to catch up, but it must also be in the aims.

Have a look at Vienna - excellent metro and a very comprehensive tram / bus system - 24 hour ticket for all modes a mere 7 euros.

Excellent local S-Bahn services , a spendidly rebuilt HBF (with features platforms long enough to stack 2 Inter City trains together) - an Airport service which charges 12 euros single ticket.

A city with a very visible railfreight service - with several large (and seemingly very busy) terminals in the city area.

So where do we go next ?
 

philjo

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The BBC have reported that Claire Perry has resigned

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-36805973

The government's rail minister has resigned - just after telling MPs she did not believe quitting would help resolve problems with train services in London and south-east England.

The Department for Transport confirmed Claire Perry had quit, but did not give reasons for her departure.

On Wednesday she said the chaos on Southern routes "feels like a failure".

There has been mounting anger from commuters after repeated cancellations and late-running services.

Passengers have held protests with services hit by industrial action and high levels of staff sickness, while the company has attempted to ease the problem by cutting 341 trains a day.

London Mayor Sadiq Khan is among those calling for the government to strip Govia Thameslink Railway (GTR), which includes Southern, of its franchise.

MPs grilled Ms Perry on the issue during a Westminster Hall debate on Wednesday afternoon.

She said: "At the moment I do not have the levers to pull to take the franchise back.

"So what are we going to do? If I thought it would help by me falling on my sword, I would.

"I've thought about it repeatedly. I don't like failure, I don't fail at stuff in my life, this feels like a failure."

It is not yet known who will replace Ms Perry, with new Prime Minister Theresa May currently in the process of appointing her new government.

Former Commons leader Chris Grayling was appointed transport secretary on Thursday, replacing Patrick McLoughlin, who becomes the Conservative Party's chairman/
 

LNW-GW Joint

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The BBC have reported that Claire Perry has resigned
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-36805973

So the RMT have claimed a scalp. Looks like Claire walked before being pushed.
I'm not sure what she meant by "not having the levers" to terminate the franchise.
Maybe the cancellations are covered by the commercial terms of the agreement, rather than viewed as a breach of contract.
An immediate hot potato for Chris Grayling.
 

EAD

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So the RMT have claimed a scalp. Looks like Claire walked before being pushed.
I'm not sure what she meant by "not having the levers" to terminate the franchise.
Maybe the cancellations are covered by the commercial terms of the agreement, rather than viewed as a breach of contract.
An immediate hot potato for Chris Grayling.

Interesting - I feel sorry for her as she has been all over the media and not addressed the elephants in the room, the fact that DfT gave GTR a management contract and the desire of DfT to put expanded DOO in place during this contract. I wondered if she was being obtuse/avoiding the obvious self-made issue for DfT , but now with hindsight I suspect she was told to stick to the line she trotted out time and time again.

I have not seen the agreement, but as they are being paid to run a service as under concessions rather than franchises and revenue goes to the government as I understand it, GTR must have a fair amount leeway in there as evidenced by the recast timetable. Presumably the logic is that GTR will have to put through the expansion of DOO and they knew there would "issues" as a result so DfT cut some slack for that. Meanwhile of course DfT stands back and talks publicly as if this is a normal franchise, but they won't take it away etc. This conveniently ignores the fact it is not a normal franchise and the terms no doubt mean something pretty severe has to happen to strip it.

BTW I am not taking a position re DOO Or GTR here, neither am I entertaining a debate on those, there are enough threads on that :)
 

dk1

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So the RMT have claimed a scalp. Looks like Claire walked before being pushed.
I'm not sure what she meant by "not having the levers" to terminate the franchise.
Maybe the cancellations are covered by the commercial terms of the agreement, rather than viewed as a breach of contract.
An immediate hot potato for Chris Grayling.

You couldn't make it up. Have to laugh. Obviously couldn't stand the heat.
 

yorksrob

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Airtrack was a walking corpse from the day the daft thing was first thought of - there were simply too many level crossings for it ever to be viable.

The proper scheme is North Downs Line electrification + Western Rail Access to Heathrow (WRATH).

I think it can almost be summarised as East West links from Oxford North!

The following links IMHO need an upgrade of stock and the route.
1. Lincoln to Derby/Leicester. Including grade separation at Newark.
2. Doncaster to Manchester Via Sheffield.
3. Core TPE but including the Hull branch and Middlesborough in particular.

These three would make a huge difference for me. I am positive there are more ideas but i think East West is the key to all these power house ideas.


Whilst we're on it, how about the East Midlands such as Derby and Nottingham to the North West and Manchester.

Infact, there is already an available route via Bakewell.
 

g22

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Whilst we're on it, how about the East Midlands such as Derby and Nottingham to the North West and Manchester.

Infact, there is already an available route via Bakewell.

Derby, Nottingham and Leicester to the North West.
 

yorksrob

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Where will the Rail Ministry feature in the "pecking order" of this new Govermnent strategy?

Who can tell.

It's certainly a shame to lose Patrick McLaughlin, who I suspect has a genuine interest in the railway, having been in the department of transport during the Major era and served in the department longer than usual currently.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---
Derby, Nottingham and Leicester to the North West.

Yes of course, Leicester !
 
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ChrisHogan

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So the RMT have claimed a scalp. Looks like Claire walked before being pushed.
I'm not sure what she meant by "not having the levers" to terminate the franchise.
Maybe the cancellations are covered by the commercial terms of the agreement, rather than viewed as a breach of contract.
An immediate hot potato for Chris Grayling.

Good; her posturing about the Southern problems really annoyed me. We know that the DOO dispute is essentially between DfT and RMT. I guess she was told by the new SoS that she wouldn't keep her job. Grayling is MP for Epsom so may well take a completely different stance although all Southern's services through Epsom are already DOO.

I imagine the option of DOR running the franchise was considered politically unacceptable.
 

6Gman

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Where will the Rail Ministry feature in the "pecking order" of this new Govermnent strategy?

Just below Larry the cat I suspect and fear.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---
Whilst we're on it, how about the East Midlands such as Derby and Nottingham to the North West and Manchester.

Infact, there is already an available route via Bakewell.

A serious, serious upgrade of Derby - Stoke would help.
 
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