Gatwick Airport/Three Bridges to Brighton

[James Wake]

Hi all
Today my sister was travelling from Three Bridges to Brighton, she paid the £12.40 for the off-peak day return, route Any Permitted, the only ticket available. She used Thameslink both ways. I then looked at fares from Gatwick and found a £9.50 approx. Thameslink only off peak day return, and a £10.40 approx. Any Permitted. Seems a bit tight to me, and I'll remind her next time to select to buy tickets from Gatwick and start short.

I might even take this to my local paper if I am right. Considering Southern weren't helping customers for Clapham Junction much this morning from Three Bridges due to the disruption, I wasn't happy to find out about this as well.

Any thoughts on this anomaly I seem to have picked up, why is it more expensive and no Thameslink only option from a station that is nearer Brighton?

 

[causton]

There are lots of anomolies like this up and down the country, I know a few the other way round where it is cheaper to get a return to TBD than it is to Gatwick!

Operator specific fares seem to usually be for longer distance journeys i.e. Watford Junction to Northampton doesn't have any and is £24 for an off-peak day return Any Permitted (which is going to be almost certainly just London Midland), but most of the people buying that ticket could be accommodated on a £20 super off-peak return to Birmingham if it allowed break of journey! Luck of the draw I'm afraid!

 

[Stats]

Hypothesising I woukd say this: Southern are the fare setter from these stations but, from Three Bridges, they have had no incentive to keep the off-peak any permitted fare down as Thameslink operate all off-peak services between the peaks, and nearly all off-peak services after the evening peak. Therefore it makes little difference to Southern what the fare is because they get very little of the ORCATS revenue from this fare, and likewise as Thameslink get most of the ORCATs revenue they have had no incentive to offer a thameslink only fare.

From Gatwick there are more Southern services to Gatwick off-peak so there has been an incentive to keep the off-peak any permitted fare down.

Now DfT get all the revenue these anomolies should be ironed out over the next few years.

 

[100andthirty]

These anomolies will only get sorted out if there is a will (from GTR) or obligation (from DfT) or initiative (from staff) to do so. GTR is running a management contract, and will have different incentives from usual franchises. They also have some mighty obligations, and commissioning the Thameslink operation is right at the top of the list.

For me the whole ticketing system is an absolute muddle and needs root and branch review. I say, back to mileage and then have the three types to ordinary tickets, Anytime, Off peak and Super off peak.

 

[swt_passenger]

These anomolies will only get sorted out if there is a will (from GTR) or obligation (from DfT)

There definitely is an obligation to get rid of the separate Thameslink fares, it has been widely known about since the franchise was specified at the ITT stage.

The main question is when, because they are also obliged to do it gradually to avoid existing season ticket holders being hit with a sudden increase.

 

[gray1404]

My understanding is that they are required to bring the Any Permitted fare prices down so they are in line with the Thameslink only fares. Do correct me if I have not understood this correctly.....

 

[Stats]

No, Thameslink only fares will increase at a higher rate than other fares until they are equalised.

 

[neilm831]

I think fares are withdrawn/increased depending on mood of the fares team....Im going on my recent events with them.

 

[gray1404]

I thought there was a requirment by the Dft when Thameslink and Souther merged for the Thameslink and Any Permitted fares to be brought in line with each other but in such a way that the customer was not disadvantaged?

 

[Hadders]

I thought there was a requirment by the Dft when Thameslink and Souther merged for the Thameslink and Any Permitted fares to be brought in line with each other but in such a way that the customer was not disadvantaged?

You're in danger of falling for Government spin

Do you really think fares on one of the busiest routes in the country will be reduced? Of course they won't - this is the railway.

 

[Stats]

I thought there was a requirment by the Dft when Thameslink and Souther merged for the Thameslink and Any Permitted fares to be brought in line with each other but in such a way that the customer was not disadvantaged?

Yes, thats right. But the last part means that those that used Thameslink only tickets did not get a massive hike in one hit. The increase has to be gradual over a number of years. The words used in the ITT were
"Bidders must propose to the Department a plan that, at a minimum, will
avoid the holders of existing (FCC Only) season tickets commuting on
the Brighton Mainline facing hardship due to unexpectedly sharp or
unreasonable fare increases in the early years of the franchise."

It should also be noted that as the fares baskets of the two previous franchises have been combined, to increase Thameslink fares more while keeping the overall average increase of the fares basket in line with the overall permitted increase will require Any Permitted fares to be increased by less than the average