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F1 2015

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Darandio

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We have had a thread on previous years, but I couldn't see one for this year, it hasn't been that boring!

Nice to see the Ferrari of Vettel get on top of the Mercedes today, completely unexpected. He also got so excited that he couldn't contain his language once again, it probably won't make the cut for the BBC re-run this afternoon! :lol:

[youtube]5rhINdLc37E[/youtube]
 
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DownSouth

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Getting chased out of Red Bull Racing after a year of humiliation by Ricciardo certainly worked out at the right time for Vettel. We knew last year that Ferrari would be on the up this year, but we didn't know they'd be giving him a race-winning car in only the second race or that Renault's engines would go backwards so badly.
 

GB

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What the *beep* has happened to Mclaren over the last couple of years?<(
 

Searle

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So pleased to see Vettel back on top, will be rooting for him, and Hamilton this year again.

Also it's funny to see Maldonado crashing again to start the new season. Old habits die hard!
 

Peter Mugridge

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One thing I am puzzled about - why did they change the car numbering system? It doesn't seem right that the defending champion doesn't have the number 1 on the car.
 

Tetchytyke

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One thing I am puzzled about - why did they change the car numbering system? It doesn't seem right that the defending champion doesn't have the number 1 on the car.

Each driver chooses a number, which stays with them for their career in F1. The previous year's champion can choose to stay with his personal number or he can choose to run #1. Hamilton chose to stick with #44, presumably he feels it was lucky or something.

Vettel chose #5, as that was the number he had in his first title-winning year (and is coincidentally the number Schumacher had when he won his first title).

GB said:
What the *beep* has happened to Mclaren over the last couple of years?

Last year Mercedes-Benz knew McLaren were moving to Honda and so will almost certainly have been reluctant to give them the best engines, in case Honda got to look at them. I'd eat my hat if they had the same Mercedes-Benz engines that even Williams or Force India had (and I'd doubt the customer engines are the same as the works engines). The car was a dog too.

This year they have a new engine supplier, who are struggling with reliability, partly because of the aggressive aerodynamics of the car. The car is apparently quite good (as you'd expect from the guy who's been designing Red Bulls for years), though not as good as a Mercedes-Benz, but the engine is under-developed.
 
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andrew bell

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It was also good to see 1 Manor Marussia take part, and complete the race, although we didn't see the car at all (FOM deliberately not showing anything with Merhi after missing Melbourne I assume) but they can look at the positives, he beat both McLaren cars as he had finished, 3 laps down.
 

DownSouth

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Last year Mercedes-Benz knew McLaren were moving to Honda and so will almost certainly have been reluctant to give them the best engines, in case Honda got to look at them. I'd eat my hat if they had the same Mercedes-Benz engines that even Williams or Force India had (and I'd doubt the customer engines are the same as the works engines).
Rubbish.

The engine designs are homologated by the FIA, any variation between the works and customer engines would have to be separately homologated and treated as different models each subject to the different development restrictions.

The Williams FW36 was hitting higher top speeds than the Mercedes W05 at most circuits last year, and while they did have aerodynamics optimised for top speed this would not have been possible if they had a downrated engine. Force India were also not too far off Mercedes, which is fairly impressive for a team not generally regarded as being an engineering-led company like Williams. McLaren were well ahead of both Williams and Force India at the start of the year, but their ongoing development was clearly lacking as even Force India was getting the better of them near the end of the year.

What is established in this area is that Mercedes had a head start on packaging their car around the engine, and on learning how to get the best out of them. Williams confirmed these areas were a challenge for them early on with the FW36, but we did see them gradually get closer to Mercedes over the year.
The car was a dog too.
This is more the problem. Ever since Project Four (the Formula 2 team operated by Ron Dennis) bought the rights to the McLaren name and shut down the original team, McLaren has operated on a boom-bust cycle of about 10-12 years long.

I would argue that the Honda deal is more a symptom than a cause, because a look at history would show that whenever things go badly for McLaren the inevitable result is that Ron Dennis will go for a new engine supplier. This even applies to 2005, when Mercedes-Benz took it in house, where they had previously just been putting three-point stars on Ilmor engines for their whole time in F1 since 1993 and for a few years in IndyCar.

The Honda deal may have contributed to their lack of improvement during 2014 - they started out on the race podium in Melbourne and ended with a tough battle to hold onto 5th in the constructors' championship - if certain key engineers were being diverted away from the race team to develop the 2015 McLaren-Honda package.

This year they have a new engine supplier, who are struggling with reliability, partly because of the aggressive aerodynamics of the car. The car is apparently quite good (as you'd expect from the guy who's been designing Red Bulls for years), though not as good as a Mercedes-Benz, but the engine is under-developed.
In addition to the power unit being behind on development, it is also understood that McLaren are deliberately running them on very conservative settings optimised for failure prevention rather than performance, which should see them gradually turn it up over the year. If any of the Mercedes teams ran their engines that conservatively they could be plausible packages to put into Le Mans Prototypes to race for over six hours at a time!

This approach only makes sense if they are banking on Honda making some major developments during this year, and consequently holding off on taking the next power units until those developments become available. I think they should forget that and drive fast to learn the most about the power units as possible, even if it means taking a few grid penalties for new power units and having to race through from the back!

The improved aerodynamics designed by Peter Prodromou are a welcome improvement, but they don't solve the handling problems. This is why they made absolutely the right decision to hire Fernando Alonso, because they will desperately need his supreme skill at over-driving an uncooperative car into battles higher up the order against inferior drivers in superior cars.
 

Tetchytyke

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Rubbish.

The engine designs are homologated by the FIA, any variation between the works and customer engines would have to be separately homologated and treated as different models each subject to the different development restrictions.

Only if the engine hardware is different. I'm sure there are ways of tuning up and down the engines. Although being able to design the car around the engine will help Mercedes, I'm surprised that the Williams aren't closer.

I also seriously doubt Mercedes will have given McLaren everything, and it isn't just me that thinks that. The F1 blogger Joe Saward, who isn't often wrong, said pretty much the same thing.

This approach only makes sense if they are banking on Honda making some major developments during this year, and consequently holding off on taking the next power units until those developments become available. I think they should forget that and drive fast to learn the most about the power units as possible, even if it means taking a few grid penalties for new power units and having to race through from the back!

The improved aerodynamics designed by Peter Prodromou are a welcome improvement, but they don't solve the handling problems. This is why they made absolutely the right decision to hire Fernando Alonso, because they will desperately need his supreme skill at over-driving an uncooperative car into battles higher up the order against inferior drivers in superior cars.

I'd agree about McLaren's problems being more deep-set than just the engine. I think McLaren have always struggled with rules changes, it's often taken them ages to get used to new technology- they couldn't sort out the early-90s "active" cars, they couldn't sort out the changes after Senna (the 1995 McLaren being a brilliant example), the 2009 car was abysmal.

I also don't get why they're not being more aggressive with the engine. I can only assume they're playing the long game, trying to get miles on the car and the engine rather than blowing them all up after four laps. But turning it up and seeing what it can do might well surprise them all.
 

cjmillsnun

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Only if the engine hardware is different. I'm sure there are ways of tuning up and down the engines. Although being able to design the car around the engine will help Mercedes, I'm surprised that the Williams aren't closer.

I also seriously doubt Mercedes will have given McLaren everything, and it isn't just me that thinks that. The F1 blogger Joe Saward, who isn't often wrong, said pretty much the same thing.

Well he IS wrong this time. The only tuning done in the engine is in the maps in the ECUs and they are Homologated and sealed by the FIA. Also guess who manufactures all the ECUs. I'll give you a clue they are based in a town in Surrey that is on the GWML.
I'd agree about McLaren's problems being more deep-set than just the engine. I think McLaren have always struggled with rules changes, it's often taken them ages to get used to new technology- they couldn't sort out the early-90s "active" cars, they couldn't sort out the changes after Senna (the 1995 McLaren being a brilliant example), the 2009 car was abysmal.

I also don't get why they're not being more aggressive with the engine. I can only assume they're playing the long game, trying to get miles on the car and the engine rather than blowing them all up after four laps. But turning it up and seeing what it can do might well surprise them all.

McLaren's problem is that they are sometimes far too up themselves. A visit to the McLaren Technology Centre will prove that.

As far as not being aggressive with the engine goes, it got a reputation for being less reliable than a Renault engine was at the beginning of last year during pre season testing. So yes they want to get some miles in and wind it up slowly presumably at the request of Honda.
 

Clip

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missed yesterdays race but sounded a good one - would watch it but already knowing the result makes it not worth the bother.

What has amused me is R4ed Bull throwing their toys out the pram because they are way off the pace and saying how unfair it all is now that they are not winning.

Boo hoo. Better stick to cliff diving.
 

chris89

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Is incredibly sad news to hear about his death.

The last public release by his Father didn't sound very positive sadly to. Rather large thread about it on Reddit as well within the Formula 1 sub reddit.
 

TheNewNo2

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My first F1 memory is of seeing on the news that Senna had died. I'd really thought we'd come to the end of the time when drivers might die, though I suppose it's never as safe as we'd all hope - there was Henry Surtees who died at Brands Hatch in GP2 a few years back, and of course the horrible accident Maria de Villota suffered, which in retrospect was surpringly similar to the Bianchi crash.

Bianchi was in my mind someone who would be talked about with the likes of Senna, but I didn't expect it to happen in this way.
 

47802

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As a kid growing up in the 70's I always liked F1 but I was uneasy about a sport in which people frequently died or were seriously injured.

I believe the stats are 8 deaths in the Sixties and 9 in the seventies for F1 races but that doesn't take account of the fact that in the Sixties in particular F1 drivers frequently competed in other races, Jim Clarke died in a F2 race and there were less F1 races than today, then of course there were those who suffered very serious injuries like Nicki Lauder.

I remember Jackie Stewart commenting about an accident he had, he was stuck in the car and nobody even had a spanner to hand to get the steering wheel off, I imagine Motorsport in general attitude to safety in those days would be regarded as gross negligence these days, and the film of Roger Williamson accident and subsequent death in the 1973 Dutch GP can only described as shameful

I guess F1 today is probably close to being about as safe as you can get but its still a dangerous sport, Jules accident was extremely unfortunate but clearly lessons can still be learned with regard to safety.
 
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Tetchytyke

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You always get a step forward in safety when something goes wrong, it's the way things change. The HANS device and higher cockpit sides came about as a result of Ratzenberger and Senna's injuries- the HANS would probably have saved Ratzenberger, as Kubica showed in Montreal- and helmet design changed after Massa's crash as well as the death of Henry Surtees. The system of double waved yellows should have been safe, but it wasn't so they've changed it following Bianchi's crash.

Deaths in F1 are shocking rather than the norm now, which is positive, but motorsport will always remain dangerous.

Forza Jules.
 
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Domh245

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Well, kudos to vettel & Ferrari for getting only the second non-mercedes, and first non-mercedes powered pole position of the V6T era. Looks like it will be an interesting race tomorrow!
 
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