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Signal boxes vs signalling centers in the UK

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Blillpers

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Hi,

To start with, let me (re)introduce myself. I'm a 19 year old swede and recently became the youngest signaller on the Swedish railways. For now I work in a local signal box at a station called Fagersta Central, however in a few years it will close and be transfered to a signalling centre far away.

Today there are just over 30 signal boxes left on the Swedish mainline network, the majority on secondary branch lines.The goal is to have the last one eliminated by 2030. That would mark the end of a transformation which began in the early 60s. In the early days only a few minor stations and passing loops at remote locations were transferred to the then-new signalling centres. On the main lines automatic block signals were installed and the signal boxes largely remained. It wasn't until the late 80s most smaller stations were transferred. Major stations began to be transferred during the 90s. While there are some advantages beyond cost savings, I think this translation is a bit sad as more and more stations become unstaffed. There are currently 8 signaling centres operational in Sweden, there were 10 originally and there have been plans to reduce this to 4, thankfully those plans has been shelved.

Well, back on topic. I've seen plenty of signal boxes still standing along the UK railways. How many are still operational, and for how long will they remain? Are major stations still to be controlled locally? And how many signalling centres are there?

I've become more and more intrested in this topic since I began working as a signaller a few months ago. And a photo from my workplace! :)

1g244x.jpg
 
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RailUK Forums

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Firstly Welcome.

In terms of operations it must be interesting getting to / from your places of work as your climate can be more disruptive than ours - snow etc. So getting to the more remote boxes must be challenging in winter I would have thought.

In terms of the signalling centres are these easy to get to - again climate issues with signallers being delayed turning up for work etc.

In the UK NR now have funding issues so moving some of the signalboxes into larger signalling centres like PSBs / IECCs and now even moving those into ROCs has been slowed. Locally where I am Romford ROC does not seem likely to be controlling its first trains for many years yet.
 

Blillpers

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Yes, the climate is certainly a challange. Most boxes are located close to the station it serves or even in the station building itself, this seems to be a major difference compared to the UK. But obviously there are many minor boxes at remote locations, sometimes only staffed when needed, for example at a passing siding where trains only meet occasionally. At other times the points are locked and trains run straight through.

Where I work, as well as other boxes I've visited, there are sleeping facilities so if you know there is bad weather coming you can sleep at work instead of trying to get there early in the morning. Frozen points is another major issue, back in the "good old days" when there were more staff aviable they would be cleared more often, today most points are equipped with electric heating but it doesen't always work. Big pieces of snow and ice also tends to fall off trains as they pass through points and cause them to fail. A few years ago an EMU got caught in the snow, another unit was sent to pull it loose and also got stuck. In the end the army had to be sent in to rescue the passengers and crew!

This winter has been very mild so far and while most people wish for a white Christmas us railway workers are just happy for now... ;)
 
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collexions

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Romford ROC's first workstation Thameside is set to go live on 26/10/2016, with Traffic Management. This will take control of the areas presently controlled by the three Upminster workstations on the C2c route.
 

306024

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Well Upminster didn't last long. I remember the locals complaining about the height of the proposed new signalling centre, and the consequential loss of daylight. I presume NR won't be knocking it down though.
 

collexions

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No, the North London Line is still controlled from Upminster, and not due for recontrol to Romford until a later control period. Migration plans have generally become protracted due to funds in CP5. Of the new ROC'S Manchester & York are due for a cycle of recontrols, both from manual boxes, PSBs/ASCS.
 

306024

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I naively thought they would transfer the NLL sooner, if only to save the heating bill ;)

Romford ROC is an impressive building, in the meantime it could easily host the world indoor bowls championship.
 

Philip Phlopp

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And the new generation of ROCs aren't just signalling centres, they'll also take over electrical control functions, about which there's an excellent article in this month's Rail Engineer.
 

306024

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The thread title has a conflict between the American use of "centers" and the specification "in the UK"!

You have a valid point if you can translate the whole thread into Swedish with no spelling errors or grammatical mistakes ;)
 

swt_passenger

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It might have been useful to define 'ROC' for the benefit of the original poster, given where he is, so it is usually the abbreviation for 'Regional Operating Centre'. Sometimes it appears in Network Rail's PR stuff as Rail Operating Centre though.

I assume they either aren't sure, or they aren't all using the same original information.
 

Railsigns

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It might have been useful to define 'ROC' for the benefit of the original poster, given where he is, so it is usually the abbreviation for 'Regional Operating Centre'. Sometimes it appears in Network Rail's PR stuff as Rail Operating Centre though.

I assume they either aren't sure, or they aren't all using the same original information.

I would suggest that "Rail Operating Centre" is correct and "Regional Operating Centre" is wrong, since the proposed control areas of the ROCs don't coincide with any recognised "Regions".
 

swt_passenger

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I would suggest that "Rail Operating Centre" is correct and "Regional Operating Centre" is wrong, since the proposed control areas of the ROCs don't coincide with any recognised "Regions".

I know there's some debate. Regional Operating Centre gets many hits in Network Rail's own website search box though.

What do the signs on the buildings usually say?
 

8A Rail

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The thread title has a conflict between the American use of "centers" and the specification "in the UK"!

As the member is from Sweden, I think a little latitude would be forgiven. Anyway, Blillpers is asking a reasonable question and hopefully members will be able to assist with thoughts rather than go off on their own discussions.
 

LNW-GW Joint

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None of the above seems to answer the OP's quest for information.
I've had a trawl for an overview of Network Rail's signalling strategy, and the link below might help.
http://www.railengineer.uk/2014/10/06/national-operating-strategy-unveiled/
We appear to be at the beginning of a journey to reduce the number of signalling points from 500 (many of which are still manually controlled) to 12.

Here's a link to a very readable site specialising in UK signalling: http://www.signalbox.org/gallery.shtml
And this is their page on what is probably our most famous old signal box at Shrewsbury: http://www.signalbox.org/gallery/lm/severnbridgejcn.php
 

WestRiding

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Signal Boxes will survive many many more years here in the UK. The re-signalling plans are not exactly going to plan and/or running late. Of the new closure list that came out the other month, there are a lot of boxes not even on the list!
 

Sunset route

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I know there's some debate. Regional Operating Centre gets many hits in Network Rail's own website search box though.

What do the signs on the buildings usually say?

All my rosters and correspondences with my Operations Manager and above, give a postal address as Rail Operating Centre for our local ROC accross the line from my ASC.
 

Surreytraveller

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I know there's some debate. Regional Operating Centre gets many hits in Network Rail's own website search box though.

What do the signs on the buildings usually say?

I believe it is Regional. As you also have the NOC - National Operating Centre.
 
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