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Liverpool Lime Street Upgrade Capacity 2016/17

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lfc2014uk

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Liverpool Lime Street Station will be completely overhalled in 2016/17 according to Network Rail and Northen Rail staff at the station. The announcement will be made after the election!

The station will be completely shut down for 8 weeks in the summer to allow all new signalling to be installed from edge hill down into lime street itself.

What will also happen:

*Platform 6 will be straightened
*Platform 6A (siding) will be brought back into use by moving platform out from main structure pillars. This will become new Platform 7 (HST)
*Old Platform 7 will be moved to the right to accomodate the new platform 7 and be renumbered Platform 8
*The Virgin Trains Ticket Office, Retail Units, Old Post Office glass unit and Virgin Trains waiting rooms will be demolished and relocated into the car park located near to the Skelhorne St entrance. (There will be no car park after work is completed. In place will be two new HST platforms numbered Platform 9 & 10
* Old Platforms 8 & 9 will be renumbered as 11 & 12
* The main concourse where most of the retail area is (WH Smiths & Boots etc) will have a 1st floor concourse added with esculators so more retail and cafe restaurant estabishments can open.
* Costa Coffee will be demolished and a row of new ticket barriers will be installed.

All this work is being done as part of the Northern Hub/Powerhouse. By doing this the capacity at Lime Street will dramaticly increase more trains in and out every hour.

Between 2015-2020 at least 6 new direct rail services will start.

*Liverpool - Glasgow & Edinburgh via Newton-Le-Willow Spur
(Semi Fast - TPE Winners), (Fast - WCML Winners)
*Liverpool - Cardiff via Shrewsbury (Halton Curve reopening)
Arriva Trains Wales
*Liverpool - Holyhead via Chester (Halton Curve reopening) -
Arriva Trains Wales, WCML Franchise Winners
*Liverpool - Hull via Halifax/Bradford Line - Northern Franchise Winners
*Liverpool - London Euston (2nd) - Semi Fast/Fast WCML Franchise winners
 
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RailUK Forums

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158756

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swt_passenger said:
Station alterations were covered in an existing thread in January:

http://www.railforums.co.uk/showthread.php?t=111110

What is the evidence for a Glasgow service, and a second Euston service?

These are mentioned every few weeks, but are they in a formal RUS or track access application anywhere?
Click to expand...

A Glasgow service seems to be a possible option in the TPE ITT, but its far from certain or even likely.
The Halton Curve has no committed services (does it even have a business case produced yet?).
A second Euston service might be possible after Norton Bridge is finished, but then they're going to start HS2 work at Euston.
The Northern ITT doesn't suggest any new services from Liverpool.
 
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driver_m

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There was a plan floating about that showed lime St effectively only getting one extra platform as it would lose pl1, but add two between 7&8. The TPE plan did seem to say bidders had to consider a long distance service that stopped at a St Helens station and go to at least Carlisle IIRC.
 
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The Planner said:
Good luck with that.
Click to expand...

'Might' was intended to convey that I'm not really sure what the current state of 'what the West Coast can do when' (or what various organisations claim it can do) is. The general gist of the sentence was that it won't happen anyway.
 
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Y961 XBU

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Looking at the Before and After the dis- used Platform 1 is going to look really stupid i think, Except for that i am looking forward to these Improvements
 
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Bletchleyite

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Y961 XBU said:
Looking at the Before and After the dis- used Platform 1 is going to look really stupid i think, Except for that i am looking forward to these Improvements
Click to expand...

It would appear to me that while P1 would be short, and would only be usable with a relatively short train in P2, this would still be useful in the manner of the very similar P12 in Manc Picc.
 
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Y961 XBU

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Neil Williams said:
It would appear to me that while P1 would be short, and would only be usable with a relatively short train in P2, this would still be useful in the manner of the very similar P12 in Manc Picc.
Click to expand...

Is Platform 1 staying then? Thought i read in the other Feed they where getting rid of Plat 1 but would be good if it was kept in use
 
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Bletchleyite

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Y961 XBU said:
Is Platform 1 staying then? Thought i read in the other Feed they where getting rid of Plat 1 but would be good if it was kept in use
Click to expand...

No it appears it is going, but I would suggest it should be retained as a short extra platform, as you never know when you might need it (the semi-disused P7 at Preston has, for instance, been of use a few times when there has been weather damage to the roof closing other platforms, as have the old RES platforms).
 
507021

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I really like those proposals and I think they would really benefit Lime Street in a number of ways. The addition of extra shopping facilities is a big plus for me - I've always thought that in comparison to a lot of other mainline terminus stations Lime Street has very few retail outlets. The only thing I'm wondering though is how far the new level of shops will actually extend across the concourse area

I also agree about Platform 1. It should be kept open

I think that the installation of ticket barriers is something that has long been overdue at Lime Street. I'm looking forward to seeing plans for the upgrade of the concourse area - and indeed the end result of the whole upgrade
 
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HowardGWR

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Paul Sidorczuk said:
Is this thread one of the usual "April 1st" threads that occur every year without fail on this website, but was late in going to print....:roll:
Click to expand...

I don't quite understand the sarcastic joke. I found the thread interesting, especially as a 'foreigner'. On the face of it, the presentation seemed to include the unnecessary giving up of two platforms leaving unsightly bare areas for litter to gather and buddleia to flourish. Is there another way of supporting the structure than all those pillars? Photos anyone?

Edit:
I have googled and yes, the pillars are rather thick, are they not?!

I don't know how to incorporate images but I found this one.

http://www.digicamreview.com/photos/gallery/sony_ericsson_satio/27112009075_G
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---
 
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HowardGWR

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55z

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One reason for the remodeling is to get longer platforms so they can have two 4 car EMU's on most platforms which they cannot in some platforms. The list of new services is purely speculation as except the Liverpool to Scotland services (this is a possiblity in the Trans Pennine EXpress specification but not definate) there is no proposals but some people are dreaming of what they would like on the other in the list.
 
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lfc2014uk

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Merseytravel has asked that the Glasgow route be reintroduced so that passengers can go direct rather than via wigan on northern trains. Connecting both cities. The London 2nd service has been asked for also by MerseyTravel chairman to go via St helens junction to make it more attractive to passengers living on the area to go direct rather than to Liverpool lime street or Warrington Bank Q
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---
stockport1 said:
when did Scotland move south?
Click to expand...

Newton le willows spur goes North
Earlstown spur goes south
 
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Wavertreelad

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HowardGWR said:
Yes, thanks, that is to what I was referring. I get the pillars now, but the loss of sidings does seem somewhat shortsighted. Actually, I don't see how the pillars are a problem, really, if you have sliding doors on trains, as we do now.
Click to expand...

This image I think shows the issue,

http://www.fotolibra.com/gallery/756622/liverpool-lime-street-train-station/

the platform itself is far too narrow for passenger use in it's present form. I would have thought there is sufficient space to widen this platform and move the existing Virgin platform further south which would then significantly increase the capacity, especially if the station is to handle more longer distance trains. The question then would be were would you fit any HS2/HS3 platforms if either or both lines were built?
So far we have seen proposals for HS2 platforms at Lime Street, but if HS3 is built surely more platform space would be required?
 
LNW-GW Joint

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lfc2014uk said:
Merseytravel has asked that the Glasgow route be reintroduced so that passengers can go direct rather than via wigan on northern trains. Connecting both cities. The London 2nd service has been asked for also by MerseyTravel chairman to go via St helens junction to make it more attractive to passengers living on the area to go direct rather than to Liverpool lime street or Warrington Bank Q
Click to expand...

Neither TPE nor Virgin has enough stock for new services.
We will find out TPE's plans when the franchise winner is revealed later this year.
Nothing will happen on Virgin till the next WC rebid in 2016.

Network Rail must be working on a general capacity spec for the upgrade.
I think it's a bit rich to link it to Northern Hub/Powerhouse.
The track and signalling in the area (and line to Weaver Jn) is life expired and needs wholesale renewal anyway, like Crewe-Manchester.
The cost for this is already in CP5 funding.
Really, the upgrade should have been done under WCRM, but all they did was resignal Ditton.
 
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HowardGWR

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Wavertreelad said:
This image I think shows the issue,

http://www.fotolibra.com/gallery/756622/liverpool-lime-street-train-station/

the platform itself is far too narrow for passenger use in it's present form. I would have thought there is sufficient space to widen this platform and move the existing Virgin platform further south which would then significantly increase the capacity, especially if the station is to handle more longer distance trains. The question then would be were would you fit any HS2/HS3 platforms if either or both lines were built?
So far we have seen proposals for HS2 platforms at Lime Street, but if HS3 is built surely more platform space would be required?
Click to expand...

Yes I see that now, much better photo, thanks. I imagine your points must have been considered....... although.....
 
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driver_m

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Neil Williams said:
What was the reason for removing P1?

That Costa will be missed if only because it was where I had my first ever fancy coffee! :)
Click to expand...

Looking at the notes, its so a pendo could use pl2 if they were doing chat moss runs. Dont see why they could do something like the setup at pl9 at piccadilly. Basically to avoid conflicting moves which cause problems down there. For.me the best thing they could do is make it fully bi Di like Manchester piccadilly approaches. I guess the signalling planners will do a good job. But one extra platform doesnt seem enough when you think of the constraints on the current station which has scope to have far more services running out of it.
 
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LNW-GW Joint said:
Neither TPE nor Virgin has enough stock for new services.
We will find out TPE's plans when the franchise winner is revealed later this year.
Nothing will happen on Virgin till the next WC rebid in 2016.

Network Rail must be working on a general capacity spec for the upgrade.
I think it's a bit rich to link it to Northern Hub/Powerhouse.
The track and signalling in the area (and line to Weaver Jn) is life expired and needs wholesale renewal anyway, like Crewe-Manchester.
The cost for this is already in CP5 funding.
Really, the upgrade should have been done under WCRM, but all they did was resignal Ditton.
Click to expand...

True but the capcity upgrade would need the support of the existing operators as they would have a view beyond the franchise end dates and also because of the disruption it would cause whilst the station is being reconstructed and resignalled which is in the Engineering plans already as a 30+ days blockade, for summer 2016 as I recall.
One would expect a half hourly all day service to be in Virgin's plans for future railway.
 
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