Ouch...

[Bayum]

http://www.yorkshireeveningpost.co.uk/news/Leeds-MP-demands-apology-from.4400612.jp

An MP as well !!!

Oh dear

 

[theblackwatch]

http://www.yorkshireeveningpost.co.uk/news/Leeds-MP-demands-apology-from.4400612.jp

An MP as well !!!

Oh dear

If it had been an ordinary member of the public rather than an MP, it probably wouldn't have made the paper. :roll:

 

[P156KWJ]

NXEC staff at it again :roll: not being funny to them all, but my experience of NXEC staff had been inadequate. They can often be rude and not very courteous.

 

[support-uk-rail]

NXEC staff at it again :roll: not being funny to them all, but my experience of NXEC staff had been inadequate. They can often be rude and not very courteous.

Yeah, especially on the Anglian network. Back when they were 'one', there was rail replacements between Ipswich and Colchester, and a woman was pregant with a young child and had a lot of baggage, and the staff that were guiding everyone to the busses (3 men) didn't help or anything. Where's common courtesy these days?

NE bus drivers are okay though! :grin:

 

[Mojo]

Sums up a lot of railway station staff these days, sorry to say...

 

[yorkie]

It's daft.

At York station, I am always able to get a reservation as the queues are not long, you never have to queue for more than about 3 minutes. But at King's Cross?! Forget it! Firstly, they won't allow your bike in the queue so where do you leave it? and secondly the queues there are ludicrous.

The solution would be for reservations to be more readily available by the internet, Fast Ticket machines, and - dare I say it - for NXEC to cut the ridiculous queues at King's Cross!

By the way, it's significantly quicker to walk to St Pancras and you get served instantly, than it is to queue at King's Cross.:roll:

As for the rudeness, only in the rail (and bus) industry are such comments toward so-called "customers" tolerated. If a shop worker, or restaurant worker, treated a customer like that, the person making the comment would be in trouble I am sure.

 

[me123]

To be fair, yes he did need the reservation. But if the story is correct (I imagine some degree of exaggeration somewhere along the line), and there were spaces, I don't see why they couldn't "exercise discretion" and allow the bike on board provided space was available.

As for that level of customer service, well that's simply unacceptable. The staff should at the very least be given a written warning for that in my opinion.

 

[Bayum]

It's daft.

At York station, I am always able to get a reservation as the queues are not long, you never have to queue for more than about 3 minutes. But at King's Cross?! Forget it! Firstly, they won't allow your bike in the queue so where do you leave it? and secondly the queues there are ludicrous.

The solution would be for reservations to be more readily available by the internet, Fast Ticket machines, and - dare I say it - for NXEC to cut the ridiculous queues at King's Cross!

By the way, it's significantly quicker to walk to St Pancras and you get served instantly, than it is to queue at King's Cross.:roll:

As for the rudeness, only in the rail (and bus) industry are such comments toward so-called "customers" tolerated. If a shop worker, or restaurant worker, treated a customer like that, the person making the comment would be in trouble I am sure.

I have had to queue for more than 3 minutes on numerious occasions... The shortest time i've been in a queue at York was for about 7 minutes, in the end I had to leave the queue otherwise I would have missed my train...

Could have just been that i'm unlucky everytime i go to their ticket office!!

 

[The 158 Man]

Terrible. Who do these staff members think they are? People who are using (or trying to, in this case) the trains are keeping them in a job.

If I spoke to someone like that in my job I'd be facing a disciplinary by now! :roll:

 

[class 313]

By the way, it's significantly quicker to walk to St Pancras and you get served instantly, than it is to queue at King's Cross.:roll:

You don't need a bike reservation with EMT. They tell you to shove it in the TGS or the Buffet (coach F).

 

[dan_atki]

You don't need a bike reservation with EMT. They tell you to shove it in the TGS or the Buffet (coach F).

This isn't about EMT :? Yorkie simply stated that if you wanted the reservation from King's Cross it would be quicker to walk to St Pancras to get the reservation then walk back to King's Cross instead of queueing at KGX.

To correct you - you do need a cycle reservation with EMT services out of London. http://www.eastmidlandstrains.co.uk/EMTrains/YourJourney/CarParkingAndCycles.htm

 

[class 313]

This isn't about EMT :? Yorkie simply stated that if you wanted the reservation from King's Cross it would be quicker to walk to St Pancras to get the reservation then walk back to King's Cross instead of queueing at KGX.

To correct you - you do need a cycle reservation with EMT services out of London. http://www.eastmidlandstrains.co.uk/EMTrains/YourJourney/CarParkingAndCycles.htm

Then on EMT its far less strict as I have never seen their reservation checked.

 

[richa2002]

Come on, let's be honest Loader, how many times have you seen a person with a bicycle on an EMT service and if so, how do you know they hadn't shown their reservation except that one case with the man at Derby? You can't just make sweeping statements like EMT are less strict when really you don't really at all.

 

[class 313]

Come on, let's be honest Loader, how many times have you seen a person with a bicycle on an EMT service and if so, how do you know they hadn't shown their reservation except that one case with the man at Derby? You can't just make sweeping statements like EMT are less strict when really you don't really at all.

I'm being honest. I've seen it quite a few times when they have been told just to shove their bikes in the TGS. So yes, I will keep stating that because in my experience this is true.

 

[Mojo]

As for the rudeness, only in the rail (and bus) industry are such comments toward so-called "customers" tolerated. If a shop worker, or restaurant worker, treated a customer like that, the person making the comment would be in trouble I am sure.

There are bad staff in many industries though, and people who just aren't committed to customer service, but, sadly I have to agree with the middle part of your statement.

In another industry though, in most cases, if you don't like it you can go somewhere else. In the town I used to live in there was a Tesco and a Sainsburys. I found the staff in Tesco rather rude and did all my shopping at Sainsburys.

 

[Craig]

To be fair, yes he did need the reservation. But if the story is correct (I imagine some degree of exaggeration somewhere along the line), and there were spaces, I don't see why they couldn't "exercise discretion" and allow the bike on board provided space was available.

That report does seem a little one sided, it's quite possible that there were five bike reservations made from stations other than KX. It's probably more likely that the guy was just being a jobsworth though. It doesn't say where the guard was based, but in my experience the London based NXEC crews generally seem to be more abrupt with people than others.

 

[Mintona]

Yeah, especially on the Anglian network. Back when they were 'one', there was rail replacements between Ipswich and Colchester, and a woman was pregant with a young child and had a lot of baggage, and the staff that were guiding everyone to the busses (3 men) didn't help or anything. Where's common courtesy these days?

NE bus drivers are okay though! :grin:

If it's anything like us, they're not meant to, in case they injure themselves lifting something heavy. That wouldn't have stopped me though - I always help with heavy bags, and phone their destination station so someone there will meet them to help them from the train.

I would tend to think the report is probably a tad exaggerated to get his point across, and make the railways look as bad as possible.

 

[BOSCH]

GC will take your bikes,no questions asked !!8)

 

[paul1609]

Unfortunately if you're travelling from the south theres every chance that your GC wont turn up leaving you stranded without a NX cycle reservation.

 

[1D53]

GC will take your bikes,no questions asked !!8)

Could get its own table on some services Just kidding!

 

[Mr Spock]

Whenever one of these one sided reports gets on here from somebody that cannot get their own way on the railway why does nearly everyone side with the customer against staff without getting the full facts. Who knows what these people say or do?

Now we have a publicity seeking MP who most likely travels regularly on the train (and with a bike previously) and says he does not know reservations are compulsary because there are no signs, well there are usually plenty of leaflets around about cycles on trains.

As for mentioning the cost of the ticket in his complaint, what has that got to do with it, as it was probably just another expense claim to him anyway.

 

[Coradia]

Now we have a publicity seeking MP who most likely travels regularly on the train (and with a bike previously) and says he does not know reservations are compulsary because there are no signs, well there are usually plenty of leaflets around about cycles on trains.

Very true, at the end of the day there are rules about taking bikes onboard, never done so myself but it has certinately been made clear through leaflets and I am sure have been on posters at stations. The apparent 'insults' the staff were making is wrong. At least this wasn't a situation where the guy had made a reservation, but the staff 'made up their own rules' and told him he couldn't go on with it, or had to pay extra or something like that.

 

[BOSCH]

Unfortunately if you're travelling from the south theres every chance that your GC wont turn up leaving you stranded without a NX cycle reservation.

Not at the minute matey !

 

[yorkie]

GC will take your bikes,no questions asked !!

Out of interest, where are the bikes meant to be stored and which part of the platform should I wait at in order to load the bike on? (I was told different things the first (and, so far, only) time I did it but that was early days! )

Whenever one of these one sided reports gets on here from somebody that cannot get their own way on the railway why does nearly everyone side with the customer against staff without getting the full facts. Who knows what these people say or do?

I think the responses have been fair. As Craig and myself have said earlier, it is possible that someone else could book the bike places further down the line. But common sense should really prevail - he could have had that explained to him courteously, and/or be told to be prepared to remove the bike at Peterborough if necessary (etc...)

Now we have a publicity seeking MP who most likely travels regularly on the train (and with a bike previously) and says he does not know reservations are compulsary because there are no signs, well there are usually plenty of leaflets around about cycles on trains.

Yes, a leaftlet is available, and looking at the leaflet it certainly is complicated as different TOCs have different rules. And as someone mentioned above, sometimes conflicting information is published.

As for mentioning the cost of the ticket in his complaint, what has that got to do with it, as it was probably just another expense claim to him anyway.

If you pay good money, you expect to be treated with respect. If I go to a restaurant I would expect to be treated well, but if I went to a fastfood place - although I would not expect to be treated badly - I would, perhaps, have slightly lower expectations in terms service in comparison. The railway calls its passengers "customers" and it should treat them as customers.

Unfortunately if you're travelling from the south theres every chance that your GC wont turn up leaving you stranded without a NX cycle reservation.

GC are reliable now, but the train was cancelled GC would issue a replacement 'Any permitted' ticket, the only inconvenience would be having to queue for 20-30 mins to get a replacement reservation (but, I wonder if GC may even do that for you - I am not sure if they can call their control to make reservations or not, or if they could ask NXEC to make a reservation without queuing).

 

[Nym]

NXEC staff at it again :roll: not being funny to them all, but my experience of NXEC staff had been inadequate. They can often be rude and not very courteous.

You've never experienced my customer service at 5:40 in the morning then thats much worse....

 

[Metroland]

If you pay good money, you expect to be treated with respect. If I go to a restaurant I would expect to be treated well, but if I went to a fastfood place - although I would not expect to be treated badly - I would, perhaps, have slightly lower expectations in terms service in comparison. The railway calls its passengers "customers" and it should treat them as customers.

Fine words I'm sure. However, please remember while you may be a person that isn't rude and likes to play the rules (fare evasion for example) there are some people out there that do. Please remember there are two physical attacks on the railway everyday, the system is used by millions of people, some are there to cause trouble and see nothing wrong in threatening staff with their jobs or worse.

Apart from a poor customer service ethic (which extends to all industries in this country, not just the railway) there are equally far too many people that think because they are paying someone money (either as an employer or customer) it gives them a license to abuse them and the system.

I'm not saying that's what has happened here, but please remember there are two sides to every story, things are very often not quite as simple as they may first appear. There is of course no excuse for staff being rude, however I think we should take some of the stories in the press with a pinch of salt. Believe it or not there are people out there with an axe to grind.

 

[Mr Spock]

Well Yorkie if you think the postings have been fair then your idea of fair is different to mine. Most postings seem to accept the report as true as they mostly criticise statff for being rude when as far as I can see we just have the word of a csutomer.

A far as i can see from the report this is just another instance of a customer who knows he is in the wrong but continues to make a fuss and when he does not get his way puts in a complaint about rude staff.

First of all he says the member of staff made signs suggesting he was stupid who then walked away when challenged but then says he heard him call him stupid!

As far as information goes I have a leaflet about cycles on trains and it is quite clear as is the NXEC timetable and the details on NR Enquiries website.

As for your bit about restaurants and fast food joints - what the hell has that got to do with anything unless you are saying that if someone buys a first class ticket they should be allowed to do what they want but that somebody buying a cheap ticket should be treated differently.

Anyway if the customer had accepted that he was in the wrong in the first place and (probably) not made a fuss none of this would have happened and why did it then have to be passed to the press.

 

[yorkie]

Well Yorkie if you think the postings have been fair then your idea of fair is different to mine. Most postings seem to accept the report as true as they mostly criticise statff for being rude when as far as I can see we just have the word of a csutomer.

Are you suggesting the MP is lying?

A far as i can see from the report this is just another instance of a customer who knows he is in the wrong but continues to make a fuss and when he does not get his way puts in a complaint about rude staff.

He has every right to complain if staff are rude.

As for your bit about restaurants and fast food joints - what the hell has that got to do with anything unless you are saying that if someone buys a first class ticket they should be allowed to do what they want but that somebody buying a cheap ticket should be treated differently.

People who buy first class tickets are treated differently! But that's not really what I was getting at. The fact is, rail travel is expensive, and we are called "customers" so should be treated as such.

Anyway if the customer had accepted that he was in the wrong in the first place and (probably) not made a fuss none of this would have happened and why did it then have to be passed to the press.

So basically you are blaming the rudeness of the staff on the customer asking for common sense to be displayed? Interesting.

"A customer is the most important visitor on our premises, he is not dependent on us. We are dependent on him. He is not an interruption in our work. He is the purpose of it. He is not an outsider in our business. He is part of it. We are not doing him a favor by serving him. He is doing us a favor by giving us an opportunity to do so."
Mahatma Gandhi

 

[Mr Spock]

As I was not there to see or hear what went on I am not in a position to say anybody was lying. What I was trying to say was that before passing judgement I would like to hear the other side of the story rather than just rely on one persons statement although that is not how it came out.

If a customer is told that he cannot take his bike on a train without a reservation and it is explained to him what he has to do to get a reservation and then says something silly (for want of a better word) then he leaves himself open for somebody nearby to respond.

No I am not saying in this case it would be alright for a member of staff to be rude about a customer.

 

[Metroland]

Looks like six of one and half dozen of the other:

'Mr Hamilton said there were no signs informing passengers that reservations were required and that no one else was taking a bicycle onto the train, which had space for five bicycles.'

Well no.

But it does say so on national rail enquiries and if he'd asked at the booking office.

http://www.nationalrail.co.uk/system/galleries/download/misc/CyclingbyTrain.pdf

Of course if he had been travelling by many other forms of public transport (bus, coach, plane, boat) he'd have had to pay as well as reserve, or perhaps not even be able to bring his bike. I can't see Ryan air, Easy Jet or National Express coaches letting him off either - they change extra money for all excess baggage!

The point is if in doubt ask!

We don't have all the story, it *could* have been the train was ready to depart and staff where trying to dispatch the train while he was debating this. And as we all know customers don't like late trains as well.

As for calling someone stupid, they might have said it was a stupid thing to do to try and get a bike on a train without reserving a place - we don't know. Which is not quite the same as calling someone stupid.

Some people never admit they are wrong and expect to be treat with the utmost of dignity despite being very difficult. Did this story really need to reach the newspapers? He does sound like someone with an axe to grind, it's hardly the worlds biggest travesty of justice because you had to wait a while longer because you made an assumption. Most of us wouldn't have had the gumption to to bother and it sounds like someone that uses his position to gain ground in an argument.

While staff may well have been in the wrong and NXEC have apologised, I do think a broader outlook needs to be taken. Those that say common sense but be employed, need to remember that if staff 'bend' rules and there is a consequence they have to carry the can. What, for example, if 5 bikes were booked on the train at Peterborough?

Personally, I'd have bent the rules, I'm merely pointing out that it's understandable if some people don't - especially if they have been dragged over the coals in the past for it.

First rule of railways: Assumption is the mother of all cock-ups!