European Migration Crisis - General Discussion

[fowler9]

Given the fact that we helped create the borders of Iraq and Syria and the we then went on to change the power structure over there very recently after 9/11 do we not have some responsibility towards the well being of the refugees? We helped to create IS by creating the power vacuum.

 

[TheKnightWho]

Brilliant piece of complete idiocy by saying one minute anybody and everybody can come into Germany and the next turning them away. The border will see some really bad scenes and it will only be because of the Germans massive and totally deserved guilt complex which was the reason for the stupid "everybody's welcome" statement in the first place.

"totally deserved guilt complex"

Explain? If you're referring to WW2, the majority of Germans alive today had nothing to do with it.

 

[Johnuk123]

Germany now having exited Schengen has given the green light to any other European country to do like wise. Several Eastern European countries are now building walls and fences and threatening prison to any migrants without papers.

Germany and Austria are now saying if other countries don't take a large number of migrants they will pass a law by majority voting to cut funds to those countries, that's called blackmail in most parts.

Germany has totally caused this massive problem by inviting the whole of North Africa then slamming the door in their face when they realised what a stupid mistake they'd made.The migrants now in Europe are going to be left in limbo and we're going to see scenes of mass protest and violence in the coming days by people cruelly mislead big-style by the megalomaniac Merkel who is now surely on borrowed time.

 

[ainsworth74]

They haven't actually exited Schengen. What happened today may well end up, once the dust settles, being seen as the first step towards the disintegration of Schengen but currently Germany haven't actually left.

 

[Johnuk123]

They haven't actually exited Schengen. What happened today may well end up, once the dust settles, being seen as the first step towards the disintegration of Schengen but currently Germany haven't actually left.

According to the Guardian which is never ever wrong on this forum they technically have.

http://www.theguardian.com/world/20...lose-borders-exit-schengen-emergency-measures

The decision means that Germany has effectively exited temporarily from the Schengen system.

 

[TheKnightWho]

Germany now having exited Schengen has given the green light to any other European country to do like wise. Several Eastern European countries are now building walls and fences and threatening prison to any migrants without papers.

Germany and Austria are now saying if other countries don't take a large number of migrants they will pass a law by majority voting to cut funds to those countries, that's called blackmail in most parts.

Germany has totally caused this massive problem by inviting the whole of North Africa then slamming the door in their face when they realised what a stupid mistake they'd made.The migrants now in Europe are going to be left in limbo and we're going to see scenes of mass protest and violence in the coming days by people cruelly mislead big-style by the megalomaniac Merkel who is now surely on borrowed time.

Or perhaps, in the real world, what's happened is that they've placed limits on how many they're taking because they realised that it would get out of control otherwise.

That doesn't mean they've "slammed the door", "exited Schengen" or "invited the whole of North Africa" (for all the scaremongering, the majority of people are from nowhere of the sort) or done any of the other things you've banged on about in the hope of demonising Germany.

We get it - you don't like the EU. At least try and combat it in terms that don't make the rest of us think you're living in fantasyland. Acting like the EU and Germany are one and the same is utter nonsense, and frankly seems to stem from our own ridiculous obsession with WW2. And before you bring up any of the examples of Merkel throwing her weight around, you might notice that she can only do so with the assent of many of countries - many of whom want to do exactly what she does.
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According to the Guardian which is never ever wrong on this forum they technically have.

If you suspend something, you do not leave it.

 

[deltic]

It appears the border controls are only presently between Austria and Germany - and still allow the free movement of EU citizens.

 

[radamfi]

Border controls were also put in place during the 2006 World Cup.

 

[Qwerty133]

Merkel is like a misguided teen who advertised her houseparty on Facebook, then when everyone turns up, she panics and slams the door shut.

Paul Nuttall (@paulnuttallukip) https://twitter.com/paulnuttallukip/status/643125219847204864

I like this comparison...

 

[WestCoast]

As far as I understand the terms of the Schengen Agreement, members are permitted to reintroduce general controls at certain borders under exceptional circumstances.

Anyone who think that Schnegen is a completely free zone is mistaken, targeted controls are allowed and commonplace and do no longer have to take place directly on the border. Germany often uses surveillance, targeting what it sees as higher risk traffic, such as long-distance coaches arriving from the Czech Republic.

 

[Johnuk123]

German girls told to cover up to protect themselves from migrants.

http://newobserveronline.com/german-girls-must-cover-arms-and-legs-to-appease-syrian-refugees/

German Girls Must Cover Arms and Legs to Appease Syrian “Refugees”
So many non white invaders from the Middle East have entered Germany over the past few months that a school headmaster in Bavaria has been forced to ask female pupils to cover up their arms and legs—for their own protection against local Syrian “refugees.”
“The Syrian citizens are mainly Muslims and speak Arabic. The refugees are marked by their own culture. Because our school is directly next to where they are staying, modest clothing should be adhered to. Revealing tops or blouses, shorts or miniskirts could lead to misunderstandings.”
The “misunderstandings” to which the letter refers are, of course, sexual attacks upon the white girls, as has happened everywhere else where Third World males have been allowed free rein in European communities.
For example, in Sweden, the number of nonwhite rapes of white females has risen so dramatically that that nation has now been officially classified as the “Rape Capital of the West” and is now number two on the list of rape countries, surpassed only by Lesotho in Southern Africa.

The new influx of Syrian migrants seem to be mixing well with the locals, this is the unfortunate result of a middle ages culture being introduced to a more progressive modern one.

 

[Tetchytyke]

Brilliant piece of complete idiocy by saying one minute anybody and everybody can come into Germany and the next turning them away.

Not really.

The Germans are trying to force all European states to take their fair share, and the central European countries (e.g. Hungary, Czech Republic) are refusing to do so.

This is a very good way of focusing a few minds in those countries.

"If you won't take any, we won't either, and then they will all be your problem".

Merkel is many things, but an idiot she is not.

 

[Johnuk123]

Not really.

The Germans are trying to force all European states to take their fair share, and the central European countries (e.g. Hungary, Czech Republic) are refusing to do so.

This is a very good way of focusing a few minds in those countries.

"If you won't take any, we won't either, and then they will all be your problem".

Merkel is many things, but an idiot she is not.

I like your use of the word "force" by the Germans and also "fair"

Who decides what's fair ? Germany I presume, some things never change.

 

[fowler9]

I think we should take our fair share of refugees from a crisis we helped to create.

 

[Hornet]

Perhaps Putin will be welcoming his fair share, seeing as Russia is actively aiding Assad.

 

[Antman]

We get it - you don't like the EU. At least try and combat it in terms that don't make the rest of us think you're living in fantasyland.

Who is we? Don't you mean "I get it"? It always makes me chuckle how you purport to be representing the masses.................and you then accuse others of living in fantasyland
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I think we should take our fair share of refugees from a crisis we helped to create.

I don't think many people would argue with that, but what is a genuine refugee (as opposed to a migrant/freeloader) and how many can be accommodated in the UK?

 

[TheKnightWho]

Who is we? Don't you mean "I get it"? It always makes me chuckle how you purport to be representing the masses.................and you then accuse others of living in fantasyland
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I don't purport to be representing anyone - I do think certain posters are living in fantasyland though.

 

[Johnuk123]

Germany has totally caused this massive problem by inviting the whole of North Africa then slamming the door in their face when they realised what a stupid mistake they'd made.The migrants now in Europe are going to be left in limbo and we're going to see scenes of mass protest and violence in the coming days by people cruelly mislead big-style by the megalomaniac Merkel who is now surely on borrowed time.

Well the violence has started with tear gas and water cannons being used in Serbia/Hungary.

Totally foreseeable this was, anybody with half a brain knows you don't invite unlimited numbers of migrants into your country and within days slam the door in their face.
Merkel should resign as the first deaths will be her fault.

I have little sympathy for the vast majority of the Calais migrants as they are plainly not refugees.
The ones in Hungary do seem more mixed and although they have been described as 80% young men, there does seem to be a lot more families and would fit the criteria of refugees.
Something is going to have to give as these people aren't going to go back where they have come from.

 

[Geezertronic]

I had the misfortune to watch the news last night for the first time in a while and there was a report from the Hungary border and the vast majority of the people did appear to be men without families. Where are their families? Why are these men travelling as refugees perceivably alone? I can certainly believe the 80% male value given what the reports show, and that is not even mentioned in the mainstream media which is even more confusing to me.

 

[deltic]

I had the misfortune to watch the news last night for the first time in a while and there was a report from the Hungary border and the vast majority of the people did appear to be men without families. Where are their families? Why are these men travelling as refugees perceivably alone? I can certainly believe the 80% male value given what the reports show, and that is not even mentioned in the mainstream media which is even more confusing to me.

UNHCR report that 72% of refugees that have crossed the Mediterranean this year are adult males, 13% are women and 15% children. The high proportion of males is in part due to males escaping from being drafted into various armed forces.

 

[Johnuk123]

UNHCR report that 72% of refugees that have crossed the Mediterranean this year are adult males, 13% are women and 15% children. The high proportion of males is in part due to males escaping from being drafted into various armed forces.

Conscription in Eritrea is particularly harsh, it's supposed to be 4-5 years but it's actually open ended and they let you leave when they feel like it, if at all.
Explains why so many at Calais are from Eritrea.

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The Islamic terrorist shot dead today in Berlin is the first terror attack Germany has had and it will have come at exactly the wrong time for the thousands of muslims just arriving in the country.

 

[ExRes]

Rather odd how little media coverage this shooting has received, I can only find it covered by Telegraph, Mirror and Reuters

The dead man was a convicted Islamic terrorist, although whether his attack on the policewoman was terror related or not is unclear at present

 

[Senex]

Rather odd how little media coverage this shooting has received, I can only find it covered by Telegraph, Mirror and Reuters

The dead man was a convicted Islamic terrorist, although whether his attack on the policewoman was terror related or not is unclear at present

I haven't heard any mention or seen any news of it on the BBC, Rather, all the attention seemed to be on more violence at borders, this time Croatia and Slovenia, and on the individual who electrocuted himself on Eurotunnel lines.

 

[Johnuk123]

Merkel says there is no limit on how many migrants Germany can take.
That gives the signal to migrants to get on the move through Europe.

A few days later she firmly shuts the door creating absolute mayhem all across southern Europe, Her migration and asylum minister is forced to quit after it becomes obvious Germany cannot cope.

Machine guns on the borders, tear gas, water cannon, what a cock-up of monumental proportions by the EU, or specifically Merkel who will never recover from this utter farce.

 

[Hornet]

Merkel says there is no limit on how many migrants Germany can take.
That gives the signal to migrants to get on the move through Europe.

A few days later she firmly shuts the door creating absolute mayhem all across southern Europe, Her migration and asylum minister is forced to quit after it becomes obvious Germany cannot cope.

Machine guns on the borders, tear gas, water cannon, what a cock-up of monumental proportions by the EU, or specifically Merkel who will never recover from this utter farce.

German Banks via the German Government pressurising the ECB to force Countries to pay back fully the German Bank Bondholders Unsecured Loans, forcing many in those affected Countries into Austerity.
Germany unilaterally suspending the Dublin Agreement.
German Ministers threatening other Countries with financial sanctions.
Germany wanting to change the rules to bring in Majority Voting to compel unwilling member States to take Migrants, (many of whom feel that they should not have to register in the first EU Country they arrive in, contrary to the Dublin Agreement).
Germany closing it's borders as they suddenly realise that their Southern States cannot cope.
I see a pattern here.

 

[Jonny]

I'm surprised that no-one in the UK mainstream media has picked up on this:

http://www.ibtimes.co.uk/migrant-cr...ist-during-violent-crackdown-refugees-1520070

Migrant crisis: Hungarian Police claim arrest of 'terrorist' during violent crackdown on refugees

(Article continues)

 

[Aldaniti]

Mrs Merkel seems to have gone very quiet....

 

[Jonny]

Mrs Merkel seems to have gone very quiet....

I wonder...

What has been said to her by her military intelligence perhaps?

 

[Johnuk123]

Mrs Merkel seems to have gone very quiet....

In years to come her proclamation inviting every migrant to come to Germany who could get there will be seen for what it is.

An unparalleled political error which will turn out to be the most massive and monumental European mistake since the end of WW2.

http://www.express.co.uk/news/world/606765/Migrant-crisis-refugees-Europe-Angela-Merkel

"Europe must act together and take on responsibility. Germany can't shoulder this task alone."
But, striking a more sceptical tone on migration than in previous weeks, Mrs Merkel also warned that Germany could not shelter those who were moving for economic reasons rather than to flee the horrors of war and persecution.
Speaking at a gathering of the Verdi trade union, she added: "We are a big country. We are a strong country. But to make out as if we alone can solve all the social problems of the world would not be realistic."

Backtracking big style there Angela.
The cheek of this woman is astounding, before her "everybody welcome" speech I don't remember rioting at the borders, she alone has caused this crisis. Not only the migrant disaster but the Greek one as well.

 

[Metrailway]

A mandatory quota system has just gone through via qualified majority voting (QMV) meaning that Czech Republic, Slovakia, Hungary, and Romania will be forced, despite large scale opposition, to settle migrants in their nations. 120,000 migrants will be settled within the EU under this system. From memory, this is the first time that QMV has been used in such a controversial area to overcome objections from member states.

Reuters have also reported in the past few days that Iraqi soldiers are now deserting their posts fighting ISIL and are migrating to Europe.