Buying tickets in advance at destination station

[andyj]

Summary: Question about rules and policy regarding where tickets can be bought in advance.

I travel to work by train from Burnage to Wilmslow during peak times. Both stations are managed by Northern Rail, as are all the trains that I travel on.

Queues to buy tickets at Burnage can be very long at peak times, as many people turn up at the last moment and there is only one ticket-office window. So, to ensure that I always have a ticket for my journey, it has been my habit for some time to buy my tickets a week in advance when arriving at Wilmslow. That is, on the last day of the week that I travel, I buy a weeks-worth of tickets for the next week. I'm buying ordinary peak day return tickets, not ones linked to a particular departure time. I buy them at Wilmslow because the queues are shorter and there are always two staffed ticket-office windows.

I've been doing this for some time. Recently, however, the staff at Wilmslow have been refusing to serve me because they say there is a rule that I must buy advance tickets from my start station (Burnage). I've been unable to discover any such rule.

Questions: Does such a rule exist? Am I doing anything wrong or unreasonable by buying the tickets at Wilmslow?

When I (calmly and respectfully) insist that I should be able to buy tickets this way, they tell me that it takes too long to serve me and this can cause other passengers, who need to buy tickets, to miss their trains. I have some sympathy with this, but note that it consistently takes less than a minute (timed using the clock in the ticket office) to complete the transaction (counter staff select and print my tickets, me always paying contactless). This doesn't see excessive to me. I also think that it isn't the job of ticket counter staff to prioritise the order in which people who have queued are served.

Question: Am I being unreasonable here, or are they? I'd be interested in the perspective of railway people on this.

I want to emphasise that I am always calm and respectful in my interactions with the counter staff, despite one of them becoming quite agitated when I tried to make a purchase. I've tried approaching the station management but they seem uninterested in resolving the problem, which has now occurred a number of times.

Thanks in advance for any comments/perspectives.

AndyJ

 

[Bletchleyite]

No, there is no requirement to do this. But have you considered a season ticket?

 

[Haywain]

Questions: Does such a rule exist? Am I doing anything wrong or unreasonable by buying the tickets at Wilmslow?

No, on both counts.

Question: Am I being unreasonable here, or are they? I'd be interested in the perspective of railway people on this.

You are not being unreasonable, they are. If this persists, complain to their employer.

 

[najaB]

I've been doing this for some time. Recently, however, the staff at Wilmslow have been refusing to serve me because they say there is a rule that I must buy advance tickets from my start station (Burnage). I've been unable to discover any such rule.

And you'll be searching for a long time to find it as it doesn't exist. While they do have a point that people buying tickets for future travel can 'block' a window for people buying tickets for immediate travel, there is no rule that prevents you from doing so. And unless you're buying dozens of tickets at a time, it won't take significantly longer to sell your ticket than it does to sell tickets from that station.

 

[gray1404]

The rule is that they are meant to sell whatever ticket the customer asks for. They are totally in the wrong here and I would make a formal complaint about the members of staff concerned to the company who manages the station, taking it to Transport Focus if their response is not up to standard or the problem continues. Did you get the names of the staff members concerned, not essential but useful. The company you need to complain to is Northern Rail.

 

[andyj]

Thanks for the responses from Neil Williams, Haywain, najaB, gray1404!

Neil: I only actually travel three days per week, so a season ticket doesn't make sense for me. I omitted this detail because it didn't seem relevant to my question, but it does mean that the ticket office staff are only printing six tickets at a time, not ten, which makes their behaviour even less explicable...

bajaB: Thanks. Like I said in my question, I have sympathy with frustrations caused by peak-time queues being blocked by people buying large numbers of tickets and/or doing purchases for complex journeys. Good to have your independent opinion that I'm doing neither.

gray1404: Thanks for replying. Yes, I have a log of the last three occasions, including what was said and names. I'm currently trying to find out who in Northern Rail is responsible for the station.

AndyJ

 

[DaleCooper]

Although you have the right to buy your tickets at Wilmslow might it not be simpler to buy them at Burnage in the evening on your return when presumably you'll have more time and it will probably be less busy than in the mornings.

 

[button_boxer]

If the staff continue to be awkward, you can always buy your week's worth of tickets online and collect them from the machine at Wilmslow.

 

[andyj]

DaleCooper: Thanks for replying. Unfortunately, by the time I get back to Burnage (after 6pm) the ticket office there is closed.

button_boxer: Thanks for the suggestion. It had occurred to me, but I work with computers all day and prefer to interact with people when I can. In this case they are trying my resolve a bit, though! I'll keep it in reserve as an option.

 

[hairyhandedfool]

....Questions: Does such a rule exist? Am I doing anything wrong or unreasonable by buying the tickets at Wilmslow?....

They are talking out of their backside.

....When I (calmly and respectfully) insist that I should be able to buy tickets this way, they tell me that it takes too long to serve me and this can cause other passengers, who need to buy tickets, to miss their trains....

They believe themselves to be a cut above the other Northern stations because of where it is and who uses the station, and so their "regulars" are more important to them than anyone else, even if you bring more money in.

....I have some sympathy with this, but note that it consistently takes less than a minute (timed using the clock in the ticket office) to complete the transaction (counter staff select and print my tickets, me always paying contactless). This doesn't see excessive to me. I also think that it isn't the job of ticket counter staff to prioritise the order in which people who have queued are served....

It really doesn't take long. I know staff at Victoria have passengers that come up for a week's tickets at a time during rush hour and they don't hold the queues up at all.

....Question: Am I being unreasonable here, or are they? I'd be interested in the perspective of railway people on this....

No, you are not being unreasonable.

.... I've tried approaching the station management but they seem uninterested in resolving the problem, which has now occurred a number of times.....

That does not surprise me in the slightest.

....If this persists, complain to their employer.

Unfortunately complaining to the employer will only get the Op a letter saying how sorry they are and it's being looked into and here's a voucher for your troubles and NOTHING WILL CHANGE.

The rule is that they are meant to sell whatever ticket the customer asks for....

As a generalisation yes.

....They are totally in the wrong here and I would make a formal complaint about the members of staff concerned to the company who manages the station....

Won't make any difference.

....taking it to Transport Focus if their response is not up to standard or the problem continues....

Won't make any difference.

 

[Haywain]

Won't make any difference.

If it doesn't make a difference that is a damning indictment of Northern's attitude to it's customers. However, complaining stands more chance of making a difference than not complaining.

 

[gray1404]

Why will nothing change though? If staff refuse to do their job correctly despite being correctly, is that when discipline procedure surely would come into place.....just like with any job.

 

[sheff1]

Although you have the right to buy your tickets at Wilmslow might it not be simpler to buy them at Burnage in the evening on your return ...

Rather difficult. Burnage is unstaffed after 1400.


>>>>>

I seem to recall people have previously said that refusing to sell Anytime tickets is a breach of the franchise agreement. However, as Northern are losing the franchise in April I doubt they will care. If the situation remains the same after the new franchise starts that will be the time to begin making waves, although obviously check first that it is, indeed, a breach.

 

[island]

It's this sort of attitude that hastens the arrival of the day most booking offices will be done away with and ticket purchases will be made online or by vending machine.

 

[Bletchleyite]

It's this sort of attitude that hastens the arrival of the day most booking offices will be done away with and ticket purchases will be made online or by vending machine.

Quite. If a booking office will not offer the additional services only a booking office can offer, what's the point of having it? Security staff patrolling platforms would provide more benefit.

 

[miami]

Unfortunately complaining to the employer will only get the Op a letter saying how sorry they are and it's being looked into and here's a voucher for your troubles and NOTHING WILL CHANGE.

Complain every week
Get a voucher every week
Use voucher for a season ticket
Never pay a commuting cost again

 

[Starmill]

I was once refused at Wilmslow ticket office the answer to the question "Can you tell me when the next stopping service to Manchester is please?". My phone was dead and it is not possible to work that out just from looking at the screens. I didn't think it was that difficult to answer but the man just said if you want to go to Manchester there is a train in 3 minutes - of course it was not a stopping train. I therefore had to explain that I already had a GM Rail Ranger and wanted to know when the next stopping train was so I would be able to decide whether to buy a ticket to Cheadle Hulme or Manchester Airport. The reply? "This is Cheshire, you are not using that ticket here. If you want to go to Manchester you buy a ticket to Manchester."

It's not that unusual sadly. The normal bloke at Mauldeth Road is fantastic, friendliest person you could hope to meet. But then a couple of weeks ago I walked into Levenshulme showing my Levenshulme to Huddersfield ticket: "Can I buy a Huddersfield Plusbus please?" "No."

 

[hairyhandedfool]

I was once refused at Wilmslow ticket office the answer to the question "Can you tell me when the next stopping service to Manchester is please?". My phone was dead and it is not possible to work that out just from looking at the screens. I didn't think it was that difficult to answer but the man just said if you want to go to Manchester there is a train in 3 minutes - of course it was not a stopping train. I therefore had to explain that I already had a GM Rail Ranger and wanted to know when the next stopping train was so I would be able to decide whether to buy a ticket to Cheadle Hulme or Manchester Airport. The reply? "This is Cheshire, you are not using that ticket here. If you want to go to Manchester you buy a ticket to Manchester."....

Whilst the actions of the clerk can't be excused, perhaps a simpler way of asking might have been "Can you tell me when the next train to Manchester Airport or Cheadle Hulme is?

 

[Starmill]

Whilst the actions of the clerk can't be excused, perhaps a simpler way of asking might have been "Can you tell me when the next train to Manchester Airport or Cheadle Hulme is?

I think you're right. I did learn something that day about the value of information. Although I wouldn't have been surprised if the reply had been "Well which do you want to go to, Manchester Airport or Cheadle Hulme?".

 

[Ianno87]

If the staff continue to be awkward, you can always buy your week's worth of tickets online and collect them from the machine at Wilmslow.

...and buy them from somebody else's website other than Northern's, so they don't get the 9% (or whatever) commission. Get some Nectar points by buying them from GWR instead!

 

[hairyhandedfool]

I think you're right. I did learn something that day about the value of information. Although I wouldn't have been surprised if the reply had been "Well which do you want to go to, Manchester Airport or Cheadle Hulme?".

The obvious answer is "whichever comes first"