Explosions in Brussels

[TheKnightWho]

I wasn't making a point, I was asking questions:

However, when [Salah Abdeslam] says that the Koran says that Allah will reward those who kill the infidel, is he lying?

How can you know for sure he's lying without ever having read the Koran?

Care to answer either question?

If you bothered to actually read my post, I said I had read it. It's almost like you have but a single point, and aren't actually reading other posts.

 

[deltic]

Fred Phelps does not speak for all Christians. However, when he says that the bible says that God hates fags he isn't just pulling it out of his @rse - the bible clearly does say that (although it doesn't use those exact words)

Salah Abdeslam does not speak for all Muslims. However, when he says that the Koran says that Allah will reward those who kill the infidel, is he lying? How can you know for sure he's lying without ever having read the Koran?

As there is no mention of cigarettes in the bible we have no idea whether God hates smoking.

With regard to homosexuality the bible clearly does not say God hates homosexuals - I found only one reference in the bible to God hating anyone and they were not gay.

 

[Gutfright]

If you bothered to actually read my post, I said I had read it. It's almost like you have but a single point, and aren't actually reading other posts.

It is almost like that. Almost.

I should apologise for a bit of a mix-up on my part. I responded to your previous post by answering a question you hadn't asked. So I am sorry for any confusion that caused.

So why did I write "As the Koran was not written in the 21st century, it could be argued that the ultra-conservative 7th century interpretation is likely to be correct."? Well, it was a response to Paul Sidorczuk. If you don't wish to read back through the thread, our conversation went a bit like this...

PS: Some Imams think suicide bombing goes against all Muslim ethics
G: Some Muslims think exactly the opposite
PS: Some Muslims favour a traditional ultra-conservative Wahaabist school of thought, some favour a more 21st century interpretation.

So I guess the point I wanted to make is that it is incorrect to suggest that the type of violence we saw today goes against all Muslim ethics. It may certainly go against some of the more modern schools of thought, but violence is not somehow intrinsically un-Islamic. It is dishonest to suggest otherwise.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

With regard to homosexuality the bible clearly does not say God hates homosexuals - I found only one reference in the bible to God hating anyone and they were not gay.

God calls for the death penalty for gay sex because He loves homosexuals?

 

[deltic]

It is almost like that. Almost.

I should apologise for a bit of a mix-up on my part. I responded to your previous post by answering a question you hadn't asked. So I am sorry for any confusion that caused.

So why did I write "As the Koran was not written in the 21st century, it could be argued that the ultra-conservative 7th century interpretation is likely to be correct."? Well, it was a response to Paul Sidorczuk. If you don't wish to read back through the thread, our conversation went a bit like this...

PS: Some Imams think suicide bombing goes against all Muslim ethics
G: Some Muslims think exactly the opposite
PS: Some Muslims favour a traditional ultra-conservative Wahaabist school of thought, some favour a more 21st century interpretation.

So I guess the point I wanted to make is that it is incorrect to suggest that the type of violence we saw today goes against all Muslim ethics. It may certainly go against some of the more modern schools of thought, but violence is not somehow intrinsically un-Islamic. It is dishonest to suggest otherwise.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---


God calls for the death penalty for gay sex because He loves homosexuals?

looking at the wrong section of Leviticus - one section just says you are unclean the other is as you say. Theology was never my strong point

 

[WestRiding]

Bloody religion. The cause of most of the worlds problems. My god is better than your god etc etc. We can put man in space, and people still believe in a man floating around on a cloud.

 

[Bletchleyite]

If you bothered to actually read my post, I said I had read it. It's almost like you have but a single point, and aren't actually reading other posts.

FWIW I've read an English translation of it, and it didn't explicitly say what some are misusing it to say. The problem is that it is an English translation, I can't read Arabic so I can't claim to say whether that is actually right or not - like the Bible much may come down to the opinions of the translator.

 

[Xenophon PCDGS]

Bloody religion. The cause of most of the worlds problems. My god is better than your god etc etc. We can put man in space, and people still believe in a man floating around on a cloud.

Unfortunately, we are currently at risk from those who take a somewhat opposite view to yours and they would have no mercy whatsoever on anyone in their controlled territory espousing such views.

 

[WestRiding]

Unfortunately, we are currently at risk from those who take a somewhat opposite view to yours and they would have no mercy whatsoever on anyone in their controlled territory espousing such views.

Well one thing is for sure, its impossible to stop now. Only when Europe has become an Islamic Republic will it stop. Then again, they can't even stand their own kind.....

 

[Busaholic]

To return to the original subject (!!) it certainly now appears that these murderous explosions were very much linked to events of the past couple of weeks in that area of Brussels occupied by many Muslims, and it may even have been the same cell as the Paris bombers or one known to them. Belgium has probably been targeted because their authorities are hopelessly disorganised, with one half not only not knowing what the other half is doing, but having little or no communication with that other half. When I say half, it would probably be more accurate to say one eighth, none of which is properly staffed or resourced. Of course, Belgium is a country that 'managed' without a government for months on end not so long ago and no doubt was earmarked by ISIS and its predecessors years ago as being a soft target.

As I am writing this, two and a bit days after the atrocities, I am hearing on the radio that the families of people missing are being denied access to hospitals to try and locate their loved ones, even children, apparently four of whom are lying in hospital unidentified. The federal government has issued this edict which is being much criticised in Belgium.

 

[miami]

Well one thing is for sure, its impossible to stop now. Only when Europe has become an Islamic Republic will it stop. Then again, they can't even stand their own kind.....

I see, that probably explains why places like Syria and Iraq and such havens of peace and tranquility.

Either that, or a tiny minority of criminals are trying to force a war between 1.6 billion muslims and 6 billion non-muslims, and (within 0.001%) 1.6 billion muslims and 6 billion just aren't interested.

There are plenty who said that the only way it would stop was when Ireland was reunified. Fortunately people like Colin Parry exist.

 

[Xenophon PCDGS]

I see, that probably explains why places like Syria and Iraq and such havens of peace and tranquility. Either that, or a tiny minority of criminals are trying to force a war between 1.6 billion muslims and 6 billion non-muslims, and (within 0.001%) 1.6 billion muslims and 6 billion just aren't interested.

What I see as worrying is the very large number of countries with sizable Muslim populations, such as the countries in South Caucasus who have found that large numbers of radicalised members of the Islamic faith have departed from their country and flocked to the territories occupied by ISIL. It is not as you say, just a tiny minority of criminals.

 

[miami]

Most estimates put the number of people fighitng for isis at arround 20,000. Most of those are young men unable to flee syria, but lets assume it's actually far higher, 100,000, and they all believe in the cause.

That puts it as a total of 0.006% of the global Muslim population.

It is not as you say, just a tiny minority of criminals.

Depends on your definition of criminal, but given that 68 million Americans have criminal records, American criminals alone outnumber ISIS fighters by 1000:1, still a tiny minority.

 

[GatwickDepress]

Bloody religion. The cause of most of the worlds problems. My god is better than your god etc etc. We can put man in space, and people still believe in a man floating around on a cloud.

If religion ceased to exist at midnight, nothing would ultimately change. You can put three people in a room and you'll get six opinions. Human nature is such that conflict will inevitably occur.

FWIW I've read an English translation of it, and it didn't explicitly say what some are misusing it to say. The problem is that it is an English translation, I can't read Arabic so I can't claim to say whether that is actually right or not - like the Bible much may come down to the opinions of the translator.

I've read the Qur'an in Arabic, but the issue is being a native English speaker, it's hard not to think in English!

As a Muslim, I obviously don't eat pork myself but when I'm on checkouts, I'm selling it. One school of thought is that it's haraam to sell it at all; whether to a Muslim or a kaffir. The more common interpretation here is that it's not haraam to sell if you aren't receiving money directly from the sale. So much relies on interpretation.