Every Tube ticket office to close

[yorkie]

As far as I am aware it is not possible to purchase child, disabled, privilege and certain other reduced ticket types from the self service machines. There is obviously a need for this facility to be retained.

They will have to enable the machines to carry out all transactions. Some may need to be verified by staff.

This could lead to better service. At present, people trying to get a Railcard discount loaded onto Oyster are being fobbed off at some stations being told it cannot be done.

When this can be done by machine, the passenger can bring it all up and ask the staff member to approve it. The staff who deny existence of this facility will no longer be able to deny it exists if the passenger has found it themselves.

 

[Mojo]

No doubt it is a similar scene at larger stations in the outer Zones too. As far as I am aware it is not possible to purchase child, disabled, privilege and certain other reduced ticket types from the self service machines. There is obviously a need for this facility to be retained.

You can buy Child tickets on the machines, Paper Priv tickets on the Underground were withdrawn as part of the 2015 fare change, not sure what "disabled" tickets are but you can buy Disabled Railcard tickets on the machines.

 

[hassaanhc]

I don't understand the reasons put forward for the closure of all but 6 LUL ticket offices. During most of the day one can observe queues and clusters of people at almost all of the ticket office windows within the Zone 1 area. No doubt it is a similar scene at larger stations in the outer Zones too. As far as I am aware it is not possible to purchase child, disabled, privilege and certain other reduced ticket types from the self service machines. There is obviously a need for this facility to be retained.

You can buy Child tickets on the machines, Paper Priv tickets on the Underground were withdrawn as part of the 2015 fare change, not sure what "disabled" tickets are but you can buy Disabled Railcard tickets on the machines.

They updated the software on the TVMs last month, which now allow you to buy tickets to most National Rail stations in the Network Area, as well as boundary zone extensions for a travelcard held on Oyster. I say "most stations" as when the software was first released, I couldn't find Southend Central or Victoria on there to extend my Z1-5 season to, but yesterday I managed to find them included, so they may be other omissions.

 

[island]

At many stations I have seen the only MFM not giving change when I came through, preventing passengers from paying with banknotes.

 

[Mojo]

They updated the software on the TVMs last month, which now allow you to buy tickets to most National Rail stations in the Network Area, as well as boundary zone extensions for a travelcard held on Oyster. I say "most stations" as when the software was first released, I couldn't find Southend Central or Victoria on there to extend my Z1-5 season to, but yesterday I managed to find them included, so they may be other omissions.

The ability to buy through tickets to NR stations has existed since an upgrade a couple of years ago, but you are right in that the most recent upgrade allows boundary zone extensions (as well as a screen redesign and more staff functions) which is new. By the way, on certain tickets Railcard holders can save 5p as LU uses the old methodology for calculating discounts

 

[jon0844]

Will we ever see an option added to let you virtually touch in an Oyster card, so that in the following example I don't need to get a paper ticket extension (more expensive) when using a paper ticket and wishing to go the last bit on Oyster PAYG?

Example; St Albans One Day Travelcard... into London, around and about and then up to Cheshunt. Cheshunt is Zone 8 and I can use Oyster, but I can't touch in at the boundary so I have to buy a paper extension (and queue up as AGA still don't let you select a different starting station or boundary).

Imagine if you could go to a TVM (Underground or even at a National Rail station), tap in, select a station you wish to 'start from' and then have it set to remain valid for, say, an hour or two (in case you change your mind, although you could either have it time out, require someone go back to a TVM, or simply 'override' it if you touch in elsewhere).

That would be a very nice addition to the machines, although I realise that even ticket offices can't do this.

 

[swt_passenger]

Will we ever see an option added to let you virtually touch in an Oyster card, so that in the following example I don't need to get a paper ticket extension (more expensive) when using a paper ticket and wishing to go the last bit on Oyster PAYG?

That sounds suspiciously like the ill-fated Oyster Extension permit, doesn't it? Hated by all and binned at the first opportunity....

 

[RJ]

That sounds suspiciously like the ill-fated Oyster Extension permit, doesn't it? Hated by all and binned at the first opportunity....

Touching in and touching out is something that many people can't remember to do. Given this is one of the most fundamental parts of using the card, I don't think there should be any great hurry to add anything that remotely complicates use of the card!

 

[leytongabriel]

Adding to the woes of ill-fated Blackhorse Rd, all three ticket machines were down on Sunday morning and the booking office was closed. Staff at both Blackhorse Rd and Kings Cross (where I exited) didn't really seem to know what to do. Is there a procedure which doesn't involve pfaffing around with machines and barriers at the destination station? It's TfL's fault if passengers ( I'm not going to use the 'c word' !) can't buy tickets so there should be some kind of recognition / immunity from getting into trouble shouldn't there?

 

[bicbasher]

While queuing at Charing Cross, the customer in front of me asked for 23 Oyster Cards loaded with £30 + deposit which took 15 mins because the clerk had to do each transaction separately.

One of the CSA's came over and was able to get most people using the machines, although they had to go into the staff section of the POM for some transactions. The people who use the ticket office facility today in the queue are those who aren't technical wizards with touch screen ticketing.

However the chap behind me and myself had to stay and wait because of requiring an Annual Season and an Oyster Usage Statement.

 

[island]

It would have been polite for the customer wanting 30 Oyster cards to allow people to skip into the queue to do short transactions.

 

[A-driver]

It would have been polite for the customer wanting 30 Oyster cards to allow people to skip into the queue to do short transactions.

I agree in principle however practically it's unlikely to work. If there is a constant stream of people joining the que how long do they continue to let people que jump before making the transaction they turned up to do?

 

[gswindale]

Simple answer is:
Do one card. Join back of queue.
Do next card. Join back of queue.

Takes you a bit longer; but shows a little respect for your fellow passenger

 

[A-driver]

Simple answer is:
Do one card. Join back of queue.
Do next card. Join back of queue.

Takes you a bit longer; but shows a little respect for your fellow passenger

Couldn't disagree with you more! So if I go to a station to buy 2 tickets I have to buy one then rejoin the que?! If you are buying one ticket or one thousand tickets you do it in a single transaction. Not disrespectful at all to others, as long as you have qued up and correctly waited your turn what you ask for once at the window is up to you.

 

[jon0844]

Simple answer is:
Do one card. Join back of queue.
Do next card. Join back of queue.

Takes you a bit longer; but shows a little respect for your fellow passenger

It could take hours! At some stations there might not be enough time in an entire day!

I assume someone going to buy 30 Oyster cards with credit was organising them for a tour or something, and may not have expected to have to plan the purchasing process over many hours.

The issue here is more that there should be some sort of process to sell multiple cards in one transaction. That's just a bit of software to allow the operator to set up nn cards, and then touch each one in (any) order to activate and credit them. A process that might then take a matter of a few minutes.

It's not as if the cards need to be registered there and then, so that can be done by each individual given their card later on.

 

[ScotGG]

I needed to put a railcard voucher on my oyster. No ticket office open. The staff didn't know what to do.

Please tell me they were just badly trained and it's now possible on machines and this wont be standard practice, as closures are coming thick and fast. I'm nowhere near a LO station and nat rail don't do it.

 

[bluegoblin7]

I needed to put a railcard voucher on my oyster. No ticket office open. The staff didn't know what to do.

Please tell me they were just badly trained and it's now possible on machines and this wont be standard practice, as closures are coming thick and fast. I'm nowhere near a LO station and nat rail don't do it.

Not all CSAs currently have access to CSID, the interface on the POMs that allows us to add railcards on to Oyster cards (amongst other things), so it could well be that the ones you asked haven't yet got access, rather than being badly trained. It's not for me to say how this is being handled as I did it as part of my 'core' CSA training at Ashfield House.

However, I would suggest (for now) heading to a larger station - or a central station - as it seems to be more prevalent there than out in the sticks. Or if you're heading through King's Cross one evening track me down and I'll be more than happy to do it for you!

 

[ScotGG]

Cheers. One station I tried was St James's Park which of course is currently (I think it still is?) the HQ of LU, and the staff there couldn't do it!

So it should definitely be possible to add delay repay vouchers to oysters at machines but it just requires staff to log in? At the desk staff normally scan I think - is that possible or will it mean putting in a long number? Still, that would be better than no facility at all.

 

[Hophead]

Cheers. One station I tried was St James's Park which of course is currently (I think it still is?) the HQ of LU, and the staff there couldn't do it!

Done it for me there (last time in November or December). Got to find a time when the ticket office is open, mind.

 

[ScotGG]

That's the problem. What to do when they close?

 

[bluegoblin7]

Cheers. One station I tried was St James's Park which of course is currently (I think it still is?) the HQ of LU, and the staff there couldn't do it!

So it should definitely be possible to add delay repay vouchers to oysters at machines but it just requires staff to log in? At the desk staff normally scan I think - is that possible or will it mean putting in a long number? Still, that would be better than no facility at all.

Ah - no, we can't do delay repay vouchers. Apologies for the misinformation, your last post read as though you meant railcards (16-25, Senior etc.).

I haven't got my notes with me at the moment (they're in my locker at work) but I'll check tomorrow as to how vouchers will be handled as it should be in one of my pamphlets.

 

[ScotGG]

Thanks. Sorry about that it wasn't the clearest post. It's getting harder and harder to use them after NR stations first stopped doing it. Only LU & LO left I think and I very rarely pass LO stations.

 

[bicbasher]

Thanks. Sorry about that it wasn't the clearest post. It's getting harder and harder to use them after NR stations first stopped doing it. Only LU & LO left I think and I very rarely pass LO stations.

The ticket office at London Victoria will do it, along with Balham and East Croydon on Southern. TL stations managed by them in the core such as City Thameslink and St. Pancras along with GN at Essex Road (and possibly Drayton Park).

SWT and Southeastern and soon London Midland at Euston and Watford Junction will remove Oyster facilities at the ticket office.

 

[bluegoblin7]

Thanks. Sorry about that it wasn't the clearest post. It's getting harder and harder to use them after NR stations first stopped doing it. Only LU & LO left I think and I very rarely pass LO stations.

Bad news I'm afraid - there isn't a section specifically for RTVs in my documentation, so there is a little bit of educated guesswork on my part, but it seems that it will only be possible to load RTVs onto Oyster cards at National Rail stations once the ticket offices have closed. A little bit surprised as I thought it would be something that the VICs would be able to do...

 

[ScotGG]

That's ridiculous but I can't say I'm surprised. What chances this will change? Will have to get on to GLA members to chase it up

 

[a729]

That's the problem. What to do when they close?

Virtually all will be closed by December.

The old Silver link ones will survive for the time being as legal obligations stop them from closing them already (e.g Kensal Green)
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---
At the moment those who need to pay with multiple tenders- e.g cash and card- or who want to top up an exact amount by card-e.g £6.40, £2.30- aren't able to do so on an LU ticket machine.

Ironically you can top up any amount you wish -up to £90- by card on National Rail ticket machines with oyster card capabilities! ( Not much use if you're at say Uxbridge!)

 

[rmt4ever]

Anyone else think it's an absolute disgrace that TfL are getting away with this????

Or like most mugs in London, have fallen for the carrot of night trains which are next to useless for most Londoners?

 

[ModernRailways]

Anyone else think it's an absolute disgrace that TfL are getting away with this????

In all honesty, I think it's a good thing. No staff are actually losing their jobs (they're just not getting people to replace those leaving), there just being brought out into the stations. I don't know what use a ticket office has now, a ticket machine can do everything the ticket office can do. It may require a member of staff to carry it out but most ticket machines (all?) can have a back-end system that is only accessible by staff. I know at Tesco our self service machines have a hidden system that means staff could in theory staff the self service machines as they have the same functionality in the staff-only section that normal checkouts have.

Or like most mugs in London, have fallen for the carrot of night trains which are next to useless for most Londoners?

Someone is a 'mug' just because they think something different to you?

Night trains useless for most Londoners? Maybe, we should wait and find out? Everyone I've spoken to is happy about it because they can spend longer in town and not have to worry about getting a night bus or a last tube. In turn, it brings in more money since people will spend more money in town.

 

[RJ]

Anyone else think it's an absolute disgrace that TfL are getting away with this????

Or like most mugs in London, have fallen for the carrot of night trains which are next to useless for most Londoners?

The night economy is growing, I have no doubt that the Tube running will bring worthwhile benefits to London. The only times I've used Tube ticket offices in recent years is to load railcards onto Oyster and topping up with swipe only cards. As a user of the network, I can understand some justification for the changes.

 

[Tetchytyke]

The night economy is growing, I have no doubt that the Tube running will bring worthwhile benefits to London. The only times I've used Tube ticket offices in recent years is to load railcards onto Oyster and topping up with swipe only cards. As a user of the network, I can understand some justification for the changes.

The night tube is going to bring a lot of benefits to London, make no mistake. It's not a gimmick and it is something that should have happened a long time ago.

As for ticket offices, I'm genuinely still in two minds. On the one hand, most people use a ticket office once in a blue moon; between Oyster PAYG and period season tickets, most people don't go near a ticket office. But on the other hand I don't think that conducting complicated transactions on a busy ticket concourse is a brilliant idea, and even if the machines can theoretically do the transactions I think that in practice often people will simply be referred to the 0845 Oyster helpline (not through laziness but because one member of staff can't be sorting out three machine error messages at the same time, as you see with Tesco self checkouts).