Should I pursue this or let it drop ?

[extendedpaul]

A couple of months ago at about 9.40 am on a weekday morning I bought a discounted ticket from a station in Kent using my Gold Card.

It would not operate the ticket barrier. They never do before 10 am. I went to the manned point - two staff standing there - and said something like "These tickets never seem to operate your barriers before 10 am". Not rude or confrontational, just a statement of fact. The ticket was glanced at for a split second and I was let through and boarded my train.

A few minutes later I had a call from my wife. One of the two gateline staff had approached her in her car outside the station entrance as she was about to drive away and said that I had "had a go" at his colleague when my ticket would not operate the barrier. She does not recall his exact words but formed the clear impression that I was being accused of travelling before 10am on a ticket only valid after that time.

I complained to the TOC that my ticket was valid and in any event it was inappropriate for my wife to be approached. I received an excellent detailed and wholly apologetic reply totally accepting my points and confirming my ticket was indeed valid but would not operate the barrier between 9.30 and 10 am weekdays. The reply included " ... with regard to the member of staff raising doubts with your wife about the validity of your ticket let me make it quite plain that there can be no excuses for this. In terms of the behaviour of the member of staff in question this has been addressed internally and we're confident this won't happen again"

That would have been the end of the matter - a momentary error of judgement by an employee and a well-handled complaint. However when I saw him again with exactly the same problem I said " I can assure you my ticket is definitely valid to travel now and there is no need to speak to my wife". He then said that he had no idea what I was talking about and when I related what had happened before he continued to say he knew nothing about it !

I then re-contacted the TOC and said that I no longer felt confident that my complaint was investigated as the person involved had apparently not been approached. I sought their comments.

Waited four weeks - no reply. Sent a reminder with copy - still no reply.

I currently feel I have been fobbed off. Would other forum users pursue the matter further or let it drop ?

 

[najaB]

Are you sure that you were speaking the right one of the two people?

 

[extendedpaul]

100% positive, wife recognised him immediately.

It's not a big station and only four staff seem to share gateline and platform duties.

 

[Agent_c]

Drop it, he was probably trying to prevent the situation escalating... Although your situation certainly seems weird.

 

[MikeWh]

I'd drop it. He probably didn't want to get into a conversation about it. As long as you don't get any trouble from the staff in the future then it's been dealt with.

 

[Aeion]

I would imagine that the employee would never have any intention of ever letting on he had been spoken too or disciplined. And so when you made your comment about speaking to your wife m, which lets be honest it was, they claimed to have no knowledge what so ever. As for not responding I couldn't comment although I can imagine it's difficult to readdress something that is believed to have been resolved. I suppose it's based on wether you believe the employee or customer relations.

 

[yorkie]

I'd drop it, but if you have any further issues, then refer back to it.

 

[extendedpaul]

Thanks all, my own feeling was to drop it but I still feel the TOC should at least have sent me another reply even if only acknowledging my comments - particularly when the response i did receive included an invitation to contact the author again if I wished.

 

[yorkie]

Yes, they should, though they won't divulge anything of note. And they might yet still do so. I'm sure the message would have been passed on though, so hopefully that will be the end of it.

 

[Tetchytyke]

Thanks all, my own feeling was to drop it but I still feel the TOC should at least have sent me another reply even if only acknowledging my comments

I'd have expected the TOC to acknowledge your letter, but that's about it. They cannot divulge anything about internal discipline.

 

[tony6499]

You're making a fuss of something that doesn't need doing , you had no need to speak to him the second time and he best thought to avoid a conflict situation

 

[cf111]

You're making a fuss of something that doesn't need doing , you had no need to speak to him the second time and he best thought to avoid a conflict situation

This. If I were his manager and your second letter landed on my desk I would have been commending him for not rising to your comment to him.

 

[gray1404]

I am sorry to hear you had this problem. It was totally wrong for your wife to be approached. What was your reasoning behind approaching him at the station and speaking to him about what happened? I personally would drop the matter. If you have further problems then I would contact the train company again. I understand you have wirtten to them again and they have not responded to your second complaint. If you are truly unhappy about this then you have two options. 1. Contact them again stating that you are unhappy and ask for the case to be looked at by a Manager. 2. Refer the Manager to Transport Focus. If doing either of these then you will need to explain why you are unhappy with the reply received thus far. I personally would leave it as it sounds like the TOC have dealt with his bad behaviour from the first occasion.

I am not sure if it was a good idea to approach him again, that said he should never have treated your wife in that way.

 

[extendedpaul]

There is one aspect of this matter I did not mention previously.

The person concerned was polite and friendly when I spoke to him most recently and he said he knew nothing about my complaint. When I explained about the Gold Card tickets being valid from 9.30 not 10.00 but rejected by the barriers he listened with interest. He did not come across as somebody speaking to a passenger who had made an upheld written complaint mainly about him.

My second letter to the TOC was simply to seek confirmation that my complaint really had been brought to the attention of staff and not to pursue a further complaint against the individual concerned. I still think that warranted a reply.

 

[Clip]

There is one aspect of this matter I did not mention previously.

The person concerned was polite and friendly when I spoke to him most recently and he said he knew nothing about my complaint. When I explained about the Gold Card tickets being valid from 9.30 not 10.00 but rejected by the barriers he listened with interest. He did not come across as somebody speaking to a passenger who had made an upheld written complaint mainly about him.

My second letter to the TOC was simply to seek confirmation that my complaint really had been brought to the attention of staff and not to pursue a further complaint against the individual concerned. I still think that warranted a reply.

I think the fact he was poilite shows that he was spoken too and didnt want to let on and nor will the company as it has nothing to do with you now. It seems that you were just spoiling for an issue by going back to him a second time. Its best to let it drop as no company will tell you what action they have taken apart from to tell you they did.

 

[bb21]

My second letter to the TOC was simply to seek confirmation that my complaint really had been brought to the attention of staff and not to pursue a further complaint against the individual concerned. I still think that warranted a reply.

If you find out that they did nothing despite saying they spoke to the member of staff concerned, what are you going to do?

Sometimes it is best to just let the matter drop, seeing that you did your bit complaining and got a satisfactory response. You won't get anything else out of it by pursuing the matter, unless you get hassle a second time, so may well just leave it until you get hassle again, if ever.

 

[talldave]

More importantly, ask them to reprogram the barriers to handle the revised gold card rules that have been in place for nearly a year. They seemingly thought it appropriate to implement a 10am start time when the validity was from 10am so what is their justification for not keeping the barriers aligned with the new rules? It's either incompetence or bloody mindedness, possibly both. I had the same issue with Southern.

 

[extendedpaul]

Others may feel I was over-reacting but in my opinion the original incident was quite a serious matter. The station employee did not know the person in the car was my wife - she could have been my manager, an employee or even a chauffeur - and he left her in no doubt that he thought I had boarded the train with an invalid ticket, hence her worried and annoyed phone call to me.

If for example the complaint was referred to the station manager who decided for whatever reason not to take any action then yes I do find that unacceptable and it makes a mockery of the TOC's letter to me.

 

[Clip]

They will have it on record and they very well wouldve had words - this is quite serious and the area manager wouldve also been involved too to make sure action was taken and this will be on his file - which is why he was oh so nice to you - staff dont forget these things and he wouldve known your face so knew that you were the one who complained and would have thought 'oh here he is trying to rub my nose in it by mentioning the incident and maybe trying to antagonize me into another confrontation'

I know you werent but that is exactly how I wouldve thought as you remember people you have got in trouble over rather than the ones you dont.

 

[gray1404]

Good point actually, the person dropping you off could have been or boss or anybody. Or even a date to whom you were trying to make a good first impression.

 

[Clip]

Good point actually, the person dropping you off could have been or boss or anybody. Or even a date to whom you were trying to make a good first impression.

Its irrelevant who was in the car - the staff member should not have approached and spoken to them at all.

 

[cf111]

Others may feel I was over-reacting but in my opinion the original incident was quite a serious matter. The station employee did not know the person in the car was my wife - she could have been my manager, an employee or even a chauffeur - and he left her in no doubt that he thought I had boarded the train with an invalid ticket, hence her worried and annoyed phone call to me.

If for example the complaint was referred to the station manager who decided for whatever reason not to take any action then yes I do find that unacceptable and it makes a mockery of the TOC's letter to me.

Then I'm afraid you don't have a leg to stand on - disciplinary matters between an employee and employer are private. They are allowed to tell you that the matter has been addressed internally, but now how it was addressed.

You approached this employee again and brought up an incident that has been dealt with, the employee dealt with it in what I would call an exemplary manner in line with his conflict avoidance and resolution training. What reaction or response were you looking for exactly?

For clarity, I feel that the initial incident of the employee approaching your wife was completely unacceptable.

 

[gray1404]

.....the staff member should not have approached and spoken to them at all.

I agree.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

They are allowed to tell you that the matter has been addressed internally, but now how it was addressed.

Thats one of the frustating things about the UK, all this date protection stuff. It can be frustrating. I have worked overseas most of my life and in other countries there is something more reassuring about them telling you what they have actaully done about it, more over when you have been wronged in the first place by the said party.

 

[34D]

It's a rail industry thing. A friend had cause to complain to a division of First Bus, and was told that the errant bus driver had been moved from the route and given a final written warning.

 

[najaB]

It's a rail industry thing. A friend had cause to complain to a division of First Bus, and was told that the errant bus driver had been moved from the route and given a final written warning.

It's not just a rail industry thing. If someone makes a complaint against one of our staff we will never confirm the details of exactly what happened as a result.

 

[gray1404]

whis is a real shame becaus it leaves the customer in a doubt, if they have been wrong done, if anything has actually been done about it and makes them wonder if the person got away with it.

 

[bb21]

whis is a real shame becaus it leaves the customer in a doubt, if they have been wrong done, if anything has actually been done about it and makes them wonder if the person got away with it.

Even if you are told what had been done, there is no guarantee that it had actually been done, unless you are shown a copy of the member of staff's personal disciplinary record, which is frankly none of anyone else's business.

So we are back to square one.

Really in these situations the only realistic thing to do is move on. If there is another issue, complain again.

Generally speaking if an organisation chooses to do nothing, that's their choice. Should this problem manifest itself to such an extent that there is a major customer service issue, the customer can vote with his feet. No organisation is stupid enough to do that.

 

[Hadders]

Thats one of the frustating things about the UK, all this date protection stuff. It can be frustrating. I have worked overseas most of my life and in other countries there is something more reassuring about them telling you what they have actaully done about it, more over when you have been wronged in the first place by the said party.

I don't know what happens in other countries but in my opinion matters between an employee and and employer are exactly that and should remain private.

 

[TheEdge]

whis is a real shame becaus it leaves the customer in a doubt, if they have been wrong done, if anything has actually been done about it and makes them wonder if the person got away with it.

I'm guessing you would only be happy if there was a public flogging of said staff member with the complainant doing the flogging and then being provided with a DVD of the flogging and souvenir coasters to remind you it happened...

You complained, company took action. If that action was an off the record chat from a manager or a final written warning disciplinary is none of your business.

Heaven forbid you ever made any sort of error of judgement, your posts here infer you are whiter than white... :roll:

 

[gray1404]

I'm guessing you would only be happy if there was a public flogging of said staff member with the complainant doing the flogging and then being provided with a DVD of the flogging and souvenir coasters to remind you it happened...

You complained, company took action. If that action was an off the record chat from a manager or a final written warning disciplinary is none of your business.

Heaven forbid you ever made any sort of error of judgement, your posts here infer you are whiter than white... :roll:

First off, I am not the OP. But I speak from the prespective as an Operations Manager who deals with client and customer complaints. When I am working off shore I do feel in a better position to be able to tell the wronged party, once we have established that their complaint in upheld, what we have done about it. This makes them feel heard, understood and gives them greater confidance that something has been done about the matter. By contrast, when dealing with an issue in the UK I am limited as to what I am allowed to say. I am not able to give the wronged party and real information other then a general assurance that the matter will be dealt with. This makes it harder to regain customer confidance.

An "off the record chat from the manager" would not be dealing with an issue in the slightest if the OP made a formalised complaint. Personally when I made a mistake I admit it and say sorry in a sincere way. That is the best way to refuse any situaiton. Sadly in the UK I see too much pride and ego taking place for people to do this. Sometime people do but it is not often. Moreover, I see people standing their ground and being stubern and it become about their own personal pride and not wanting to back down, rather then remembering what the real issue at hand is. Thankfully, I get mainly off shore work these days