FA Cup third round 9th/10th Jan.

[londonbridge]

Tottenham vs Leicester-moved to Sunday for live tv coverage

Arsenal vs Sunderland-confirmed by SAFC for Saturday 3pm

Watford vs Newcastle-NUFC.com has date/kick-off still TBC

Newcastle vs Man Utd live on tv on Tuesday 12th which pretty much rules out moving this game to Sunday.

ECML closed all weekend between Darlington and Newcastle.

Heavy police presence at Kings X and on trains all day Saturday I imagine.

 

[BestWestern]

All clubs to issue tickets on chartered coaches with each game ticket in order to take ownership of the problems they create and avoid transport chaos.

Oh no, wait....

Football clubs & 'ownership of problems they create' in the same sentence; big LOL :roll:

 

[Essexman]

All clubs to issue tickets on chartered coaches with each game ticket in order to take ownership of the problems they create and avoid transport chaos.

Oh no, wait....

Football clubs & 'ownership of problems they create' in the same sentence; big LOL :roll:

So are all pubs, nightclubs, brewers, festivals, concerts, rugby clubs, demonstration organisers, large employers, cricket authorities, airports, airshows, shopping centres, etc etc also to take ownership and avoid 'transport chaos' they may indirectly cause?

 

[The Planner]

We did this before in another thread on White Hart Lane I believe....

 

[Rapidash]

I know I'll be avoiding Exeter like the plague when Liverpool turn up in January

 

[miami]

I assume the train companies are delighted at having many guilable people who are willing to pay a fortune for meaningless trinkets and entertainment. As a weekend service is less than a weekday service, and they have plenty of notice, they'll be putting on some extra chartered trains and laughing manically at the hunderds of thousands of pounds extra takings they'll get?

 

[tony6499]

I know I'll be avoiding Exeter like the plague when Liverpool turn up in January

It's on a Friday night so no trains back to Liverpool

 

[PHILIPE]

Live on BBC TV, hence Friday night. This is the new pattern.

 

[marks87]

I assume the train companies are delighted at having many guilable people who are willing to pay a fortune for meaningless trinkets and entertainment.

Sanctimonious nonsense.

 

[Drogba11CFC]

Eastleigh and Southampton both at home and all lines shut between Basingstoke and St Denys. Would it really have killed Network Rail to postpone whatever it was that needed doing for one poxy week?

(The fact that I live in Winchester and plan to go to the Chelsea game is pure coincidence.)

 

[johnnychips]

Eastleigh and Southampton both at home and all lines shut between Basingstoke and St Denys. Would it really have killed Network Rail to postpone whatever it was that needed doing for one poxy week?

(The fact that I live in Winchester and plan to go to the Chelsea game is pure coincidence.)

Yes it would. Rail engineering is planned months in advance.

 

[ungreat]

Hoping I aint working on any of the games that involve ECML.Plus the TV is now staying off! Not a football fan at all

 

[Gemz91]

Eastleigh and Southampton both at home and all lines shut between Basingstoke and St Denys. Would it really have killed Network Rail to postpone whatever it was that needed doing for one poxy week?

(The fact that I live in Winchester and plan to go to the Chelsea game is pure coincidence.)

Southampton are also at home the following week, and I hardly see Bolton taking many fans all the way to the south coast. They never travel in numbers when they're playing well, let alone how they're playing this season.

 

[LAX54]

Yes it would. Rail engineering is planned months in advance.

Try 'years in advance' !! F.A seem to blunder about blindly not taking any notice rail work or road work planned !

 

[BestWestern]

So are all pubs, nightclubs, brewers, festivals, concerts, rugby clubs, demonstration organisers, large employers, cricket authorities, airports, airshows, shopping centres, etc etc also to take ownership and avoid 'transport chaos' they may indirectly cause?

The only one of your rather tenuous comparisons that also involves sizeable numbers of vile, drunken louts intent on being as unsociable and, often, as violent as possible, is pubs & clubs. And yes, they do take ownership; they're called door staff and they don't come cheap. Who do football clubs employ to assist with the thuggery issues they have continued to harbour for decades? They rather take the view that it's entirely someone else's problem, as evidenced by whichever particularly socially responsible football company (they're businesses, not sporting organisations) it was who went to court to avoid contributing to the costs of policing their event. Profit of course being the most important factor these days. Never mind, that's what the taxpayer is there for... :roll:
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

Try 'years in advance' !! F.A seem to blunder about blindly not taking any notice rail work or road work planned !

Not their problem... See any pattern here!? The football authorities are concernd only with what time it will go on telly, they couldn't give a toss about people actually getting to the game; that's largely irrelevant.

 

[The Planner]

So no other sport has "drunken vile yobs"? and everything else is tenuous? I thought you denied any issue with Football? Obviously all other sports and activities are paragons of virtue in comparison, give me a break.... :roll::roll:

 

[greatkingrat]

The only one of your rather tenuous comparisons that also involves sizeable numbers of vile, drunken louts intent on being as unsociable and, often, as violent as possible, is pubs & clubs. And yes, they do take ownership; they're called door staff and they don't come cheap. Who do football clubs employ to assist with the thuggery issues they have continued to harbour for decades? They rather take the view that it's entirely someone else's problem, as evidenced by whichever particularly socially responsible football company (they're businesses, not sporting organisations) it was who went to court to avoid contributing to the costs of policing their event. Profit of course being the most important factor these days. Never mind, that's what the taxpayer is there for... :roll:

Pubs and clubs might have door staff but they don't care what happens after the customer leaves. Exactly the same as football clubs who employ stewards to keep order within the ground.

 

[Class 170101]

FA Cup third-round draw:

Arsenal v Sunderland
Birmingham v Bournemouth
Brentford v Chesterfield/Walsall
Bury v Bradford City
Cardiff City v Grimsby/Shrewsbury
Carlisle v Yeovil
Chelsea v Leyton Orient/Scunthorpe
Colchester v Charlton
Doncaster v Stoke City
Eastleigh v Bolton
Everton v Dagenham & Redbridge/Whitehawk
Exeter City v Liverpool
Huddersfield v Reading
Hull City v Brighton
Ipswich v Portsmouth
Leeds United v Rotherham
Manchester United v Sheffield United
Middlesbrough v Burnley
Newport County v Blackburn
Northampton v MK Dons
Norwich v Manchester City
Nottingham Forest v QPR
Oxford United v Swansea
Peterborough v Preston NE
Salford City/Hartlepool v Derby
Sheffield Wednesday v Fulham
Southampton v Crystal Palace
Tottenham v Leicester
Watford v Newcastle
West Bromwich v Bristol City
West Ham v Wolves
Wycombe v Aston Villa

Ties to be played 8-11 January

How does the FA and indeed Broadcasters propose to avoid all engineering works? I believe this is simply not possible.

NR do plan their works in advance and they do have an events list which covers major events including FA Cup matches.

However I believe it should be incumbent on the FA to funding viable alternatives, see example.

ECML closed all weekend between Darlington and Newcastle.

There is one service per hour (near as damn it) between London and Newcastle via York in both directions. This is better than it was a couple of years ago when the same diversion was in force. Tottenham travelled to Newcastle on Saturday for a league game and there were only two trains to get Spurs fans there in time for the game (15:00 Kick Off). The HST services in question were awful and I had no hesitation in complaining to East Coast for their service in both the number of trains provided and the staffing of the trains - the guard can count himself lucky not to have been assaulted for his bad attitude making a difficult situation worse. As for service provision I suggested splitting the service at York so London to Darlington Electric service with HSTs running between York and Scotland - at that time the Class 91s weren't allowed via the Durham Coast.

However I agree it may not be enough and wonder why neither XC or TPE are not also running services this way. Indeed some XC services are terminating at Leeds and not running though to at least York, this will put pressure on the remaining TPE and NT services between Leeds and York.

Perhaps this is something the FA should have a pot of money for to pay for driver training, route clearance and other associated items to encourage other operators to run diverted trains. Indeed the government should be including this in franchise contracts.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

Pubs and clubs might have door staff but they don't care what happens after the customer leaves. Exactly the same as football clubs who employ stewards to keep order within the ground.

They might do if the police don't support a license application for a new premises to open or retain its existing license. There has been an old cinema where I live thats been shut for years (relocated to a new site) but the police haven't supported its re-use for the nightime economy due to the potential trouble it could bring for them.

 

[Gemz91]

The only one of your rather tenuous comparisons that also involves sizeable numbers of vile, drunken louts intent on being as unsociable and, often, as violent as possible, is pubs & clubs. And yes, they do take ownership; they're called door staff and they don't come cheap. Who do football clubs employ to assist with the thuggery issues they have continued to harbour for decades? They rather take the view that it's entirely someone else's problem, as evidenced by whichever particularly socially responsible football company (they're businesses, not sporting organisations) it was who went to court to avoid contributing to the costs of policing their event. Profit of course being the most important factor these days. Never mind, that's what the taxpayer is there for... :roll:
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---


Not their problem... See any pattern here!? The football authorities are concernd only with what time it will go on telly, they couldn't give a toss about people actually getting to the game; that's largely irrelevant.

Football clubs do employ stewards on the turnstiles, similar to night clubs and bouncers. How ever, I'm yet to see a train or bus where a nightclub has paid for a bouncer to travel on board to control the behaviour of people going to the club.

 

[Class377]

...involves sizeable numbers of vile, drunken louts intent on being as unsociable and, often, as violent as possible...Who do football clubs employ to assist with the thuggery issues they have continued to harbour for decades?

Please explain. Figures from authorities show football fans on the whole are extremely well-behaved and arrest figures/banning orders are minuscule. I recently returned home on a train full of fans from different clubs and it was as quiet a journey as I've ever had, with no problems whatsoever. But that doesn't fit your agenda, does it?

Just because it may have been a problem in the 80s, and nowadays a very small minority cause issues, don't tar everyone with the same brush.

 

[BestWestern]

Please explain. Figures from authorities show football fans on the whole are extremely well-behaved and arrest figures/banning orders are minuscule. I recently returned home on a train full of fans from different clubs and it was as quiet a journey as I've ever had, with no problems whatsoever. But that doesn't fit your agenda, does it?

Just because it may have been a problem in the 80s, and nowadays a very small minority cause issues, don't tar everyone with the same brush.

How many trains full of football fans have you ever had the misfortune of being in charge of? Arrest figures are indeed minisicule, yes. So are BTP numbers...

 

[CockneySparrow]

It's on a Friday night so no trains back to Liverpool

Liverpool being a big supported club not all fans will be travelling back to Liverpool

 

[Minilad]

How many trains full of football fans have you ever had the misfortune of being in charge of? Arrest figures are indeed minisicule, yes. So are BTP numbers...

Quite a few personally. Also quite a few trains travelled on returning from games and the picture you paint doesn't match my experiences at all.
In fact I have had far more trouble with horse racing meetings at Cheltenham than I have with football supporters. Weekend trains in the evening around Birmingham this time of year because of the "German Market" are also far more trouble than they are worth.
As a football fan of nearly 45 years I simply do not recognise the picture you paint. Yes there are incidents but not nearly as frequently and as disruptive as you suggest.
A quick straw poll of guards at my depot would back up my assertion that big horse race meetings are much worse

 

[Rapidash]

Liverpool being a big supported club not all fans will be travelling back to Liverpool

Plenty of guys I know in Exeter support them.

More than that, its not exactly a secret that South Devon has a couple of hotels about the place, and the Turkey and Tinsel season wont end for a few weeks after crimbo, so the hotels will still be open.

 

[Class377]

How many trains full of football fans have you ever had the misfortune of being in charge of? Arrest figures are indeed minisicule, yes. So are BTP numbers...

I sincerely hope I don't end up travelling on one of your trains in the future if you will judge me before I even get on based on an event I chose to attend previously in the day. I, like many others I know, are well-behaved and if a train manager treated me like dirt purely because I had been to football earlier on I would be sure to put a complaint in.

 

[BestWestern]

I sincerely hope I don't end up travelling on one of your trains in the future if you will judge me before I even get on based on an event I chose to attend previously in the day. I, like many others I know, are well-behaved and if a train manager treated me like dirt purely because I had been to football earlier on I would be sure to put a complaint in.

Who on earth said anything about treating people 'like dirt'?

Football trains are a pain in the arse, because of the football fans they are full of; the issue is rather well versed across the network. One still has a job to do, and one still does it properly.

 

[PHILIPE]

Quite a few personally. Also quite a few trains travelled on returning from games and the picture you paint doesn't match my experiences at all.
In fact I have had far more trouble with horse racing meetings at Cheltenham than I have with football supporters. Weekend trains in the evening around Birmingham this time of year because of the "German Market" are also far more trouble than they are worth.
As a football fan of nearly 45 years I simply do not recognise the picture you paint. Yes there are incidents but not nearly as frequently and as disruptive as you suggest.
A quick straw poll of guards at my depot would back up my assertion that big horse race meetings are much worse

Like a crowd of Hoorah Henries on a train I was travelling on from Reading to Newbury once and this was before the Meeting had even started.

 

[Howardh]

I'm told 2-3000 Bradford fans will be making their way across the Great Divide for the game at Bury. Many of them will want to avoid the M62! I would imagine Bradford - Manchester Vic could be surprisingly busy for a Saturday afternoon; and is that line also part of the real-ale rail trail?

 

[yorkie]

This seems more about football than railways so have moved it to General Discussion.

It is not feasible for the rail industry to cancel engineering work to fit around football fixtures; I believe the relevant football authorities need to do more to accommodate the needs of fans. We've had quite a few discussions on this lately!

Please be sure to keep the discussion polite and respectful, and if anyone has a concern about any post please use the report button (

).

 

[sprinterguy]

However I agree it may not be enough and wonder why neither XC or TPE are not also running services this way.

Potentially lack of available paths (mainly on the busy section shared with Metro services between Sunderland and Pelaw, although long signalling sections further south on the Durham Coast might also have a hand in this) and the route knowledge of XC and TPE train crew (AFAIK a Crosscountry service hasn't worked down the Durham coast since Virgin days, nor a TPE service for around a decade).
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

I would imagine Bradford - Manchester Vic could be surprisingly busy for a Saturday afternoon; and is that line also part of the real-ale rail trail?

No, the Transpennine ale trail occupies the North Transpennine route via Huddersfield.