Surviving council owned bus companies in 2016

[robertclark125]

Here, once again, is the annual thread where I look at who are the remaining municipal bus operators at the end of the year, and ask how many will be on the list at the end of 2016.

This list, as usual, does not include social needs municipals, such as DGC buses.

The remaining council owned bus operators are:

Lothian, Cardiff Bus, Newport Transport, Halton, Rossendale, Blackpool Transport, Network Warrington, Nottingham City Transport, Ipswich Buses, Thamesdown, Reading Buses.

The question is, how many of them will still be on this list in December 2016? I think all of them, despite some claims on another forum that a big group has apparently, lined up a deal to buy one of them.

How many of them do you all think will be on here in twelve months time?

 

[90019]

I doubt Lothian is going anywhere anytime soon.

 

[Robertj21a]

I doubt Lothian is going anywhere anytime soon.

Nor will Nottingham or Reading.

I'm always a bit wary of how much longer the likes of Halton and Warrington can survive, but there's nothing on the radar at present afaik.

 

[TheGrandWazoo]

Nor will Nottingham or Reading.

I'm always a bit wary of how much longer the likes of Halton and Warrington can survive, but there's nothing on the radar at present afaik.

Warrington, Newport and Ipswich are the most vulnerable given the amount of competition and recent trading.

 

[185143]

Nor will Nottingham or Reading.

I'm always a bit wary of how much longer the likes of Halton and Warrington can survive, but there's nothing on the radar at present afaik.

Warrington, Newport and Ipswich are the most vulnerable given the amount of competition and recent trading.

Warrington aren't faring (pun intended) too well...

Fares are fare more expensive than the equivalent fares in Manchester and Liverpool, services are frequently cut due to under use, which in turn puts the fare up, which leads to under use because they are poor value!

 

[cactustwirly]

Nor will Reading.

Much to my disappointment

 

[Robertj21a]

Much to my disappointment

A strange comment given how good Reading seems to be (to most people).

 

[90sWereBetter]

Ipswich have had a decent year, frequencies on their biggest earning routes, the 8 (Whitehouse via Bramford Road), 9/10 (Norwich Road corridor) and the 13 (Copdock via Chantry) have all been increased this year. Four ex-Lothian SPD Darts and three Tridents have been bought to replace the X-reg Darts, although three have been refurbished to DDA compliancy. The other big news is that three Mercedes Benz Citaros have been purchased brand new this autumn. However, these have somewhat inexplicably been used to convert the 9/10 to mostly single-deck operation, which makes no sense whatsoever given how busy the Norwich Road corridor is, and unlike the 13 (where the bridge on Ancaster Road precludes double deck buses), there's no physical restrictions. Daft decision imo. The other daft decision was to renumber the 7 and 11 routes as the 15A and the 6A, which always causes confusion at Tower Ramparts.

I believe the plan for 2016 is to replace the Y-reg Darts used on the X1/X3 routes, which look somewhat woebegone in comparison to the refurbished Volvo single deckers that First use on the competing 60/61 routes. New E200 MMCs have been rumoured. The X-reg Optare Spectras should also be withdrawn (and I'm looking forward to the day they go, horrible buses, and they can never keep time on the routes they're used on). There's also about 12 buses still to be repainted in the green/purple livery (two DAFs, six Tridents, four Optare Excels).

Ipswich also saw a change of MD earlier in the year.

 

[the101]

I doubt any will change hands next year. Halton and particularly Warrington are unlikely to interest the big groups if for no other reason than the toxic industrial relations they suffer from.

 

[90019]

Four ex-Lothian SPD Darts and three Tridents have been bought to replace the X-reg Darts

Those Darts are good little workhorses, but the Tridents are a bit crap.

 

[TheGrandWazoo]

A strange comment given how good Reading seems to be (to most people).

And just awarded UK Bus Operator of the Year at the UK Bus Awards
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

I doubt any will change hands next year. Halton and particularly Warrington are unlikely to interest the big groups if for no other reason than the toxic industrial relations they suffer from.

Was thinking more competition than purchase. Warrington obviously survived the onslaught 20 years ago from both Drawlane and MTL then!

 

[overthewater]

Im surprised Rossendale (Rosco) has never been eyed up by Transdev.

 

[Robertj21a]

Im surprised Rossendale (Rosco) has never been eyed up by Transdev.

It probably has. Doesn't mean they're willing to sell up though.

 

[cactustwirly]

A strange comment given how good Reading seems to be (to most people).

It's just that the're very expensive, which is because of a few unnecessary things:
A whole fleet of spare buses, so that routes don't have foreign branding
They replace their fleet every 5-10 years with brand new buses
They have hybrids and hydrogen buses which are expensive to operate and buy

I just feel that if they were private, then those things wouldn't happen and the bus fares would be cheaper.

 

[Hophead]

I think that many people would regard Reading's £1.90 standard fare as pretty reasonable. Or, at least, cheaper than their local fares.

 

[Robertj21a]

I think that many people would regard Reading's £1.90 standard fare as pretty reasonable. Or, at least, cheaper than their local fares.

Well, if Reading's standard fare is anything like £1.90 then I'm amazed that anyone has anything to complain about. Most towns and cities would welcome fares that low.

 

[cactustwirly]

Well, if Reading's standard fare is anything like £1.90 then I'm amazed that anyone has anything to complain about. Most towns and cities would welcome fares that low.

It's £3.70 for a return, and most journeys are less than 2 miles. I can get the train for a 6 mile journey for just £3.20 return

 

[overthewater]

How much is the Day or Weekly ticket?

 

[cactustwirly]

how much is the day or weekly ticket?

£4.30 & £16

 

[90sWereBetter]

It's just that the're very expensive, which is because of a few unnecessary things:
A whole fleet of spare buses, so that routes don't have foreign branding
They replace their fleet every 5-10 years with brand new buses
They have hybrids and hydrogen buses which are expensive to operate and buy

I just feel that if they were private, then those things wouldn't happen and the bus fares would be cheaper.

I never thought I'd see someone complaining that a bus company is too good.

 

[Antman]

I never thought I'd see someone complaining that a bus company is too good.

Indeed, I use Reading Buses from time to time and have always been very impressed, clean modern buses and well motivated staff and the colour coding must be very useful to those with poor eyesight, the pink buses look a bit garish but hey ho!

 

[tbone]

Bus use in Reading is also three times higher than the national average so they must be doing something right.

Other cities with significantly higher averages are Nottingham and Brighton- clearly quality operators make a big impact on people's perception of buses.

 

[the101]

It's just that the're very expensive, which is because of a few unnecessary things:
A whole fleet of spare buses, so that routes don't have foreign branding
They replace their fleet every 5-10 years with brand new buses
They have hybrids and hydrogen buses which are expensive to operate and buy

I just feel that if they were private, then those things wouldn't happen and the bus fares would be cheaper.

A couple of points.

There are no hydrogen buses in Reading so that argument is moot. There are gas-powered buses which are actually cheaper to run than diesels once the one-off cost of the fuelling station has been swallowed.

If Reading was privately owned it would also have profit targets compared to the current situation where the only target is not to lose money.

I never cease to be amazed at what some people find to moan about.

 

[overthewater]

£4.30 & £16

That day ticket seems a bit high.

 

[cactustwirly]

A couple of points.

There are no hydrogen buses in Reading so that argument is moot. There are gas-powered buses which are actually cheaper to run than diesels once the one-off cost of the fuelling station has been swallowed.

If Reading was privately owned it would also have profit targets compared to the current situation where the only target is not to lose money.

I never cease to be amazed at what some people find to moan about.

Perhaps I'm moaning about nothing, but if they were given a little bit of competition then I believe this could lead to lower fairs.

Regarding the compressed gas buses, the buses they replaced were fine and had a superior build quality.

I get the feeling that passengers get ripped-off for the sake of replacing perfectly good buses with shiny new ones. For example in Worcester a single is £1.30 and a return is £2.60.
Courtney charges £3.00 return to Earley (route 189), this would be £3.70 for Reading Buses

 

[TheGrandWazoo]

Perhaps I'm moaning about nothing, but if they were given a little bit of competition then I believe this could lead to lower fairs.

Regarding the compressed gas buses, the buses they replaced were fine and had a superior build quality.

I get the feeling that passengers get ripped-off for the sake of replacing perfectly good buses with shiny new ones. For example in Worcester a single is £1.30 and a return is £2.60.
Courtney charges £3.00 return to Loddon Bridge (route 189), this would be £3.70 for Reading Buses

A 9.2% increase in patronage would indicate they're doing something right. Never thought I'd see First being held up as something to aspire to - like the negative print of a normal post

 

[Robertj21a]

A 9.2% increase in patronage would indicate they're doing something right. Never thought I'd see First being held up as something to aspire to - like the negative print of a normal post

Ah, yes, First in Reading.........Remind me of the quality product that they brought to the local population ? Presumably the OP would prefer that sort of tatty competition !

 

[the101]

Perhaps I'm moaning about nothing, but if they were given a little bit of competition then I believe this could lead to lower fairs.

Regarding the compressed gas buses, the buses they replaced were fine and had a superior build quality.

I get the feeling that passengers get ripped-off for the sake of replacing perfectly good buses with shiny new ones. For example in Worcester a single is £1.30 and a return is £2.60.
Courtney charges £3.00 return to Earley (route 189), this would be £3.70 for Reading Buses

So in Reading the buses are modern and it's less than two quid for an adult single but it's not a good operation. With attitudes like yours it makes me wonder why the likes of Reading Buses bother.

 

[richw]

It's £3.70 for a return, and most journeys are less than 2 miles. I can get the train for a 6 mile journey for just £3.20 return

That's cheaper than a 2 mile journey here local to me that my wife regularly uses which is £4.50 return on wait for it.....an ex reading scania (high chance as 6 of the buses used in said route are ex reading scania)

 

[Hophead]

Perhaps I'm moaning about nothing, but if they were given a little bit of competition then I believe this could lead to lower fairs.

Regarding the compressed gas buses, the buses they replaced were fine and had a superior build quality.

I get the feeling that passengers get ripped-off for the sake of replacing perfectly good buses with shiny new ones. For example in Worcester a single is £1.30 and a return is £2.60.
Courtney charges £3.00 return to Earley (route 189), this would be £3.70 for Reading Buses

Good overnight service in Worcester is there? How about Sundays? Anything running on Boxing Day?