Leeds Station concourse and platform improvements

[yorksrob]

Good grief - even on todays railway that is seriously expensive.

The 2001ish redevelopment only came to £165m and that included months of overnight Transpennine diversions, resignalling, new platforms, the transfer deck, passenger lifts, more running lines and the Eastern concourse.

And a brand new trainshed.

 

[DarloRich]

Good grief - even on todays railway that is seriously expensive.

The 2001ish redevelopment only came to £165m and that included months of overnight Transpennine diversions, resignalling, new platforms, the transfer deck, passenger lifts, more running lines and the Eastern concourse.

have you seen the work they did in the river?

 

[johntea]

Southern entrance seemed to be fairly popular this morning, though I do wish it had a better name than Southern entrance as just as many people were using it as an exit!

Noticed that one of the screens on the fancy ticket barriers had already managed to fail though!

I would have had a look beyond the barriers myself sadly however I had to get to work

 

[Gemz91]

Southern entrance seemed to be fairly popular this morning, though I do wish it had a better name than Southern entrance as just as many people were using it as an exit!

Noticed that one of the screens on the fancy ticket barriers had already managed to fail though!

I would have had a look beyond the barriers myself sadly however I had to get to work

Looking forward to seeing/using it on Sat when Im up for the Leeds game.

 

[Starmill]

I am sire those people using it as an exit will use it as an entrance later!

 

[jayah]

have you seen the work they did in the river?

It can't decide if it is a railway station or the new Guggenheim Museum. Either way an entrance towards Boar Lane / New Station St from the east footbridge would have relieved congestion at the main entrance, improved access for those going south of the station for a fraction of this sum.

I suppose getting the developers of the swanky new offices and flats to pay for their new access wasn't thought of during the planning approvals process either.
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Noticed that one of the screens on the fancy ticket barriers had already managed to fail though!
(

The morning that Platform 16 first opened IIRC, the TRTS indicator in the panelbox failed, delaying the second or third departing train.

Judging by the outside of the Southern Entrance, are these fancy ticket barriers actually more like a private VIP area in a nightclub?

 

[JaJaWa]

Judging by the outside of the Southern Entrance, are these fancy ticket barriers actually more like a private VIP area in a nightclub?

They're sadly just the newest version from the awful supplier that Northern use - S&B.

The Cubic ones used all over London (gates are managed by TfL) and by FirstGroup are much better.

 

[edwin_m]

It can't decide if it is a railway station or the new Guggenheim Museum. Either way an entrance towards Boar Lane / New Station St from the east footbridge would have relieved congestion at the main entrance, improved access for those going south of the station for a fraction of this sum.

I don't see how. There would only be a small distance saving compared with coming out of the main entrance and turn right, and even then only for the minority of passengers who use an eastern platform and know about the eastern footbridge.

To get to the south side up to now, I have had to exit by the same main entrance then descend a flight of pretty unpleasant steps to Neville Street. This then passes under the station by an especially long, gloomy "tunnel" infested with traffic and pigeons and some sort of art installation which appears to consist of little dots of light and (I've never been quite sure if these actually exist) speakers playing sounds similar to traffic and pigeons.

I haven't had to use the new entrance yet but it can hardly be worse than that can it?

 

[jayah]

I don't see how. There would only be a small distance saving compared with coming out of the main entrance and turn right, and even then only for the minority of passengers who use an eastern platform and know about the eastern footbridge.

To get to the south side up to now, I have had to exit by the same main entrance then descend a flight of pretty unpleasant steps to Neville Street. This then passes under the station by an especially long, gloomy "tunnel" infested with traffic and pigeons and some sort of art installation which appears to consist of little dots of light and (I've never been quite sure if these actually exist) speakers playing sounds similar to traffic and pigeons.

I haven't had to use the new entrance yet but it can hardly be worse than that can it?

Many trains use the east platforms, and an entrance would be a good saving compared to walking from an 'east' platform all the way to the congested main barriers and all the way back again on New Station St. There is little point in using the east footbridge currently because it doesn't go to or from an entrance.

Sadly the southern question is academic because the £20m has already been spent. There was absolutely no need for such a ridiculously over engineering 'inconic' design. I would also be interested how many people use the new entrance in peak leisure periods - it is possible that outside office hours it contributes little to curing the dreadful overcrowding around the main gateline.

Agree that Neville St is a disaster area, a throwback to how access towards Aire St used to be before the Eastern Concourse was developed, and long overdue for some improvement.

 

[Oswyntail]

... There was absolutely no need for such a ridiculously over engineering 'inconic' design. ....

Leeds generally is like this - the city fathers seem to prefer eye-grabbing developments like Bridgewater Place and Trinity to practical solutions to the many problems. If someone suggested a popsicle tower they'd leap at it - they now have their escalator to nowhere.

 

[quantinghome]

Many trains use the east platforms, and an entrance would be a good saving compared to walking from an 'east' platform all the way to the congested main barriers and all the way back again on New Station St. There is little point in using the east footbridge currently because it doesn't go to or from an entrance.

You're always going to get this problem at large stations. No entrance location is going to suit everyone. It might benefit some people, but then there's the same issue on the west side with people using the car park. Why not have another entrance there? Ultimately, you've got to draw a line on the number of entrances and decide what the biggest issue is. It's fairly obvious that access to south of the station was the most problematic.

Sadly the southern question is academic because the £20m has already been spent. There was absolutely no need for such a ridiculously over engineering 'inconic' design.

The architecture of the entrance is not really my cup of tea, but I do see merit in spending a bit more to improve the appearance of the public realm. Does every building have to be engineered to look like a cow shed? Anyway, I do wonder how much of the cost is down to overly pretty cladding, compared to the complexity of founding the thing in the middle of the river Aire and providing a structure to support the escalators and lifts.

I would also be interested how many people use the new entrance in peak leisure periods - it is possible that outside office hours it contributes little to curing the dreadful overcrowding around the main gateline.

Surely the main time for overcrowding is during office hours?

 

[edwin_m]

The latest Rail Engineer magazine has a visualisation of the Leeds station looking northwards from somewhere near the junction of Nevlle Street and Water Lane. It's courtesy of HS2 so may be on their website too. The now-completed southern entrance is shown as remaining in existence after completion of the HS2 station.

 

[jayah]

You're always going to get this problem at large stations. No entrance location is going to suit everyone. It might benefit some people, but then there's the same issue on the west side with people using the car park. Why not have another entrance there? Ultimately, you've got to draw a line on the number of entrances and decide what the biggest issue is. It's fairly obvious that access to south of the station was the most problematic.



The architecture of the entrance is not really my cup of tea, but I do see merit in spending a bit more to improve the appearance of the public realm. Does every building have to be engineered to look like a cow shed? Anyway, I do wonder how much of the cost is down to overly pretty cladding, compared to the complexity of founding the thing in the middle of the river Aire and providing a structure to support the escalators and lifts.



Surely the main time for overcrowding is during office hours?

The point is that if the main reason the southern entrance cost the extraordinary sum of £20m is the proximity of the river and the main objective was to reduce crowding, then it could and should have been built by the East Footbridge for a fraction of the cost and to the benefit of many.

There is a lot of crowding at a lot of different times and if the new entrance only serves offices by the river, it will see little use except for 2 admittedly very busy hours each weekday.

 

[Grumpy]

The latest Rail Engineer magazine has a visualisation of the Leeds station looking northwards from somewhere near the junction of Nevlle Street and Water Lane. It's courtesy of HS2 so may be on their website too. The now-completed southern entrance is shown as remaining in existence after completion of the HS2 station.

Thanks for posting this. The first para states "For those of us afflicted by a get-on-with-it culture and a lifestyle built on thrift, there is something rather uncomfortable about HS2"
Which really applies to the newly opened southern entrance.
I suspect most people would think it's a waste of money and could have been better spent elsewhere (those people probably think the same about HS2). Many years ago there was an entrance by the eastern footbridge, staffed in peak hours. I used to use it every day . I suspect it could have been brought back into use for a pittance and would have relieved the present main entrance.

 

[thejuggler]

The new entrance isn't for the now. During the next 15 years the area south of the station will be a much different place to what it is now. Who remembers Granary Wharf 15-20 years ago!

Large redevelopment projects (such as Burberry bringing a few thousand staff) will see many more thousands of people employed in the area. A good station access makes the area more attractive to companies.

 

[edwin_m]

Many years ago there was an entrance by the eastern footbridge, staffed in peak hours. I used to use it every day . I suspect it could have been brought back into use for a pittance and would have relieved the present main entrance.

Which end? Although previous posts seem to be referring to the north end, maybe the southern end of the east footbridge would have been a cheaper compromise.

However, is the east footbridge wheelchair accessible? If not then it might have been necessary to provide lifts to all platforms, as it's probably not acceptable to provide a new facility that can't be used by everyone (especially as the wheelchair route to the south side is even longer, not being able to use the steps by the cycle hub).

 

[Max]

The new entrance isn't for the now. During the next 15 years the area south of the station will be a much different place to what it is now. Who remembers Granary Wharf 15-20 years ago!

Large redevelopment projects (such as Burberry bringing a few thousand staff) will see many more thousands of people employed in the area. A good station access makes the area more attractive to companies.

Absolutely, and not just workers. The Council have aspirations to introduce a much larger resident population to the area, with better connections from the station to Holbeck village to the south.

 

[stuartmoss]

I saw the new entrance in operation this evening as well as new signage on the footbridge. I also like the design, but I'm a fan of high tech architecture. I appreciate its not everyone's cup of tea. But as a regular user of the station, this is something I will use for leisure purposes as much as anything.

 

[HowardGWR]

I saw the new entrance in operation this evening as well as new signage on the footbridge. I also like the design, but I'm a fan of high tech architecture. I appreciate its not everyone's cup of tea. But as a regular user of the station, this is something I will use for leisure purposes as much as anything.

That's good to hear - it is a bit 'walkie talkie' though. I just wonder whether it will fit in with the HS2 station that has to creep in alongside it.

 

[jayah]

Absolutely, and not just workers. The Council have aspirations to introduce a much larger resident population to the area, with better connections from the station to Holbeck village to the south.

It sounds like something from behind the iron curtain! The council have already had to fill a large glut of privately developed city centre flats with social tenants because nobody wanted to live in them. If this is part of some private redevelopment, let the developers pay for this no doubt 'award winning' architecture.

As has already been pointed out, a second northern entrance would have cost little in comparison and fulfilled the primary objective - relieving congestion.

 

[stuartmoss]

I went to film the Southern Entrance and Granary Wharf area yesterday afternoon. If you're interested the film is here:

[youtube]fRc9P0N71pc[/youtube]

I also put a few photos on my Instagram here: http://www.instagram.com/stumoss .

 

[Grumpy]

I went to film the Southern Entrance and Granary Wharf area yesterday afternoon. .

Very good. Thanks for posting. Nice to see the staff there and escalators working. Only one thing missing.

 

[LWB]

Saw this image on Skyscraper City (usual disclaimer re copyright)

Some change but I do somehow prefer the then as oppossed to the now.ad:ad:

 

[Grumpy]

During the next 15 years the area south of the station will be a much different place to what it is now.
A good station access makes the area more attractive to companies.

Yes indeed it will be different. Much of what is now used for employment will be swept away to make way for HS2.

Using the new exit requires the use of sets of escalators (Nothing wrong with that but from what I've seen, and on the video posted earlier, they seem to run constantly, rather than turn themselves onto standby when no-one is in the area. And, as on the video, when I used the entrance there were no other users in sight). You are then required to proceed through one of the tunnels under the station where you end up in Neville St in the dark arches, although admittedly near the southern end. The tunnels seem to be popular with the city's down and outs for sleeping and toilet purposes. I don't see that making an area attractive to companies.
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Which end?

However, is the east footbridge wheelchair accessible? If not then it might have been necessary to provide lifts to all platforms, as it's probably not acceptable to provide a new facility that can't be used by everyone (especially as the wheelchair route to the south side is even longer, not being able to use the steps by the cycle hub).

It was the end close to New Station St. If you come down the steps you will see it just to the right-it's a metal gate now. I don't see the wheelchair aspect being an issue-wheelchair users could still use this entrance to access the station although would have to use the existing lifts to reach the islands.

From what I've seen, the eastern footbridge can be very busy when trains are using the eastern platforms. Not everyone needs lifts/escalators. An exit there would be a useful time saver to many and a better use of staff time than the Southern entrance-although I accept that is now a fait accompli

 

[61653 HTAFC]

Very good. Thanks for posting. Nice to see the staff there and escalators working. Only one thing missing.

People? Affordable rents in all those empty flats? (seems Leeds is making the same mistakes Manchester made 20 years ago!)...

 

[D6975]

Saw this image on Skyscraper City (usual disclaimer re copyright)

Some change but I do somehow prefer the then as oppossed to the now.ad:ad:

I remember that crane, walked past it many times on the walk down to Holbeck depot.
From the station to the depot I don't think you walked past a single house, the area was completely industrial. The first houses you came across were as you walked around the back of the depot.

 

[Tetchytyke]

As has already been pointed out, a second northern entrance would have cost little in comparison and fulfilled the primary objective - relieving congestion.

A significant amount of office space has now relocated to south of the river, particularly around Bridgewater Place and Water Lane, and the new entrance was built with these developments in mind. Coming from Bridgewater Place the new entrance will save five minutes walking, as well as dealing with the congestion around the main gateline and station concourse.

A second northern entrance, i.e. an entrance 50 yards further up New Station Street, would not really achieve either of those things. Even when they used to open the gate on what is now platform 8 it didn't make huge amounts of difference to crowding at the gateline.

You are then required to proceed through one of the tunnels under the station where you end up in Neville St in the dark arches, although admittedly near the southern end.

No you don't, there are bridges across the canal in the development by the Doubletree which bring you out on Water Lane.

 

[jayah]

I went to film the Southern Entrance and Granary Wharf area yesterday afternoon. If you're interested the film is here:

[youtube]fRc9P0N71pc[/youtube]

I also put a few photos on my Instagram here: http://www.instagram.com/stumoss .

It doesn't look very busy? More staff than peoe in fact! The eastern footbridge certainly had goods lifts via the old East barroway, so if there aren't public lifts today it would be a tiny job to fit public ones.

 

[deltic]

Used the new entrance today just after 9am - not very busy - made the mistake of using Dark Neville exit - not very enticing and certainly wouldnt want to use at night. Granary Wharf exit looks better. I noticed there appears to be no sign posting to the new entrance from the nearby roads

 

[jayah]

Used the new entrance today just after 9am - not very busy - made the mistake of using Dark Neville exit - not very enticing and certainly wouldnt want to use at night. Granary Wharf exit looks better. I noticed there appears to be no sign posting to the new entrance from the nearby roads

Judging by this and the 'spot the passenger' video, I would say £20m spent, and the terrible crowding problem around the main gateline has not been dealt with at all. Perhaps now they will be able to find £2m to make a proper job of it, by building a second entrance facing the city centre, where people actually want to go. Never mind making very expensive architectural statements....