Future of Virgin Train East Coast HSTs

[Trainfan344]

Sorry if this has already been covered elsewhere.

What will happen to the HST's once Virgin Trains East Coast has finished with theirs? will they be sent to Cross Country or sent to Scotland?

 

[Iskra]

Scrapped, I should imagine.

Or maybe they could have an 88 at one end and a HST powercar...

 

[randyrippley]

by the time they are withdrawn, the class 37 and MkII sets on the Cumbrian coast lines will need replacing

opens up all kind of possibilities of fast trains to Manchester, or if the link at Carnforth was reinstated, fast trains to Leeds. They'd be great on the Settle-Carlisle as well............

 

[Iskra]

Maybe they could run XC services to Brighton...

 

[CosherB]

Please, no more daft LHCS and replacement DMU solutions. Documented and debunked elsewhere on here to death ....

 

[Iskra]

Please, no more daft LHCS and replacement DMU solutions. Documented and debunked elsewhere on here to death ....

I was joking.

 

[CosherB]

I was joking.

I knew you were, plenty on here however aren't joking! lol

 

[randyrippley]

I was joking.

shush....the grownups don't like it when you joke

 

[The Ham]

Sorry if this has already been covered elsewhere.

What will happen to the HST's once Virgin Trains East Coast has finished with theirs? will they be sent to Cross Country or sent to Scotland?

In theory they could go to XC, but that just makes it harder to get replacements for them for after the start of the next franchise (assuming that XC has an extension to early 2019) or they will need a lot of money spent on them to make them DDA complaint.

 

[Clansman]

In theory they could go to XC, but that just makes it harder to get replacements for them for after the start of the next franchise (assuming that XC has an extension to early 2019) or they will need a lot of money spent on them to make them DDA complaint.

I would like to see them being retained by their leasing company (Angel Trains?)
knowing a few TOCs might want to introduce better services for their routes as well as increase capacity. Scotrail and XC come to mind as well as an open access TOC for future uses. As for TPE and Northern, I guess the HST wouldn't meet Osbornes' "Northern Powerhouse" plans the way he's going with it, and not to mention a few discussions on this forum which have hung, drawn and quartered the debate all together :roll:

 

[route:oxford]

In theory they could go to XC, but that just makes it harder to get replacements for them for after the start of the next franchise (assuming that XC has an extension to early 2019) or they will need a lot of money spent on them to make them DDA complaint.

Upgrade them to Chiltern standard, paint them in a similar style to the Scotrail livery albeit with a Union Flag. Call them "Union Rail" then operate them as a seasonal extension of the XC franchise part funded by the airline "departure tax".

Prime, Standard and "Backpackers" class with a particular focus on tourist trade and the roaming pensioner.

I'm sure other correspondents on here could come up with a few suggested routes or diagrams. No need for clockface or even daily diagrams...

 

[Iskra]

In theory they could go to XC, but that just makes it harder to get replacements for them for after the start of the next franchise (assuming that XC has an extension to early 2019) or they will need a lot of money spent on them to make them DDA complaint.

XC, Scotrail, Open Access and a few for preservation/railtours seem to be the only sensible future options, but realistically I think the majority will be scrapped as sad as that is.

 

[cactustwirly]

Maybe they could run XC services to Brighton...

Not possible, GWR has all of the SSL HSTs

 

[randyrippley]

how long before they have to go because of the track-discharge toilets? That must put a physical end to their use soon surely?

 

[Clansman]

how long before they have to go because of the track-discharge toilets? That must put a physical end to their use soon surely?

Isn't that problem being alleviated by Chiltern (and eventually Scotrail) when they overhaul(ed) the mk3s for their franchises?
That's probably the only way they will survive, but I could see a few mk3s being used in the future if they are ever refurbished to Chiltern/Scotrail standards as a new brand of coach? MKIII/2 or something along those lines, I don't know? But the power cars themselves will be the first to go...

 

[43096]

Not possible, GWR has all of the SSL HSTs

Really? So how did EMT operate an HST down to the Swanage Railway, then?

 

[Emblematic]

Isn't that problem being alleviated by Chiltern (and eventually Scotrail) when they overhaul(ed) the mk3s for their franchises?
That's probably the only way they will survive, but I could see a few mk3s being used in the future if they are ever refurbished to Chiltern/Scotrail standards as a new brand of coach? MKIII/2 or something along those lines, I don't know? But the power cars themselves will be the first to go...

I somehow doubt that Virgin's power cars will be first in the scrap line, as they are spending millions having all the engines overhauled this year (and painted red.) :roll:
It wouldn't surprise me if these became the bulk of the Scotrail fleet; they made a point that the refurbished engines will be fitted in Scotland.

 

[MCR247]

Scotland is getting GWR HSTs

 

[43096]

Scotland is getting GWR HSTs

More specifically, ScotRail is getting Angel Trains owned vehicles from the GWR fleet.

VTEC sets are out of the equation as they do not come off lease in time to meet the ScotRail timescales.

 

[Emblematic]

More specifically, ScotRail is getting Angel Trains owned vehicles from the GWR fleet.

VTEC sets are out of the equation as they do not come off lease in time to meet the ScotRail timescales.

And the GWR ones will? It wouldn't surprise me in the least if some of the EC sets actually got freed up first.

 

[gsnedders]

Even assuming SR get the GWR sets first, what's the chances the power cars could be switched with the EC ones when they're free, given the motors are presumably in better nick having just had the work done?

 

[Emblematic]

Or possibly just the engines - Craigentinny will have had plenty of practice doing engine exchanges

 

[Lankyline]

And the GWR ones will? It wouldn't surprise me in the least if some of the EC sets actually got freed up first.

From what I've read GWR sets going north are dependent on the GW electrification timetable

 

[RichmondCommu]

Crewe to Derby? By all accounts that route is often over crowded

 

[Emblematic]

From what I've read GWR sets going north are dependent on the GW electrification timetable

On one hand you'll have lease agreements in place that say these units leave GWR in 2017 and go on lease to Abellio, who send them off to be tartaned up. As that would leave GWR in a hole, paid-for electric trains and wires not ready, doubtless there's some serious replanning going on. We hear lots of rumours and a few wild ideas, but no announcement of a workable plan to date.

 

[LNW-GW Joint]

by the time they are withdrawn, the class 37 and MkII sets on the Cumbrian coast lines will need replacing

The Cumbrian coast loco sets won't survive the arrival of the new Northern DMUs, which will free up 15x units for cascade.
There are also incoming DMU cascades from GWR, Scotrail etc..
The 37s will probably be the first to go (closely followed by Pacers).

 

[43074]

On one hand you'll have lease agreements in place that say these units leave GWR in 2017 and go on lease to Abellio, who send them off to be tartaned up. As that would leave GWR in a hole, paid-for electric trains and wires not ready, doubtless there's some serious replanning going on. We hear lots of rumours and a few wild ideas, but no announcement of a workable plan to date.

There's been a suggestion by Tony Miles (of Modern Railways) on the wnxx forum that the DfT have almost signed the paper work to have the '801s' fitted with diesel engines to allow the 27 Abellio HSTs to be released on time. However, because the top speed of an IEP on diesel is 100mph, they're having to re-write the timetable take the slower top speed compared to an HST into account...

 

[HSTEd]

The whole thing is a mess.

But given the enormous increase in services in Scotland that has recently been announced you might find more than 27 HSTs going north once they are otherwise surplus to requirements.

 

[jzw95]

Not possible, GWR has all of the SSL HSTs

What is an SSL HST? Are there different models?

 

[HSTEd]

What is an SSL HST? Are there different models?

SSL [Short Swing Link?] Mark 3 trailers have shortened links in their suspension gear which means the range of travel of the body is reduced.

LSL vehicles can potentially foul the third rail if you aren't careful.