Awkward XC Guard - Overcharged

[moleman212]

A couple of weeks ago a CrossCountry TM stated that my friend's York to Manchester Airport anytime single ticket was off route between Doncaster and Sheffield and forced him to buy a new ticket from Doncaster to Manchester Airport (he had travelled York - Doncaster - Sheffield - Manchester Airport so to meet up with me on the Doncaster to Sheffield section). I checked the route was valid on NRE.

The TM stated that the route shown on NRE was only valid on late night services when the direct services weren't running. When I then said if this was the case, then the ticket would show 'ROUTE DIRECT' he started going on about people trying to use Newcastle to Carlisle tickets via Manchester and that my friend was definitely off route. He was also saying he has been in the job for 15 years and so he knows how to do things properly....when I tried to reiterate that routes shown on NRE are valid for the journeys shown he would not listen.

My friend relented and bought the new ticket. He has since had this refunded after contacting XC and they added a £10 voucher as a goodwill gesture. I wanted them really to increase this but they would not budge (a bit galling that if they make a mistake then they feel they can make amends with a £10 voucher whereas if we make a mistake it may end in a prosecution).

 

[gray1404]

I am going to let others look this up in the routing guide as I am on the road right now. However, on the basis that the journeys shown on NRE are worked out by applying the routing guide and are correct.................. I shall say...............

This train manager needs a good dressing down, retraining put on a customer service course and told to do his job correctly. Talk about making it up as you go along. What did XC say they are going to doing about it?

As I see it, you are unhappy with the way XC have responded to your complaint and the low level of compensation offered. I can therefore:
1. contact XC ask them to look at the case again and explain why you are unhappy
2. take the case to Transport Focus telling them why you are unhappy

You can go to Transport Focus without having to go back to XC, or you can go to XC first and still decide to take it to TF later.

 

[A-driver]

I am going to let others look this up in the routing guide as I am on the road right now. However, on the basis that the journeys shown on NRE are worked out by applying the routing guide and are correct.................. I shall say...............

This train manager needs a good dressing down, retraining put on a customer service course and told to do his job correctly. Talk about making it up as you go along. What did XC say they are going to doing about it?

As I see it, you are unhappy with the way XC have responded to your complaint and the low level of compensation offered. I can therefore:
1. contact XC ask them to look at the case again and explain why you are unhappy
2. take the case to Transport Focus telling them why you are unhappy

You can go to Transport Focus without having to go back to XC, or you can go to XC first and still decide to take it to TF later.

Lol. You have read someone's one sided alleged events and decided that the guard has poor customer service skills, a bad attitude and is making up rules. Untill you hear the full story (including the guards side of it) you are a million miles off of a position to judge.

Oh, and by the way, what the TOC decide to do with the guard is none of your or anyone else's, including the OP and his friends, business. Any kind of disciplinary action is very strictly between an employer and employee.

 

[moleman212]

I would not have minded if this TM had said "I don't know if this is valid - let me check and i'll get back to you". What he did say was "Your friend is off-route and has no reason to be going through Doncaster on this ticket."

After I pulled up a route on NRE showing that itineraries via Doncaster were offered he took no notice. My friend escalated the complaint to a senior member of customer service staff who said they will not increase the offer so my friend will probably take it as that.

I handled this on my friend's behalf because he is a student from China and i felt partly resonsible for the problem since i advised he would be fine to go via Doncaster anyway.

XC confirmed that the route was valid by email pnce they were told of the incident.

 

[najaB]

A couple of weeks ago a CrossCountry TM stated that ...

He has since had this refunded after contacting XC and they added a £10 voucher as a goodwill gesture.

I'm sorry, but I can't figure out what advice - if any - you are asking for?

 

[sheff1]

Untill you hear the full story (including the guards side of it) you are a million miles off of a position to judge.

I would love to hear the guard's side of the story. Anyone who allegedly claims that a York to Manchester Airport anytime single ticket is off route between Doncaster and Sheffield must be very good at making up stories.

 

[A-driver]

I would love to hear the guard's side of the story. Anyone claiming that a York to Manchester Airport anytime single ticket was off route between Doncaster and Sheffield must be very good at making up stories.

Ah, so you know everything the OP has stated to be 100% the truth, the whole truth and nothing but the truth?!

I am certainly not calling him a liar or anything like this but it's pointless making such strong claims about the guard as an individual until the full story has been heard, which it won't ever be on this forum.

Calls for a "strong dressing down", retraining, customer service courses and hinting they'd love to know how strongly the guard was disciplined are out of order when responding to a single sided post.

 

[moleman212]

I'm not asking for advice. Just telling a story of what happened really to see if anyone else has come across this guard. I was perplexed that XC said they would ensure the guard will be trained about this route's validity bur really it seems this guard has little knowledge about how to calculate any particular validity in general. It was worrying he implied a lot of tickets were valid on direct routes only and I wonder how many others may have been mistakenly overcharged.

 

[moleman212]

There is one addition I missed out to get an easier point across. My friend wanted to travel in first class since I had a first advance from Doncaster to Sheffield. He had a Std Anytime Single (discounted with a 16-25 railcard) from York to Manchester Airport which he needed to excess up to a full fare anytime first class single from York to Manchester Airport.

Since XC doesnt operate penalty fares this excess fare was fine to purchase on board and should have totalled £18. Instead he was asked to purchase a first single from Doncaster to Manchester Airport at 33.60.

In fairness XC wrote a very genuine apology although i am still angered by how forthright and sure of himself the TM was. He had a 'i know all' attitude.

 

[sheff1]

Ah, so you know everything the OP has stated to be 100% the truth, the whole truth and nothing but the truth?!

I added 'allegedly'. Unfortunately you were too quick off the mark and replied whilst I was doing so

 

[Agent_c]

Ah, so you know everything the OP has stated to be 100% the truth, the whole truth and nothing but the truth?!

I am certainly not calling him a liar or anything like this but it's pointless making such strong claims about the guard as an individual until the full story has been heard, which it won't ever be on this forum.

Calls for a "strong dressing down", retraining, customer service courses and hinting they'd love to know how strongly the guard was disciplined are out of order when responding to a single sided post.

I didn't realise D&P was run on a "presume the customer is lying" basis... The essential facts seem clear, and the conclusion that they lead to equally clear... the only way some other conclusion could be valid is if we're going to assume one of those essential facts is wrong...

 

[A-driver]

I added 'allegedly'. Unfortunately you were too quick off the mark and replied whilst I was doing so

That's my whole point though, the reply j criticised was based entirely on "allegedly". I'm not saying the op is lying but we still only have his side of the story and as the complainant it should certainly be taken with a pinch of salt. And he has put said much about the specific attitude of the guard except to title the thread as 'awkward'. It's I possible for the poster I criticised to make such strong claims without the other side of the story.

Not wishing to spark a huge debate but if XC investigated the claim (including speaking to said guard and looking at his record etc) and felt it was worth a £10 voucher then that may well mean they don't share the claims he needed retraining and was making it up etc...
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

I didn't realise D&P was run on a "presume the customer is lying" basis... The essential facts seem clear, and the conclusion that they lead to equally clear... the only way some other conclusion could be valid is if we're going to assume one of those essential facts is wrong...

Well you undoubtedly need both sides of the story in a circumstance like this one-absolutely impossible to know what happened without.

And I've made it clear that I'm not claiming the OP is lying. Just that until anyone hears the guards side of it no one on here, regardless of how much they think they know about routing guides and ticketing, Can say for sure what actually happened and what the outcome should be. The OP has had the fare re-funded and a £10 voucher. The refund alone for a mistake is all that's really needed.

 

[sheff1]

Not wishing to spark a huge debate but if XC investigated the claim (including speaking to said guard and looking at his record etc) and felt it was worth a £10 voucher then that may well mean they don't share the claims he needed retraining and was making it up etc...

The OP also said XC refunded the cost of the new ticket which his friend was forced to buy. IF (!) they were forced to buy a new ticket when they already held an Anytime York to Manchester Airport ticket then the guard was making things up. This is why I would love to hear the guard's version of events - of course that is not going to happen.

 

[A-driver]

The OP also said XC refunded the cost of the new ticket which his friend was forced to buy. IF (!) they were forced to buy a new ticket when they already held an Anytime York to Manchester Airport ticket then the guard was making things up. This is why I would love to hear the guard's version of events - of course that is not going to happen.

No it's not going to happen. It's also not a dispute or prosecution as the OP has had the money paid back. Plus an extra £10. Asking for more is not a dispute.

 

[sheff1]

Well I am not a moderator so can do nothing about where other people chose to post. The post has sparked a bit of debate which, after all, is what a forum is for.

 

[A-driver]

Well I am not a moderator so can do nothing about where other people chose to post. The post has sparked a bit of debate which, after all, is what a forum is for.

I didn't say you could change where it's posted but I'm simply saying the 2nd posters rather extreme and arguably Vile criticism is completely unjustifiable as he is not in possession of the facts required to make any such claims. That's all I'm arguing about-not the OPs claim.

 

[DaleCooper]

Am I missing something here? If the ticket was not valid via Doncaster then surely it was not valid York to Doncaster so why did the TM only issue a Doncaster-Manchester Airport ticket and not a ticket for the whole journey?

 

[moleman212]

My friend had travelled from York to Doncaster earlier that morning on a VTEC service where the guard did not challenge him. I then met my fruend at Doncaster and had something to eat with him and gave him his printed boarding pass (one of the reasons he needed to see me as he doesnt have a printer).

 

[hounddog]

I'm simply saying the 2nd posters rather extreme and arguably Vile criticism is completely unjustifiable as he is not in possession of the facts required to make any such claims. That's all I'm arguing about-not the OPs claim.

Given that you think the guard may not have done anything wrong, maybe you'd like to give us a scenario in which the company would refund a correctly issued ticket and add a goodwill gesture on top? For me the fact that they did that is pretty conclusive that they believe the guard was wrong.

 

[A-driver]

Given that you think the guard may not have done anything wrong, maybe you'd like to give us a scenario in which the company would refund a correctly issued ticket and add a goodwill gesture on top? For me the fact that they did that is pretty conclusive that they believe the guard was wrong.

I'm not claiming he was wrong. Read my posts properly please and stop jumping to ill informed conclusions.

The poster claimed the guard needed retraining and had a poor attitude amongst other things. None of these things are stated by the OP so the poster was making up claims against an individual with no evidence whatsoever.

 

[hounddog]

Read my posts properly please

Maybe you should write your posts properly as everyone seems to be 'misreading' them, not just me.

 

[DaleCooper]

Maybe you should write your posts properly as everyone seems to be 'misreading' them, not just me.

I understood A-driver's posts and agreed with them.

 

[moleman212]

The guard didnt shout at us but he was not willing to check anything I was saying. When a customer tells me something in the job I do I listen to them and then check if they are correct or give the benefit of the doubt. Im sure most TMs are the same. This TM was not willing to check. Are Avantix's able to check a routeing?
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---
Also the TM saying 'your friend has no business travelling through Doncaster on this ticket" wasn't the most polite or customer focused way he could have said this. I appreciate A-driver's posts that we will never hear the guard's side of the story which is unfortunate since I still don't know why he refused to corroborate what I was saying.

 

[A-driver]

Maybe you should write your posts properly as everyone seems to be 'misreading' them, not just me.

No, people who have criticised my posts on this thread, including you, have all clearly read between the lines and added words that I didn't say. Please quote things I have said to back up your claims. Then you'll see you have misread it.

 

[Fare-Cop]

No, people who have criticised my posts on this thread, including you, have all clearly read between the lines and added words that I didn't say.

I understood what A-driver was saying too, and agree with him

have all clearly read between the lines and added words that I didn't say

I also agree that this is a very common trait in some users of all forums, but the last time I made a similar comment, expressing a personal opinion, my post was removed by a moderator and the message that I received read as follows:

“This is an automatic message to indicate that the following post which you created has been deleted. This message is advisory and it does not indicate that you have broken the forum rules,”

I am frequently concerned by the reaction of those people who read something that they don’t want to hear, I thought the purpose of these forums was to allow debating and freedom of expression in discussing those matters raised by forum users.

I’m fairly sure that this post will also be ‘moderated’ accordingly

 

[najaB]

“This is an automatic message to indicate that the following post which you created has been deleted. This message is advisory and it does not indicate that you have broken the forum rules,”

Oh, I'm well familiar with that message! What was the reason code?

 

[Fare-Cop]

Oh, I'm well familiar with that message! What was the reason code?

Reason: 27 - Misunderstanding

Sadly, I had no misunderstanding!

 

[Llanigraham]

Maybe you should write your posts properly as everyone seems to be 'misreading' them, not just me.

A-driver's post was perfectly understandable, however you, and others, have totally mis-read it.
It is unfortunately becoming increasingly common by some members on here.

 

[headshot119]

Reason: 27 - Misunderstanding

Sadly, I had no misunderstanding!

You where off route in the Disputes & Prosecutions sub forum as you only had a ticket marked Route : NOT PERSONAL OPINIONS.

The only choice was to have you post moderated or charge you a full open single from General Discussion to Disputes & Prosecutions Route : ANY PERMITTED.

Mods please try to see the light hearted humor behind this post.

 

[tony6499]

Lol. You have read someone's one sided alleged events and decided that the guard has poor customer service skills, a bad attitude and is making up rules. Untill you hear the full story (including the guards side of it) you are a million miles off of a position to judge.

Oh, and by the way, what the TOC decide to do with the guard is none of your or anyone else's, including the OP and his friends, business. Any kind of disciplinary action is very strictly between an employer and employee.

Laughable really, should be an award for jumping on someones high horse.